Coral

It's shit to think that people as important to SC&P as Pete and especially Don are, have only a little bit more stake in the company than Joan does - a glorified office manager who fucked one client once.

BearFan

Now Joan can afford a boob job. Good deal!

Decker

I wonder what happened to Lane's share. I assume the other partners at SCD&P bought out his shares before the merger with Ted, but I don't recall.


She got the partnership at the suggestion/urging of Lane -- so he could keep his much-needed Christmas bonus (or so he thought)

MikahC

Conversely, I think all the guys would agree that, "Fair's got nothing to do with it." Every one of them would be willing to live by the credo, "You get what you can get, and whatever that is, is fair."

Joan got her 5% because everyone calculated that giving up (say) 1% of a much bigger company was worth it (financially). Joan held the keys to making the company much bigger. She bartered with what she brought to the table. Honestly, I think most guys would have much less of a problem with it if a guy bartered his way into a similar situation. It happens all the time. It's just usually not with sex when a guy is involved. Maybe it's your father in law and Clearasil.

I actually spent a bit of time thinking about this since the most recent episode aired. Like many, I found Joan's storyline somehow distasteful on a personal level. But on a business level, I'm forced to admit my bias. Slut Shaming is alive and well even in 2014. Either way, I'm not a fan of her forgetting how personally supportive Don has been to her at her weak points. But that's just business too, and people tend to forget quickly when money's involved.

bluetoast

The article said that he's writing it now, and it will film in a few weeks; For sure a lot of the elements has been in his head or written down for years, or more recent developments (like the Roger thing you mentioned), but it's pretty cool that it's not truly over yet for the cast and crew.

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/liv...r-talks-707107

majorjoe23

Didn't Ted buy the shares of their former art director who died of cancer or something?

bluetoast

Also like Roger said, they don't get all the money up front. It's 25% upon signing, and presumably they won't get the full 100% until they fulfill their contracts. Still, that's a ton of dough.

Jimmy James

There's also the fact that Don unilaterally threw what she gave up a lot for in the toilet. And then GM proved to be a fucking illusion (or whateverthefuck Buick is).

I have to say I think the show is back in form. I am really fucking pissed that we are waiting on the last half now. I hope the new show is decent next week.

mphtrilogy

I don't think that merger goes through, much more interesting to see the fall out if it doesn't.

Good first half of the season.. sorry to see it stop right now.

Decker

What's interesting is since it's not a season finale, we won't get a jump-forward in time next year (for the first time in the show's run).
One of the most interesting and under-appreciated things about this show is that it kind of moves in real time. We've taken almost a decade to watch these characters move forward a decade. That's something that's actually pretty rare.

starseed1981

Excellent mid-season finale. What happened to Harry Crane was just hysterical and Bert got pretty much the best send off ever.

bunkaroo

Have they explicitly said there won't be a jump forward? That could be one reason they split it - to do a jump forward.

BearFan

That is what I was thinking, I would not be surprised to see part 2 of the season start in 1970

Decker

No they haven't, but it's seemed obvious for years that since the show started with Jan 1960, it would end with the end of the decade. To me that's been as obvious as Lost closing with the shutting of Matthew Fox's eye.

Nefarious

I think the show has done a pretty good job overall. I don't think Joan has forgotten that Don wasn't in favor of it. I think people are incorrectly assuming that if Joan had known in advance, she would have done things differently. I don't know that that's the case. She may very well have still slept with that Jaguar exec simply for the chance at the financial security. I think she did appreciate that not everyone was in favor of whoring her out.

Despite Don's bright moment for her there, he has on two occasions since acted against her interest. First with the IPO and then his shitting the bed with Hershey. He's, up to this point, made her shares worth no more than the paper they are written on. She's understandably upset by this.

If you look at who is upset with Don (for valid or not reasons), she at least has a semi-valid point. Peggy & Cutler both want to lay all of Ted's problems and issues at Don's feet. Don may have played a role in some of Ted's self destruction but he pretty clearly advised Ted against messing around with Peggy and then turned around and gave up going to LA so Ted could. Neither Peggy nor Cutler is aware of these points, that we've been shown anyway. So they have the least justifiable reasons to remain pissy at Don. Cutler has explicitly said he hates Don for what he did to Ted.

Burt was never aware that Don did not sign that bonus check to Lane. He took umbrage to what he believed to be Don acting alone. Don, for his part, did not soil Lane's character and fell on the sword.

Roger & Pete are the ones who are supporting Don the most. Pete likely has not forgotten that Don put up for Pete's share of additional capital when things got dicey with SCDP. Roger and Don have had their ups and downs and made their peace and genuinely like each other. I don't think Roger agrees with everything Don says and does, as he's stated to the other partners, but he realizes he's an asset you'd rather have on your team than against your team.

Red Dog

I couldn't remember if he bought them all or Cutler bought some.

BearFan

That was a nice summary. I think in part with Bert, he was trying to groom Don to be another Bert (sitting on some board of directors, etc) and might have felt let down by Don

Jimmy James

If that holds, the opening episode of 2015 should be the one where we get Sharon Tate's murder, whatever treatment we may end up getting there. I think that would put Woodstock maybe the second episode. In fact, it would be very possible that those two would be handled the very same episode.

The moon landing was July 20.

Sharon Tate died August 9.

Woodstock was August 15.

The only other really big event I see in 1969 coming into play would be the Miracle Mets winning the World Series.

Actually, it looks like the 747 made its maiden flight in December. Given the air travel love on this show maybe that gets folded in.

I think Altamont isn't quite big enough and is on the wrong coast to get play.

MikahC

A lot of good points in there Nefarious (I didn't quote them). Just a few "counterpoint" comments...

I'm assuming that most women would feel better about whoring themselves out than others doing it on their behalf, especially the father of their child. Joan had a long-term intimate relationship with Roger and was there for him through untold numbers of flameouts. Her reward? "Hey, could you sleep with this client?"

Not, "She may have..." She did. Nobody made her do it. But they certainly were all in favor of it. Still, the choice was hers.

Don's had more than that one bright moment regarding Joan, but on a personal level, that was a pretty significant one. As for Don acting against her interests, that happens all the time. People are selfish and sometimes self destructive. Has Roger never acted against Joan's interests? In my mind, people I do business with cost me money on a daily basis if I choose to look at it that way. But I'm a glass half full kind of guy, so I'll be happy over turning $1 into $2 instead of fretting that it didn't turn into $3.

Don has injured Joan, no doubt. But if there were no Don, the firm might not be what it became and without that, where would Joan be?

I'll put it another way. Say Microsoft has all these millionaire secretaries. Say Bill Gates makes the (not all that great) decision to release Microsoft Bob (circa 1995) and their shares take a dip. That affects the Secretaries. But do you think they look down their noses at Sir Gates, or do they realize that while their million in stock may now be worth $900k instead, without Gates, they likely wouldn't have the $900k at all -- certainly not for being secretaries.

Joan's shares are hardly worthless, even without a buyout.

I'm still percolating, but on some gut level, Joan's actions aren't sitting well with me. She's in a position to know exactly what Don has contributed to the firm over the years.

I'm glad Peggy and Don have mended fences (at least somewhat).

Nefarious

She wasn't forced but she was incentivized. Not like she did it with no potential upside.

Her shares have potential value at this point. Nothing more. The difference between them and your Microsoft example is that the MS shares were publicly traded and there were assets way beyond and little to no debt. As Roger mentioned, the company wouldn't be profitable until 197x. Don cost her real money with the IPO loss. It was made very clear that she did what she did for a chance at financial security. Whether Don makes it more probable or not doesn't matter as much as the fact that he for sure killed the IPO bird in hand. If SC&P lost enough clients it could fold with more debts than assets and her shares would be worthless. As Joan stated, she's tired of him costing her money. She's a single mother nearing 40. She isn't salaried on the high level of these other execs and has never received any major windfall like Don did when Putnam & Powell purchased SC.

So Don was nice to her at the hospital when she took care of lawn mowered man. He took her for a fun spin in the Jaguar. He told her she didn't have to sleep with the Jaguar guy.

I think she'd have traded all those bright moments for the large chunk of cash the IPO would have brought. Notice how she didn't object at all to the McCann deal or them demanding that Don be part of it. It is all about the money.

redsea

I didn't recognize Kellie Martin either.

This episode felt like a season finale, or even a show finale.

dstrauss

Neither did I. Was one of my huge crushes when I was a teenager. I had to go back and watch that scene a few minutes ago when someone mentioned it was her.

WCChiCubsFan

If that were true everyone's shares would also only have potential value and yet they made a big point a few episodes back that if they were to fire Don the buying out of his share would cripple the company for years.

Obviously the shares have value NOW even without the merger.

Jimmy James

They have an unrealized value. The point is that they have to be realized some way. We have seen that Don's would be realized if Don were fired, and I seem to recall something about Lane's being realized by the need to pay his estate at the point of his death.

There is probably little Joan can do against the will of the others to make them pay her anything for her stake, and I think the bigger issue is that the value wouldn't be as great as if they went public or got bought out.

Nefarious

There is no specific value to them. As Roger said when talking about the McCann offer, he threw out to Joan a "hypothetical" valuation....because they haven't had a valuation.

Am I watching the same show? Joan has consistently stressed about money and lack of financial security. She has shares but she doesn't have a lot of power and she knows it. If she said, "Buy my 5% right now and cash me out," they would all either scoff at her or shoot her a figure so freaking low it wouldn't be in her interest to sell the shares. She's hopeful they become valuable but most of that value is potential at this point -- and she knows this.

Don has considerably more shares and enough existing financial resources to legally challenge them and get a fair price.

ETA: Just rewatched the episode and when Roger goes into Bert's office to talk and refers to her as "Benedict Joan", Bert points out that Don cost her a million dollars when he blew up the IPO. Who wouldn't be pissed at him from a business perspective?