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-   -   Fringe -- Season Finale -- "The Day We Died" -- 5/06/11 (https://forum.dvdtalk.com/tv-talk/590468-fringe-season-finale-day-we-died-5-06-11-a.html)

superfro 05-06-11 11:04 PM

Re: Fringe -- Season Finale -- "The Day We Died" -- 5/06/11
 

Originally Posted by Moopher (Post 10760536)
How awesome that Walter wormholed that shit!

rotfl rotfl

This was awesome. LOL WTF @ that last 5 minutes!

My only problem with the episode is the fact that 15 years in the future Olivia/Peter would be pushing 50 right? Finally time to have those kids? :lol: It seems like they went to no work to age anybody, which is a bummer since they've always done such a good job in making sure Walter looked so much younger in the flashbacks.

Josh-da-man 05-06-11 11:59 PM

Re: Fringe -- Season Finale -- "The Day We Died" -- 5/06/11
 
Good overall episode, and it could almost work as a series finale if it had to. Wonder if they had that in mind when they were writing it...

Though I am little put off by the revelation that the "First People" was just Walter sending the machine back in time. Aside from being anticlimactic, that felt like a really awkward reveal where they just throw that in to close off that plot thread. (Further proof that this could have been the series finale?)

I'll have to rewatch the episode, but that sort of presents a paradox, doesn't it? Who created the machine in the first place? We saw it being found and assembled by Walter, then, in the future, he's going to send it back in time millions of years so they can find it. If so, then the machine exists in a time loom. Someone had to build it.

And it also presents another paradox. If Peter never existed (did he somehow retroactively wipe himself out through time travel? Was he created by the Observers? Did Walter create him for this purpose?) then Walter would never have breached the other universe and they wouldn't have the problem that requires amber plugs.

Draven 05-07-11 12:43 AM

Re: Fringe -- Season Finale -- "The Day We Died" -- 5/06/11
 

Originally Posted by Josh-da-man (Post 10760212)
Seemed like they were setting up Ella to discover the Olivia/Fauxlivia switheroo at the end of the second season.

Nice to see her back in this ep.

Loved it. Knew something was going to happen to Olivia but damn that headshot was cooooold. Can't wait for next season.

Raul3 05-07-11 12:52 AM

Re: Fringe -- Season Finale -- "The Day We Died" -- 5/06/11
 
Big WTF finale. I also thought that they wrote this thinking that it could work as a series finale.

I don't react too much to show, screaming, yelling or just talking to the tv, but I had to look at my wife and say wow!, when they killed Olivia.

Raul3 05-07-11 12:58 AM

Re: Fringe -- Season Finale -- "The Day We Died" -- 5/06/11
 
So talking in Back to the future timelines, there's this original timeline where Walter goes and gets Peter from the alternate universe, later they activate the machine and destroy the other universe. Years later Walternate kills Olivia, and that's when they send the machine back in time. Walter will keep doing the same, but Peter may change stuff (?)

Also, in a previous episode Olivia said "that's the guy who is going to kill me" or something like that. I wonder about that now

discostu1337 05-07-11 02:34 AM

Re: Fringe -- Season Finale -- "The Day We Died" -- 5/06/11
 

Originally Posted by Raul3 (Post 10760706)

Also, in a previous episode Olivia said "that's the guy who is going to kill me" or something like that. I wonder about that now

She isn't dead, none of the stuff in the episode is going to happen. She can still be killed by random cartoon guy :)

DJariya 05-07-11 03:55 AM

Re: Fringe -- Season Finale -- "The Day We Died" -- 5/06/11
 
I didn't love it, but I thought it was a very good and non-traditional season finale. It was a little hard to follow in some parts. The last 10 minutes or so were indeed WTF??

:thumbsup: I have to admit the last scene with Walternate and Walter glaring at each other's eyes was amazing.

-eek- And future Walternate taking out future Olivia with the headshot was so fucking evil. I read about the supposed "death" in the finale and I thought they handled that well without unecessarily killing someone off.

So Peter has apparently served his purpose to bring the 2 worlds together to fix this problem and doesn't exist now, I guess we're going to have a multi-episode arc with no Joshua Jackson next season. I can see alot of non-harcore Fringe viewers not really understanding what happened in this episode. I'm glad I'm not a writer on Fringe because honestly I wouldn't know where to start creating the season 4 arc. Those guys do 1 hell of a job.

I'm going to be an interesting summer seeing what transpires with the show creatively.

DJariya 05-07-11 04:13 AM

Re: Fringe -- Season Finale -- "The Day We Died" -- 5/06/11
 
This is from TVLine.com's recap from tonight's episode:



After glimpsing an instant of disorientation, we realize we are observing Peter as he exists in the year 2026, complete with memories of what he made wife (!) Olivia that morning for breakfast. The recovery of a “light bomb” used by a terrorist named Moreau sets in motion a chain of events in which Walter — now “the most reviled” man on the globe, as the deliverer of doomsday — deduces that it is he who will design the Machine and send it into the very distant past via the Central Park wormhole. He hypothesizes that if he can bring Peter’s 2011 consciousness “forward” in time long enough to realize that he must make another choice once in the Machine, both worlds can be saved. Alas, though Walter is spot-on in his assessment, it appears there are in fact “repercussions” to this correction, when Peter fades away from his 2011 existence, never to be remembered.
^^ I'm not sure I get what the highlighted portion means. Was it future Walter that made that hypothesis? And was sending Peter back to 2011 with that knowledge ultimately the reason that lead to him disappearing?

I've already developed a migraine reading a few recaps trying to fully understand the turn of events.

rw2516 05-07-11 04:32 AM

Re: Fringe -- Season Finale -- "The Day We Died" -- 5/06/11
 
I'm wondering if in the current timeline Peter was never born.
There must be a bigger threat further into the future. Maybe in the original timeline none of the first three seasons happened. So, sometime in the future there is this big threat. In order to prevent this threat the observers go back in time causing the Peters to be born, leading to all the conflict between universes(which never happened the first time around) all in their ultimate goal to get to this point. The observers needed to bring the two Walters and maybe both Olivia's, at least our Olivia, together in order to stop some big future threat we haven't been told yet.

Once the observers set their plan in place they began observing/monitoring history in order to ensure that any event didn't prevent their plan from working.
Ex: An observer at Pearl Harbor on 12/7/41 would immediately compute the effect on the future to see if the timeline they needed was still intact. They would only interfere if something would throw the timeline out of whack, say Walter's great grandfather falling off a horse and breaking his neck or something.

ultimaton 05-07-11 05:48 AM

Re: Fringe -- Season Finale -- "The Day We Died" -- 5/06/11
 
I think it'll be interesting to see how Peter's initial failed attempt to interface with the machine plays into this. I thought that during Peter's fugue state episode after the initial contact, he was acting how you'd expect him to act if he'd been raised "over there" -- for example, seeking out his father in the Statue of Liberty -- and it was very similar to how he reacted when his consciousness was pulled into the future.

I guess what I'm getting at is: is it possible that whatever mechanism "erased" Peter actually just made it so he was never brought "over here"? That would certainly mean that Peter no longer existed as we knew him, but is still around in some fashion (and I don't remember the exact dialog, so maybe it explicitly contradicts this idea). It'd be an interesting way reintroduce the character, especially if he's got the memories of the way things were, and the potential danger they face, buried deep inside his mind from (inadvertently?) piggy-backing on the original Peter's during his two uses of the machine.

Hopefully this post makes some sense, I'm pretty tired...

ATX 05-07-11 06:57 AM

Re: Fringe -- Season Finale -- "The Day We Died" -- 5/06/11
 
yeah i gotta assume Peter not existing has to do with the old butterfly effect


the shit about the machine makes sense, only reason you would have a technologically advanced machine with a pic of peter/olivia so far back in the past is if you sent it back in time

and walter 'narrarated' what was taking place, explaining about Peters conciousness being able to move through time, how peter could change things, how it could have already happened ...yada yada

Flave 05-07-11 10:52 AM

Re: Fringe -- Season Finale -- "The Day We Died" -- 5/06/11
 

Originally Posted by Josh-da-man (Post 10760662)
Though I am little put off by the revelation that the "First People" was just Walter sending the machine back in time. Aside from being anticlimactic, that felt like a really awkward reveal where they just throw that in to close off that plot thread. (Further proof that this could have been the series finale?)

I'll have to rewatch the episode, but that sort of presents a paradox, doesn't it? Who created the machine in the first place? We saw it being found and assembled by Walter, then, in the future, he's going to send it back in time millions of years so they can find it. If so, then the machine exists in a time loom. Someone had to build it.

And it also presents another paradox. If Peter never existed (did he somehow retroactively wipe himself out through time travel? Was he created by the Observers? Did Walter create him for this purpose?) then Walter would never have breached the other universe and they wouldn't have the problem that requires amber plugs.

+1

And THIS is why I utterly despise the idea of using time travel as a plot device. In the vast majority of cases, if you think about the causal loops that time travel creates, the paradoxes pile up until the whole thing crumbles like a house of cards. And you have a headache to boot. Abrams obviously has a real hard-on for time travel (I think it's been used in every single one of his genre TV series) but methinks he has to find new material.

WhyTF does Peter have to disappear? Even within the time travel paradoxes, this doesn't make any sense. And if he does have to disappear, he would have disappeared when he made the decision to create this "junction" between universes, not in mid-sentence. Again, WTF? Unless it's some stupid "balance the universes" thing where both Peters have to be gone. (Does that mean he's off the show next year? Is the actor signed for the 4th season?) Maybe the Observers just want him gone for one of their obscure inscrutable reasons. And note that he doesn't just disappear -- he never even existed in this new timeline. But if he never existed, Walter would never have opened up the gateway, these problems would never have arisen, and so how do we arrive here with two Walters and two Olivias and two connected universes? And if anyone throws the "Whatever happened, happened" Lost bullshit at me, I will personally hunt you down and eat your liver.

They got some serious 'splainin to do next season.

[Edit] Looks like I'm not the only one asking questions about Peter. According to the producers (I won't spoilerize as I don't think there are any spoilers here):


So where does this leave star Joshua Jackson? Obviously the guy is a pretty integral part of the show. But has he indeed served his purpose, according to the storyline? Probably most importantly for most fans: Will we see him again?

"He’s got a job. He's still under contract," confirmed J.H. Wyman, inducing a wave of sighs amongst Peter fans everywhere. Talking to TVLine, the Fringe executive producer seemed sure about Jackson's future with the show. "We can’t yet reveal what exactly we have in store for him, but he’s definitely not going out for other shows."

But, if you're wanting answers before September's season 4 premiere, sorry. "The less spoilerage, the better," Wyman says regarding the mass of fan questions. "The reason to come back and watch is exactly for the questions you’re asking."

MikahC 05-07-11 10:59 AM

Re: Fringe -- Season Finale -- "The Day We Died" -- 5/06/11
 
They can 'splain, but will we get it? I'm thinking we'll either try to understand, and be disappointed, or (my option), say, "Oh," and move on. With that prediction, I'm going ahead and saying, "Oh," now and saving myself the summer of anticipation. I may officially hate time travel.

ATX 05-07-11 01:19 PM

Re: Fringe -- Season Finale -- "The Day We Died" -- 5/06/11
 
wait a minute [email protected]#$

ok, so when Peter told them to work together then dissapeared, why are they in the same situation... both in the same world with the alts and with the machine...

lemme see if someone youtubed the final 10, cuz something isnt right

them boys better brainstorm hard during the offseason for season 4

Gunde 05-07-11 01:19 PM

Re: Fringe -- Season Finale -- "The Day We Died" -- 5/06/11
 

Originally Posted by Josh-da-man (Post 10760662)
Though I am little put off by the revelation that the "First People" was just Walter sending the machine back in time. Aside from being anticlimactic, that felt like a really awkward reveal where they just throw that in to close off that plot thread. (Further proof that this could have been the series finale?)

I'm convinced there's more to this than we've been told so far. Peter might think they were the "First People" but that doesn't mean it's true. There's still a lot we don't know about Sam Weiss and his family

DJariya 05-07-11 01:24 PM

Re: Fringe -- Season Finale -- "The Day We Died" -- 5/06/11
 

Originally Posted by Raul3 (Post 10760698)
Big WTF finale. I also thought that they wrote this thinking that it could work as a series finale.

They didn't start production on this episode until after the renewal annoucement, so No this episode definitely could not have served as a Series Finale. There was way too many unanswered questions, especially the Peter situation.

ATX 05-07-11 01:32 PM

Re: Fringe -- Season Finale -- "The Day We Died" -- 5/06/11
 
@ Gunde

my thought was that maybe someone named Weiss from the future took the machine back (Kyle Reese style)

during Peters ramble he said something about maybe Astrid or Elle or somebody took the machine back



Originally Posted by ATX (Post 10691124)
eventually all shows from now on will introduce some element of time travel :D


Gunde 05-07-11 01:35 PM

Re: Fringe -- Season Finale -- "The Day We Died" -- 5/06/11
 

Originally Posted by Flave (Post 10760918)
Wall of text

I don't think "normal" time travel paradoxes apply to this show. What if Peter is now in a whole new universe, created because of the time-altering in this one?
I don't know - my head hurts.

I'm gonna stop thinking about it and hope the writers know what they are doing. If they "pull a Lost" I will quit watching TV altogether!

Raul3 05-07-11 01:35 PM

Re: Fringe -- Season Finale -- "The Day We Died" -- 5/06/11
 
Don't blame JJ Abrahams, right now he has the same involvement he had in most of Lost.

But yeah, if you want to apply science or reason, this won't work. Basically you have to listen to the rules they set and try to follow. Again, like in Back to the Future, there a lot of websites that destroy the movies, but they set their own rules with pseudo-science, and try to follow them. As most of us can agree that worked really well for them.

I hope for something similar here, and not just Walter saying this is paradox but we are doing this...

Raul3 05-07-11 01:41 PM

Re: Fringe -- Season Finale -- "The Day We Died" -- 5/06/11
 

Originally Posted by DJariya (Post 10761032)
They didn't start production on this episode until after the renewal annoucement, so No this episode definitely could not have served as a Series Finale. There was way too many unanswered questions, especially the Peter situation.

They may have started filming it after that, but I'm sure they already had most of the episode written by then, and since they had a big risk of cancellation, thinking about the viewers, it was written like that(series finale). I'm sure someone will ask the producers.

Shazam 05-07-11 03:09 PM

Re: Fringe -- Season Finale -- "The Day We Died" -- 5/06/11
 
Whoa.

Deftones 05-07-11 05:07 PM

Re: Fringe -- Season Finale -- "The Day We Died" -- 5/06/11
 
I'm confused as hell by what just happened, but it was a fun ride getting there.

Boba Fett 05-07-11 05:32 PM

Re: Fringe -- Season Finale -- "The Day We Died" -- 5/06/11
 
It was a great episode, but I thought the last 5-10 minutes were rushed and sloppy. It didn't have the zing of the previous two finales, with last year's still being the best.

redrum 05-07-11 08:03 PM

Re: Fringe -- Season Finale -- "The Day We Died" -- 5/06/11
 
mind blown

ravan 05-08-11 01:13 AM

Re: Fringe -- Season Finale -- "The Day We Died" -- 5/06/11
 
waaaaaaaa...?


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