NiCK Crush

They aren't the same thing at all. In his eyes (and many others) he should have been the winner... he was very passionate about the game, clearly, and it was obviously very upsetting.

He didn't bitch or moan ONCE about the brutal living conditions Survivor forces people to face, he knew exactly what he signed up for and loved every second of it while he was in Samoa. He made fun of the people whining and crying about the weather and the uncomfortable living conditions... it's just not the same thing. He never said "if someone cries because they lose this game, then they need to man up and face it because they signed up for that!"

mwbmis

I think that's giving Mick WAY too much credit. Amanda was a good player who sucked in front of the jury. Mick pretty much sucked at everything, but was aligned with the right people.

He was more like a (far,far,....far!!!!) less interesting version of Courtney. I still love Courtney!

TwineTime

Exactly. He's also the only person who's ever done that. And I'm sure everyone's upset when they lose, so there's no excuse.

NiCK Crush

Making fake alliances is part of the game... you have to lie. He did wonderfully. As for the chickens... yea, I guess you could call that evil, but it wasn't even revealed til the clip show. Plus, they should have cooked those things up the second they got them anyway. Waiting for eggs? Come on.

TwineTime

Ok, so he never said that and it's not the same thing.

Doesn't mean we can't laugh at him about it.

mwbmis

He ridiculed people about complaining about what they signed up for. He signed up for a game decided by a jury...acted quite a bit like an arrogant ass...and then started crying to mama (and doing his lame pre-planned jokes) when things didn't go his way. It's not different at all in my eyes, except he looks like an even loser to me b/c the others weren't ridiculing him to the camera.

And that's all Russell is...he's first loser. Congratulations Russell! Sorry things didn't work out for you.

NiCK Crush

Of course you can laugh at it all you want. I'm just explaining how your reasoning for thinking it's funny isn't correct.

TwineTime

There was no reason to lie to Dave. There was no reason to make that deal with Brett. There are reasons to lie in Survivor. Russell often lied for the sake of lying. I can't believe you're trying to argue that he wasn't interested in being seen as a villain. He specifically said, at the end of the show, that he was nothing like "Survivor Russell" in his everyday life. Implication there is that he was an ass on purpose for the sake of the game.

Patman

Haha...Courtney...

What many people never realize is that Survivor is the purest social game on TV, and if you exhibit arrogance, even with brilliant moves within the game, you make it so much harder for the jury to vote for you. Who you take to final tribal is also a key component to positioning yourself for being viewed as a more sympathetic and suitable choice for the jury's vote. Russell did screw that calculation up when his arrogance clouded his judgment by sticking with Natalie and Mick, rather than Jaison and Shambo. Never in a million years did Russell think the jury would vote for Natalie over him in a vote, but then he realized he had screwed up towards the end of the questioning when he answered Dave's question on his chances. It shows that the "bull in a china shop" approach seldom wins Survivor for you, and that's the game that Russell ultimately played, and proudly so, to his evenutal detriment.

NiCK Crush

so to be completely clear... if Russell would have in fact won the game tonight, you would say that he wasn't deserving of it?

TwineTime

Those weren't my reasons. When I laughed at him it was because he was a sore loser and I've never seen someone so entitled after a vote reveal. I was embarrassed for him but it was also funny considering his behavior throughout filming.

Arthur Dent

You took the words right out of my mouth.

TwineTime

If Russell would have won the game, I would think he deserved it. I think everyone who wins deserves it actually. The problem is, Russell needed to play the game differently in order to get jury votes from the people who didn't vote for him tonight. He didn't. He lost. Too bad. So sad. Man up. Cry in the privacy of your own home.

NiCK Crush

It made sense to me, the guy was the most passionate player I've ever seen. Passionate people tend to cry.

mwbmis

For me...

No, I thought he deserved to win, but I think it's funny that he lost. Didn't like him from day one, and almost tuned out on this show for the first time in 19 installments a few weeks ago when it became the Russell/Shambo show. It's probably my least favorite season of Survivor b/c I didn't really like any of the characters on the show.

Erik saved it for me tonight. I loved the finale because Russell didn't win.

TwineTime

So you were cool with passionate Jaison being honest about his struggle with the elements, right?

Oh no, wait. You said it was funny when Russell made fun of him for that. I can tell you this. Jaison probably would have taken losing the game like a man.

NiCK Crush

Being honest about how harsh the elements are and how hard of time you're having isn't being passionate.

dino88

Of course there was. Brett had won 3 immunity challenges in a row and there was a very good chance that he would win the final challenge. Russell wanted to secure Brett's vote and his own spot in the final 3. Made perfect sense to me.

TwineTime

Jaison was a passionate guy who wasn't shy about sharing his feelings with the other castaways. Obviously, he never quit, so he was mostly being honest about the toll the living conditions were having on his body. So it was ok for Russell to make fun of him for that, but it's not okay to make fun of Russell for his immature display during the reunion?

mwbmis

You know I have to take that back though. Courntney was a better player than Mick b/c she was great in front of that jury. If she hadn't been such a horrible player in the game, she could have beaten Todd with that performance.

Mick is more like Cassandra in the season that Earl won 9-0, but even she made some big strategic voting moves.

Mick sucked.

TwineTime

Fine, I'll give you this. His intentions were good, although I think he would have been in the Final 3 without the deal and Brett didn't vote for him anyway.

Actually, I guess we're still unsure about that other Russell vote but I doubt it was Brett. Brett's vote probably went to Natalie since she bonded with him over their mutual faith. I suppose Russell could have tried to bond with anyone after Shambo but he didn't make the moves he needed to toward the end of the game.

dino88

I wasn't talking about the final vote, I was referring to Brett not voting Russell out of the game had he won the final challenge.

outcastja

Russell should have taken Mick and Jaison. Still bitter I lost my $30 Amazon.com gift certificate.

TwineTime

I know. But like I've been saying all night, getting to the end is only half the battle.

dino88

But that's not what we're talking about. You said there was no reason to make a deal with Brett and I gave you the reason why.