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Mad Men (S7E14) -- Series Finale -- "Person to Person" -- 5/17/15

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C
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0
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Mad Men (S7E14) -- Series Finale -- "Person to Person" -- 5/17/15

Old 05-19-15, 12:28 AM
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Re: Mad Men (S7E14) -- Series Finale -- "Person to Person" -- 5/17/15

Originally Posted by Jack Straw View Post
I thought the ambiguity about Donís future was gimmicky, and kind of a "dick" move, I suppose MW attempt to be artsy-fartsy. Would it have been too much to ask for something along the lines of:
 When the ad concludes in the McCann conference room, we see Don from the back, standing tall, receiving the adulation of his peers and the Coke executives (maybe even Peggy and Stan smiling, too), and then the camera pans across his office, his desk in particular, and we see a few picture frames with him and his children, from a vacation in Madrid (following Bettyís funeral), and individual frames of him with Betty and the kids, with Megan, and perhaps with Anna. Something to show us he didnít abandon his only real family. Is that asking for too much?
Good God! I am so glad they didn't do any of that corny shit. It would totally ruin the brilliant smash-cut of Don smiling going to the ad. And it's not the least bit artsy-fartsy, it's just not spelling everything out with fake sentimentality (this show was rarely, if ever, sentimental) - people still figured it out, and it was in just one second. And your cheeseball ending would go against everything they've done up to now. You're looking for closure, but show's never been about closure, it's all about progress. And the ending they went with illustrates that beautifully.
Old 05-19-15, 12:40 AM
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Re: Mad Men (S7E14) -- Series Finale -- "Person to Person" -- 5/17/15

Originally Posted by Numanoid View Post
He didn't fire her for that reason. He was keeping her around in the hopes that Don would return, but as that didn't happen, he couldn't get away with having two secretaries. I'm sure Meredith got her job back once Don came back to nail the Coke ad.
Yes, he actually stated exactly that (other than getting her job back). I don't know where the confusion came from.

My biggest disappointment with the last few episodes was that I didn't really care for Don's journey, other than trying to track down Diana, and seeing Stephanie. Most of the other characters he met just didn't interest me.

Upon further reflection, I would probably upgrade my C+ to a B or B+.

It was mentioned that Ted was the only major character missing from the finale, but Megan wasn't there, either. Bert was missing for obvious reasons.

Even though I found the last few episodes a little sub-par, I'm still going to miss the heck out of this show.
Old 05-19-15, 12:42 AM
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Re: Mad Men (S7E14) -- Series Finale -- "Person to Person" -- 5/17/15

But most of the other characters he met were different versions of himself... So does that mean that Don himself didn't interest you?
Old 05-19-15, 01:02 AM
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Re: Mad Men (S7E14) -- Series Finale -- "Person to Person" -- 5/17/15

Originally Posted by slop101 View Post
Good God! I am so glad they didn't do any of that corny shit. It would totally ruin the brilliant smash-cut of Don smiling going to the ad. And it's not the least bit artsy-fartsy, it's just not spelling everything out with fake sentimentality (this show was rarely, if ever, sentimental) - people still figured it out, and it was in just one second. And your cheeseball ending would go against everything they've done up to now. You're looking for closure, but show's never been about closure, it's all about progress. And the ending they went with illustrates that beautifully.
Well that's like your opinion man. Seriously, why even show the Coke ad to begin with? I'd say that Peggy/Stan storyline wrap-up was pretty sentimental.

Last edited by Jack Straw; 05-19-15 at 01:11 AM.
Old 05-19-15, 01:03 AM
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Re: Mad Men (S7E14) -- Series Finale -- "Person to Person" -- 5/17/15

Originally Posted by Jackskeleton View Post
But most of the other characters he met were different versions of himself... So does that mean that Don himself didn't interest you?
Actually, the one most like Don was the con artist kid. He was actually interesting.
Old 05-19-15, 02:58 AM
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Re: Mad Men (S7E14) -- Series Finale -- "Person to Person" -- 5/17/15

Originally Posted by slop101 View Post
Good God! I am so glad they didn't do any of that corny shit. It would totally ruin the brilliant smash-cut of Don smiling going to the ad. And it's not the least bit artsy-fartsy, it's just not spelling everything out with fake sentimentality (this show was rarely, if ever, sentimental) - people still figured it out, and it was in just one second. And your cheeseball ending would go against everything they've done up to now. You're looking for closure, but show's never been about closure, it's all about progress. And the ending they went with illustrates that beautifully.
Agreed. Tying everything up in a nice little bow is what so many people want from their "programs". Sad, but understandable. It's how network TV worked for decades.
Old 05-19-15, 03:40 AM
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Re: Mad Men (S7E14) -- Series Finale -- "Person to Person" -- 5/17/15

Originally Posted by Jack Straw View Post
I thought the ambiguity about Don’s future was gimmicky, and kind of a "dick" move, I suppose MW attempt to be artsy-fartsy. Would it have been too much to ask for something along the lines of:
 When the ad concludes in the McCann conference room, we see Don from the back, standing tall, receiving the adulation of his peers and the Coke executives (maybe even Peggy and Stan smiling, too), and then the camera pans across his office, his desk in particular, and we see a few picture frames with him and his children, from a vacation in Madrid (following Betty’s funeral), and individual frames of him with Betty and the kids, with Megan, and perhaps with Anna. Something to show us he didn’t abandon his only real family. Is that asking for too much?
Why not throw in the ghosts of Anna, Cooper and Lane looking on in approval, as Don gets called back to the celebration by Sal, who was rehired at Don's request.
Old 05-19-15, 06:20 AM
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Re: Mad Men (S7E14) -- Series Finale -- "Person to Person" -- 5/17/15

Originally Posted by slop101 View Post
Good God! I am so glad they didn't do any of that corny shit. It would totally ruin the brilliant smash-cut of Don smiling going to the ad. And it's not the least bit artsy-fartsy, it's just not spelling everything out with fake sentimentality (this show was rarely, if ever, sentimental) - people still figured it out, and it was in just one second. And your cheeseball ending would go against everything they've done up to now. You're looking for closure, but show's never been about closure, it's all about progress. And the ending they went with illustrates that beautifully.
Now you can't have it both ways because the ending montage of the other main characters goes totally against what you're saying. While Don ending was ambiguous and didn't spell everything out, every other character got a 5 second wink at the audience to where they were headed (Pete/Trudy on a plane, Roger/Meghan's mom in Paris, Stan kissing Peggy, Joan running her own business, and Betty as miserable as ever with Sally.) What would be so different if Don walked into McCann and Don smiles at the partners in a meeting talking about the future Coke account, and then the Coke ad plays......

I still fall somwhere in the middle on Don's ending, as I understand what Weiner was going for with the symbolism, but if I could use a gymnastic term, "He didn't stick the landing." Because it still felt underwhelming.
Old 05-19-15, 08:21 AM
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Re: Mad Men (S7E14) -- Series Finale -- "Person to Person" -- 5/17/15

Originally Posted by andicus View Post
It was mentioned that Ted was the only major character missing from the finale, but Megan wasn't there, either. Bert was missing for obvious reasons.
I didn't mention Megan because her story's been concluded. She's divorced from Don and they share no kids and don't work together, so she has no reason to appear in the finale - her story no longer intersects with anyone.
Ted on the other hand still worked at McCann, so it was odd that we didn't even get to see him for a few seconds like we did with Harry.
Old 05-19-15, 08:30 AM
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Re: Mad Men (S7E14) -- Series Finale -- "Person to Person" -- 5/17/15

Originally Posted by Jack Straw View Post
I love that Roger immediately fired Meredith's for translating his memo into Pig Latin (at his suggestion as a joke).
He didn't fire her for that. He was actually trying to keep her job. He had her helping until Don got back so she wouldn't get fired. Seeing that Don never checked in they finally had to let her go.
Old 05-19-15, 08:35 AM
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Re: Mad Men (S7E14) -- Series Finale -- "Person to Person" -- 5/17/15

Originally Posted by Goat3001 View Post
I think he did the Coke ad but I don't know if I like it yet. There's something great about knowing that Don will go back to being Don. The best Don was when he was crushing it at those meetings. Why fight it?

I agree. I wish they would have showed him come back from his trip and pitch the idea to Coke. Seeing him in action was the best part of the show for me.
Old 05-19-15, 09:27 AM
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Re: Mad Men (S7E14) -- Series Finale -- "Person to Person" -- 5/17/15

Originally Posted by VitiminJ View Post
He didn't fire her for that. He was actually trying to keep her job. He had her helping until Don got back so she wouldn't get fired. Seeing that Don never checked in they finally had to let her go.
I choose to believe it was a bit of both. She was definitely challenged upstairs.
Old 05-19-15, 09:37 AM
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Re: Mad Men (S7E14) -- Series Finale -- "Person to Person" -- 5/17/15

I didn't necessarily love the ending, but reading the suggestions here for alternate endings are making me appreciate the actual one more. Let's just say there's a reason we're all posting on a TV forum and not writing TV shows.
Old 05-19-15, 09:47 AM
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Re: Mad Men (S7E14) -- Series Finale -- "Person to Person" -- 5/17/15

It didn't really work for me. It was fine and I didn't have huge expectations, but some thing really took me out of it. The Peggy thing didn't feel like Mad Men. Also didn't like the final scene. Really jarring throwing that ad on there and I guess it doesn't help that I hate that song.
Old 05-19-15, 09:55 AM
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Re: Mad Men (S7E14) -- Series Finale -- "Person to Person" -- 5/17/15

Originally Posted by slop101 View Post
Good God! I am so glad they didn't do any of that corny shit. It would totally ruin the brilliant smash-cut of Don smiling going to the ad. And it's not the least bit artsy-fartsy, it's just not spelling everything out with fake sentimentality (this show was rarely, if ever, sentimental) - people still figured it out, and it was in just one second. And your cheeseball ending would go against everything they've done up to now. You're looking for closure, but show's never been about closure, it's all about progress. And the ending they went with illustrates that beautifully.
I like this ending better. And the Peggy-Stan thing was extremely corny and took me out of the show. I don't think that 'smash cut' was brilliant. It was jarring and screwed it up for me. When I saw him start to smile I thought that was it, he found some happiness, and it would fade to black. Would have been more pleasant to me at least.

You talk about being corny and sentimentality, but that episode had plenty of both even near the end of it. I expected a low-key, "just like another Mad Men episode" feel. It didn't even feel like a Mad Men episode to me though. Having Don in the office with something to do with the Coke ad wouldn't have been any more corny or sentimental than the rest of the episode, and might have worked better than the ending it has, which doesn't work IMO.
Old 05-19-15, 10:02 AM
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Re: Mad Men (S7E14) -- Series Finale -- "Person to Person" -- 5/17/15

I think my favorite part was Pete. He was always such a jerk, but he grew up, learned from him mistakes, and got a chance to redeem himself and start over. Yeah, he got to become even more filthy rich (which tends to make starting over a little easier I'd imagine), but he actually seemed to change and to want a better life.
Old 05-19-15, 10:05 AM
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Re: Mad Men (S7E14) -- Series Finale -- "Person to Person" -- 5/17/15

Originally Posted by Decker View Post
There is no more nowadays. The last President on Mount Rushmore (Sopranos, The Wire, Breaking Bad, Mad Men) just died.
Vic Mackey sheds a tear. It's a shame that The Shield is often overlooked in a lot of discussions about the resurgence of high quality TV. I'd put it right up there with all of those shows. (And it had the most satisfying series finale, IMO. Note: I haven't seen The Wire yet.)

But I largely agree with your point. The big shows that ushered in this era are all done now. Though there are still some great dramas still on, like the aforementioned Better Call Saul and Game of Thrones.
Old 05-19-15, 10:08 AM
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Re: Mad Men (S7E14) -- Series Finale -- "Person to Person" -- 5/17/15

Originally Posted by WallyOPD View Post
I didn't necessarily love the ending, but reading the suggestions here for alternate endings are making me appreciate the actual one more. Let's just say there's a reason we're all posting on a TV forum and not writing TV shows.
It's funny you mentioned this because I saw a blog about Series Finale endings, and how they are essentially the opposite of the normal writing process and that is why so many creators fail at them or atleast fail to please many in the audience.

Most writers write linear stories week to week and the only pressure to please the fans are season finales. But you can do whatever you want with a season finale because it leaves the door open for any storyline the next season.

The Series Finales are true closure and are supposed to tie up all or most storylines of characters and writers are not really used to doing this (Its one thing to write a linear story, but writing a true ending is a whole different ballgame). Plus the fact that pressure and hype of Series Finales have gotten so big that you are bound to disappoint. David Chase is still bitter at many fans for hating his ending of The Soprano's and is very ungracious towards the fanbase these days much like George Lucas whenever he does interviews. Hopefully Weiner never gets to that point.

In the end I was let down by the ending but I have learned from the past not to expect a 'Newhart' type great ending, because usually its the opposite. It didn't taint the show like The Soprano's ending did for me, so I think Weiner did a good enough job that he didn't alienate a large part of the fanbase.
Old 05-19-15, 10:17 AM
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Re: Mad Men (S7E14) -- Series Finale -- "Person to Person" -- 5/17/15

I do concede that the Peggy/Stan thing was a bit corny - the only thing making it not as bad as the typical Rom-Com was the writing and acting, which is what helped me swallow it.
Old 05-19-15, 10:55 AM
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Re: Mad Men (S7E14) -- Series Finale -- "Person to Person" -- 5/17/15

I also thought the smile meant he was on the path to achieving some sort of inner peace and contentment. The cut to the Coke jingle and a return to advertising seemed incongruent and illogical to what had preceeded it, particularly after he was retired (or so he stated), set for life financially and had seemingly left that part of his life behind. Then having no further story or scenes to support that change of heart and mind seemed like they were just fucking with the audience's head and as I said before felt gimmicky to keep everyone guessing. As others have said, we were provided some sort of resolution and closure for the other main characters. Why not for the most important one?

Last edited by Jack Straw; 05-19-15 at 11:46 AM.
Old 05-19-15, 10:59 AM
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Re: Mad Men (S7E14) -- Series Finale -- "Person to Person" -- 5/17/15

Interview with Jon Hamm and his take on the ending:

http://artsbeat.blogs.nytimes.com/20...773522000&_r=0

This is an excerpt:

Question:. Do you have an interpretation of the ending?

Jon Hamm: I do. When we find Don in that place, and this stranger relates this story of not being heard or seen or understood or appreciated, the resonance for Don was total in that moment. There was a void staring at him. We see him in an incredibly vulnerable place, surrounded by strangers, and he reaches out to the only person he can at that moment, and it’s this stranger.

My take is that, the next day, he wakes up in this beautiful place, and has this serene moment of understanding, and realizes who he is. And who he is, is an advertising man. And so, this thing comes to him. There’s a way to see it in a completely cynical way, and say, “Wow, that’s awful.” But I think that for Don, it represents some kind of understanding and comfort in this incredibly unquiet, uncomfortable life that he has led. There was a little bit of a crumb dropped earlier in the season when Ted says there are three women in every man’s life, and Don says, “You’ve been sitting on that for a while, huh?” There are, not coincidentally, three person to person phone calls that Don makes in this episode, to three women who are important to him for different reasons. You see the slow degeneration of his relationships with those women over the course of those phone calls.
Old 05-19-15, 11:01 AM
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Re: Mad Men (S7E14) -- Series Finale -- "Person to Person" -- 5/17/15

I took that smile to mean that he no longer gave a fuck what people really thought of him, that he was at peace/happy with what/who he is, good or bad.
Old 05-19-15, 11:04 AM
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Re: Mad Men (S7E14) -- Series Finale -- "Person to Person" -- 5/17/15

Originally Posted by DJLinus View Post
Vic Mackey sheds a tear. It's a shame that The Shield is often overlooked in a lot of discussions about the resurgence of high quality TV. I'd put it right up there with all of those shows. (And it had the most satisfying series finale, IMO. Note: I haven't seen The Wire yet.)

But I largely agree with your point. The big shows that ushered in this era are all done now. Though there are still some great dramas still on, like the aforementioned Better Call Saul and Game of Thrones.
Agreed. Mad Men is the last to go of the shows that ushered in the Golden Age of TV (of which The Shield should absolutely be included).

IMO, we are quite well situated in the Silver Age of TV right now. Sure there are a few shows that deserve high critical praise, but due to the sheer quantity of content for consumption, the dynamic has indeed shifted.
Old 05-19-15, 12:30 PM
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Re: Mad Men (S7E14) -- Series Finale -- "Person to Person" -- 5/17/15

Here's an interesting take on the finale.

http://m.hitfix.com/whats-alan-watch...e-world-a-coke
Old 05-19-15, 01:05 PM
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Re: Mad Men (S7E14) -- Series Finale -- "Person to Person" -- 5/17/15

Originally Posted by DJLinus View Post
Vic Mackey sheds a tear. It's a shame that The Shield is often overlooked in a lot of discussions about the resurgence of high quality TV. I'd put it right up there with all of those shows. (And it had the most satisfying series finale, IMO. Note: I haven't seen The Wire yet.)
The thing with Shield is that, while it started out good, it didn't get great until about halfway through. The first few seasons kinda tread water, going over the same ground, over and over, frankly getting so redundant that I almost dropped the show. Then they finally realized half way through that they need to be less episodic and more serialized, which is what kicked the show into high gear.

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