vhunter

i missed some of the episodes,want to see them.

Gunde

Nothing wrong with that.
If this entire season had just been one big checklist crossing you'd bitch too.

JZ1276

Right on and I'm sure all those major questions will be answered in those final episodes.
Are you a hostile dude because I notice you like to turn normal discussions into arguments a lot.

JZ1276

Nope, dont think I would.

JZ1276

Yeah thats me. Depending on the remaining episodes I think it could definitely be ruined.

Philip Reuben

Not really. Given the facts "Ben appeared to be able to control the smoke monster" and "the smoke monster was actually manipulating Ben", and the facts "the Others stole children" and "the Others were unable to reproduce", they're answers so blatant that they actually write themselves.

Or would you prefer them to spend an entire episode on every insignificant checklist point so everyone can bitch about how they're being spoonfed overly simplistic answers and they didn't care who Adam and Eve were after all?

thebunk

You are assuming a lot though. An assumption from another fellow watcher does not equal an answer from the producers. I honestly do not think that when Ben "called the smoke monster to defend the compound" that the producers knew what the smoke monster was yet. Hell, it had been rumored as the security system for how long?!

Regarding the answers we are being spoonfed, you are right. They are just that. Lazy answers:

Answer #1

"Whispers"
Michael: Sup Hurley. I'm dead but you can see me.
Hurley: Wait, so those whispers are of dead people? People whose spirits are still stuck here?!
Michael: Duh!!!

(forget all of the times in the first 3 to 4 seasons that whenever you heard the whispers of dead people, the Others would show up, but whatever).

Answer #2

Flocke: Hey Jack, can we talk.
Jack: Sure. Sup? And why are you imitating John Locke? I know he is a bad mother fucker, but why him?
Flocke: Because (tada) I can look like dead people.
Jack: Waitasecond. Were you the one that was prancing through the jungle looking like my dad?!!
Flocke: (smiles). Yup. Cool trick, huh?

(does not explain Kate's horse, walt dripping in blood on the island and all of the visions off of the island, but heh, minor quibbles, right?!)

Answer #3

Jacob: Hi "brother"
MIB kid version: Hey Jacob. Man I wish I had a name.

Michael Corvin

I believe that's all we really want. The point of contention lies within how things have been handled this season.

I don't mind leaving most of the things mentioned in this thread a mystery, but when something happens on the show that treads on answering one of those mysteries and they purposely play dumb, it's just an insult.

After drinking the Kool-Aid for 5 years, watching all those seasons multiple times each, I've been fairly critical of this season. Ab Aeterno has been the only satisfying episode all season. It answered some mysteries in a satisfying way and still retained all the great character development the show has maintained over the years. Everything else on island has been a complete waste of time.

This episode had so much potential to be on par with some of the greatest episodes of the show's run but it was just wasted. As mentioned it would have been far better if it had been the second or third episode of the season or spread out over multiple flashbacks.

JZ1276

Thats correct.

Seems there are two types of Lost fans. People who actually want to know whats going on in the show and those who bitch at those people who are satisfied with what they already have.

Philip Reuben

I'm putting two and two together and coming up with what I'm pretty sure is the only plausible explanation. Where you see an inconsistency, I see an interesting detail of two characters' interactions. Given what we know now about the smoke monster and the direction of Ben's story arc, the fact that Ben was previously able to command the smoke monster takes on a rather different meaning than the one we expected.

That's there in the series. The writers don't need to comment on it.

Maybe, maybe not. (Actually, this was season 4, and the writers said in a recent interview that it was around then that they solidified the Jacob/MiB concepts, so they might well have done.) Either way, it's a TV series, and unlike a novel they can't go back and change things before publishing to make sure all the foreshadowing is consistent. Instead, all future revelations will inevitably have to be made to fit with all past events, either consciously or by assumption. This is the reality of story arc writing for any TV series, even one like Lost where they've supposedly had the ending in mind for years. It's a complicated story, and the slightest change in plans will always create an inconsistency somewhere.

As a fan, you can either accept that the story does have some inconsistencies (and be as dissatisfied as you like!), or you can look at the overall story and theorise about how the smaller details might fit together, same as the fanbase has been doing already for the past six years. The one thing that's not reasonable is to expect the writers to go over every appearance of the smoke monster and justify how it fits with the explanation of what the smoke monster is. That's nowhere near practical, and nor is it necessary to tell a good story.

The whispers appeared in several different contexts, often involving Walt (who of course remains a mystery). However, the second time we ever heard them matches completely with the "trapped dead people" explanation, and there's nothing about us hearing them when the Others appear that precludes this explanation.

I'll grant you Kate's horse (not sure what's up with that) and anything to do with Walt. But what visions off the island? The ones that are actually dead people seen by Hurley? The ones where Jack was a crazy drug addict? The only other one I remember is Christian appearing to Michael, but that's hardly "all of the visions"...

JZ1276

Ben told Rousseau "if you hear whispers you run the other way" when Widmore sent him to kill her and her baby. Can anyone come up with an explanation for that or is that just another mystery we can overlook and fill in for ourselves?

Philip Reuben

Simple: Ben doesn't know what the whispers are. (And how would he?)

JZ1276

I dont know, maybe because he's been living on the island for about 30 years? Besides, if he didnt know what they were, why say anything about them at all? By telling her to run the other way something had to have made him thought they were dangerous or were somehow associated with the others right?

Shannon Nutt

Given everything I've read about the final, it's sure to disappoint...rumors are it's more spiritual than scientific, which is no doubt going to tick a lot of people off.

Philip Reuben

He lived on the island for 30 years, and that meant he was aware of the whispers, and afraid of them. That doesn't mean knowing they were the harmless spirits of trapped dead people. Being unable to speak to the dead himself, that's something he can't know unless he's told.

Ben seemed knowledgeable early on in the series, and certainly liked to think he was, but it turned out he didn't know much of anything about the mythology or secrets of the island. It isn't surprising that he was wrong about this.

arminius

And then the island said

JZ1276

I have to disagree with that. When he told her to run away from the whispers it seemed to me like he said that because the whispers meant the others were nearby and he was supposed to kill her and Alex and he said this out of fear for himself because Widmore then would have known he let her live.

HE Pennypacker

That is what kept me watching week in and week out, knowing that in the end there would be at least pseudoscience behind it. And now...THIS? Fuck Carlton and Damon. Especially the latter. I can't stand the guy. The audacity of his ramblings in interviews and his responses to people's reactions on Twitter prove that he is just an egotistical scumbag.

Philip Reuben

Actually you raise an interesting point. Regardless of the concrete reason for it (and we'll probably never get one*), the whispers tended to flare up as a kind of warning that the Others were nearby. It might have simply been that Ben was aware of that and was telling Rousseau how she could know which direction not to go in to avoid the Others.

* I'm of the belief that the whispers were simply being helpful/responsible. The Others were a threat, and they didn't want other people to get killed by them.

Philip Reuben

When some of the characters started having rather blatant magical powers, I stopped expecting a scientific explanation. The writers had obviously changed their minds.

Reasonable expectations: the easiest way to avoid disappointment.

JZ1276

Did they ever say how or who moved the ash so he could leave the cabin ?
Claire maybe?

dsa_shea

So they didn't have the whole smoke monster/MIB/Jacob dynamic solidified until the 4th season? Doesn't that show that they just threw the smoke monster in at the beginning to have something cool and mysterious without really knowing what it is? You would think that they would have had the original or meaning behind the smoke monster all along. So he went from being a "security system" to an integral part in this battle between good and evil.

dsa_shea

That is one of the answers we will never get but it would have been could to see a flashback. Leaving these things open for interpretation is what pisses off some of the fans that have stuck around for 6 years. If I dangle something in front of my dog that he really wants for several days and then do not ultimately give it to him he is likely to bite the shit out of me.

dsa_shea

Especially the supposed last scene.

ATX

so that would mean that