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Battlestar Galactica -- "Daybreak Parts 2 & 3" -- 03/20/2009 -- Series Finale

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Battlestar Galactica -- "Daybreak Parts 2 & 3" -- 03/20/2009 -- Series Finale

Old 05-29-09, 02:43 AM
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Re: Battlestar Galactica -- "Daybreak Parts 2 & 3" -- 03/20/2009 -- Series Finale

I hated the ending; I pretty much hated the 4th season. Too much "god" factor.
The opera house plot went nowwhere -- why give Athena and the pres that dream ?
Leaving everything behind also seemed moronic.
The temple and the arrow of appollo also went nowwhere. Ack.
Old 06-16-09, 02:16 AM
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Re: Battlestar Galactica -- "Daybreak Parts 2 & 3" -- 03/20/2009 -- Series Finale

I just finally watched the last 6 episodes tonight. Brilliant ending, I absolutely loved it. I don't think any single TV show, or concept has ever apprehended my mind like this one has. This is seriously one of the best mythologies I have ever seen. I think to truly understand this show, you really need to watch it a few times. Pick up the subtle hints here and there. Ellen Tigh's reuniting with Saul the very first time is just one of the many amazing instances.
Old 06-16-09, 10:34 AM
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Re: Battlestar Galactica -- "Daybreak Parts 2 & 3" -- 03/20/2009 -- Series Finale

I just rewatched this and although I loved the series overall, I have to say the ending was a bunch of esoteric crap, which is funny because I remember the readers critisizing the crap Sopranos finale and saying that they would not do the same with BG, which they did.
Old 06-16-09, 03:59 PM
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Re: Battlestar Galactica -- "Daybreak Parts 2 & 3" -- 03/20/2009 -- Series Finale

I dunno, I guess I just don't get why people didn't like it, but to each their own. It seemed like a satisfying ending to me, the only part that irked me was how Kara just disappeared, that was pretty weak.
Old 07-10-09, 03:04 PM
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Re: Battlestar Galactica -- "Daybreak Parts 2 & 3" -- 03/20/2009 -- Series Finale

I finally saw this and loved it, the more I think about it the better it is.

I'm an athiest myself, but for all those bashing the religion angle, you're kind of missing the point of the entire frakking series. Religion, faith and belief has been a huge theme from the word go, why suddenly blast the finale for including things like angels and allegory when it's been there all along?
Old 07-12-09, 01:33 AM
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Re: Battlestar Galactica -- "Daybreak Parts 2 & 3" -- 03/20/2009 -- Series Finale

Originally Posted by Sierra Disc
I finally saw this and loved it, the more I think about it the better it is.

I'm an athiest myself, but for all those bashing the religion angle, you're kind of missing the point of the entire frakking series. Religion, faith and belief has been a huge theme from the word go, why suddenly blast the finale for including things like angels and allegory when it's been there all along?
I didnt bash it because it included religion I bashed it because it was a pretentious piece of crap ending for a really solid series.
Old 07-12-09, 03:05 AM
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Re: Battlestar Galactica -- "Daybreak Parts 2 & 3" -- 03/20/2009 -- Series Finale

Originally Posted by Sierra Disc
I finally saw this and loved it, the more I think about it the better it is.

I'm an athiest myself, but for all those bashing the religion angle, you're kind of missing the point of the entire frakking series. Religion, faith and belief has been a huge theme from the word go, why suddenly blast the finale for including things like angels and allegory when it's been there all along?
Not to mention that one of the overall themes of the series, a theme that was verbalized throughout the show by the characters, was that of a "higher power" guiding these people. I'm also an atheist, but I found myself greatly enjoying that theme and the religious aspect of the show. What I took from the show in the end was that nature itself is God; the dialogue between Head Six and Baltar in the finale really got that across rather beautifully. The Colonials and the Cylons simply refer to it as Gods or God because that's what they knew to call it.
Old 07-27-09, 11:38 AM
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Re: Battlestar Galactica -- "Daybreak Parts 2 & 3" -- 03/20/2009 -- Series Finale

Finally got around to watching the last four eps.

Some great and inspired moments (the space battle was fittingly epic, Racetrack firing the nukes, Tyrol's rampage, pretty much every sequence w/Anders) but a lot of "meh" ones, too (mostly the weak send-offs of the main players, the decision to send all their tech into the sun, McDonell's horrid "acting").

My verdict: An entertaining and uneven close to one of my favorite shows ever. Didn't resonate nearly as much as the end of The Shield's run, but engaging nonetheless.
Old 07-27-09, 10:05 PM
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Re: Battlestar Galactica -- "Daybreak Parts 2 & 3" -- 03/20/2009 -- Series Finale

Originally Posted by TimeandTide
McDonell's horrid "acting"
that i disagree with one hundred percent.
Old 07-28-09, 09:50 AM
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Re: Battlestar Galactica -- "Daybreak Parts 2 & 3" -- 03/20/2009 -- Series Finale

Originally Posted by xfusejc
that i disagree with one hundred percent.
I should have clarified that I loved her as pre-cancer Roslin (and again when shown in flashback). McDonnell really nailed the character then. But cancer Roslin? Her facial expressions, coupled by the awful bald wig, pushed her character into camp territory. The lowlight: can't remember which ep. it was, but there's a scene where Roslin is running through Galactica that is almost laugh-out-loud funny.
Old 07-28-09, 10:37 AM
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Re: Battlestar Galactica -- "Daybreak Parts 2 & 3" -- 03/20/2009 -- Series Finale

So was Starbuck a ghost, an angel, a MacGuffin, a lazy plot device?

I'm going with the 4th choice.
Old 07-28-09, 11:07 AM
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Re: Battlestar Galactica -- "Daybreak Parts 2 & 3" -- 03/20/2009 -- Series Finale

Originally Posted by slop101
So was Starbuck a ghost, an angel, a MacGuffin, a lazy plot device?

I'm going with the 4th choice.
Basically I think they wrote themselves into a corner without a clever way to get out. Can I take a combination of the final 3 choices?
Old 07-28-09, 11:32 AM
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Re: Battlestar Galactica -- "Daybreak Parts 2 & 3" -- 03/20/2009 -- Series Finale

Originally Posted by TimeandTide
I should have clarified that I loved her as pre-cancer Roslin (and again when shown in flashback). McDonnell really nailed the character then. But cancer Roslin? Her facial expressions, coupled by the awful bald wig, pushed her character into camp territory. The lowlight: can't remember which ep. it was, but there's a scene where Roslin is running through Galactica that is almost laugh-out-loud funny.
Her best performance had to be in "Faith," though. The scene where she's at Nana Visitor's bedside, talking about her mother dying of cancer, is one of the best pieces of acting I've ever seen. It would have been so easy to overplay that scene, but McDonnell was astounding.
Old 07-31-09, 11:58 PM
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Re: Battlestar Galactica -- "Daybreak Parts 2 & 3" -- 03/20/2009 -- Series Finale

I also just watched the last 5 or 6 eps that have been sitting on my DVR for months. I liked it, but definitely enjoyed the "ride" of the first few seasons more than the last few eps. But maybe that's the case for any quality show. I'm sure I'll feel that way about Lost when it's over.
Old 08-01-09, 02:52 AM
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Re: Battlestar Galactica -- "Daybreak Parts 2 & 3" -- 03/20/2009 -- Series Finale

I watched the extended version of "Daybreak" earlier tonight and it's really phenomenal. I'm a fan of the finale as it is, but seeing it this way made it even more enjoyable. Basically, they combined all three parts of "Daybreak" into one, then added around 30 minutes of footage that didn't air. It makes for a truly epic experience and the added touch of rolling end credits made it seem like a movie. I'm impressed that Universal let them go all out like that AND include it on the 4.5 set. It reeks of something that they'd release as a standalone feature to milk the fans even more.

"Islanded in a Stream of Stars," or "Islanded in a Stream of Sars" according to the packaging, also benefited from the extended treatment. It really packs a punch.

Finally, some of the deleted scenes are great; I'm surprised a number of them were cut. Especially the scene where Ellen confronts Tigh about poisoning her.
Old 08-01-09, 03:12 PM
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Re: Battlestar Galactica -- "Daybreak Parts 2 & 3" -- 03/20/2009 -- Series Finale

so they added another 30 minutes to the after the battle living with cave men crap?
Old 08-01-09, 03:17 PM
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Re: Battlestar Galactica -- "Daybreak Parts 2 & 3" -- 03/20/2009 -- Series Finale

Originally Posted by Moopher
I dunno, I guess I just don't get why people didn't like it, but to each their own. It seemed like a satisfying ending to me, the only part that irked me was how Kara just disappeared, that was pretty weak.
I have big problems with a bunch of the creative choices made in the finale, and thinking about them- and what they imply- sours my appreciation somewhat for the series as a whole.

The show had generally been excellent in showing the fallout that came with hard choices and not resetting to get back everything back to a more comfortable status quo. Even when it did do this (the fall of new caprica and taking the wagon train back into space in S3), it took the time to make it seem more plausible and rational.

Several of the decisions key characters make in the finale are the direct opposite of this.
Adama deciding- after all the disasterous outcomes of following the religious prophecies to their end- to still commit lives and resources in a mission that hinges on faith is a major betrayal of the character.
This is directly akin to how Luke Skywalker, flush from finding out that he was lied to by his mentor and his father is a murderer and evil prince- suddenly develops a deep, calming love for him.
In other words, this is bullshit.

Adama was a career military man. The first notion he should have had was that Boomer snatching Hera was a trap hatched purposefully to lead him (and all their military muscle) into an ambush.
If the character, who felt betrayed by the religious faith he belatedly invested in, had a death wish and wanted to take everyone else that he cared about with him, that would be logical and believable. It would have been an unpleasant plot turn, but it would have been up to the level of the best of the series because it would have been an organic, rational outgrowth/repercussion from where things have gone.
Instead
what we get is Adama suddenly, illogically, sentimentally convinced in metaphysical certainties. And worse, he's willing to gamble everything left in pursuit of those, and apparently does not give much thought whatsoever to the notion that he is being lured into one final, neat trap- that the cylons could have been working all along to just this set of circumstances. This notion never seems to give him pause. And worse, we see no one else seriously discussing this potentiality.
All of a sudden he, and everyone around him, is dead certain about the significance of one person and how that outweighs the lives and welfare of the many.
To get to this point with only some offscreen conversation (with the Sam 'the riddle spouting' Hybrid) is a massive rookie ball drop. This is so far beneath this series, it's painful.

And even if you are willing to just go with the flow on that point, another doozy is waiting at the end- that 50,000 or however many are left surviors decided en masse, without any conflict or debate or protestations- to give up all technology and go native.
Words fail me at not only how stupid the notion is (coming from Lee) but poor the execution of it is (exposited with one line of dialogue).
I could buy that Lee, in a fit of exhaustion and relief might be inclined to want to institute that policy- but there is no way in hell I can believe it ever would happen, let alone with no conflict whatsoever.

The poor motivation of Adama behind the rescue of Hera was one thing, but this is totally outrageous and infuriating. For what had been a generally very smart show, this is stupid squared.
And what is most reprehensible- it didn't need to be. All that was needed was one scene on the open field with a few characters - Doc Cottle and his some of his staff would have been perfect- philosophizing/theorizing what will likely happen if they try to plant roots here- how the tech would break down in time and be beyond repair and how they would have to consciously migrate away from technology to a more primitive standard of living, but that there could still be some satisfaction to be taken in that 'come down'.
Instead we get a Lucas-sized contrivance based on hippy dippy simple minded sentimentality.

Sorry, but the notion that this idea-Lee Adama's final solution to break the cycle- was where four seasons of this show was ultimately headed, makes me mad I invested that much time, energy, and money into it.

This is a finale that is 'Return Of The Jedi bad' to me. It is so bad that it even soils and sours the memory of what had previously been beautiful and brilliant.

And notice I never once mentioned the Kara Thrace stuff.
Honestly, there are far more significant problems than that business- problems that drive a stake into the heart of the show (that 'heart' being believable characters and dramatic conflict).
Post-rescue of Hera, the show becomes conflict free. Instead of pointing to a life goes on despite... style ending, they go out with what is basically the cast around an Ewok campfire singing the jub jub song.

And there is the coda "150,000 yrs later". Dumb and unnecessary.
If they wanted to infer Hera was MLR Eve, the article should have been being read by a tech at SETI enjoying Jimi Hendrix and sarcastically "D J ing" it in place of the normal beacon.
Not very original, but that would at least have tied the music organically into the prior events. As it is, it makes not a lick of sense otherwise.

Last edited by Paul_SD; 08-01-09 at 03:32 PM.
Old 08-01-09, 07:18 PM
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Re: Battlestar Galactica -- "Daybreak Parts 2 & 3" -- 03/20/2009 -- Series Finale

^ yeah, pretty much.
Old 08-02-09, 12:30 AM
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Re: Battlestar Galactica -- "Daybreak Parts 2 & 3" -- 03/20/2009 -- Series Finale

Originally Posted by al_bundy
so they added another 30 minutes to the after the battle living with cave men crap?
Not really, it's new stuff sprinkled throughout all three parts of "Daybreak." They added more flashbacks, primarily for Chief/Boomer, Baltar, and Ellen. There's a scene with Tory and Ellen before the assault on the Colony that demonstrates how selfish & nasty Tory is. A scene where Adama refuses to connect Anders to the CIC & Starbuck lets loose on him. Another scene where Romo is trying to determine a location to build a city on New Earth. Some existing scenes are extended, etc.
Old 08-02-09, 05:39 AM
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Re: Battlestar Galactica -- "Daybreak Parts 2 & 3" -- 03/20/2009 -- Series Finale

Originally Posted by Paul_SD
Adama was a career military man. The first notion he should have had was that Boomer snatching Hera was a trap hatched purposefully to lead him (and all their military muscle) into an ambush.
I was under the impression that rescuing Hera was intended to be a suicide mission.

The "promised land" turned out to be a nuked wasteland and the Galactica was falling apart by then. They had nothing to lose, and it was pretty strongly implied that everyone was planning on going out in a blaze of glory.
Old 08-02-09, 02:38 PM
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Re: Battlestar Galactica -- "Daybreak Parts 2 & 3" -- 03/20/2009 -- Series Finale

Months after this show ended, I'm still bummed by most of Season 4 and especially the ending...

Starbuck died so she could become an angel or messenger of God? Yuck. And I hated how she died (basically killing herself by ignoring all the warning signs that her ship was going to break up). This means she was either stupid, crazy or suicidal. I don't like to think of Starbuck that way.

I didn't like watching Roslin die all season. If they had to resurrect the cancer storyline, couldn't they have waited till the bitter end? And I didn't like watching her die in the finale. I wish they had implied she died soon after the show ended just so we could have had a happy ending with Adama and Roslin sitting on the grass together.

The whole season was a downer as far as I'm concerned...

...Adama ends up alone and isolated
...Lee ends up alone because D and Starbuck were both killed off
...Anders spends much of the season as a babbling idiot in a pool of water before dying
...Gaeta is killed off for his part in the mutiny even though IMHO he had valid criticisms
...Cally is killed off
...Baltar spends the season spouting boring religious crap

In fact, the only ones who get a happy ending are Six and Baltar, who doesn't even deserve a happy ending for betraying the entire human race on Caprica, and Sharon, Anders and Hera. I know this show was known for being dark, and I liked that, but I guess I expected some happiness for these characters by show's end.
Old 08-02-09, 03:41 PM
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Re: Battlestar Galactica -- "Daybreak Parts 2 & 3" -- 03/20/2009 -- Series Finale

Yeah, because the series began on such a high note...

The war and the running were over. The found "Earth". It's as happy as it could possibly be.
Old 08-02-09, 04:31 PM
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Re: Battlestar Galactica -- "Daybreak Parts 2 & 3" -- 03/20/2009 -- Series Finale

Originally Posted by Joe Schmoe
Months after this show ended, I'm still bummed by most of Season 4 and especially the ending...

Starbuck died so she could become an angel or messenger of God? Yuck. And I hated how she died (basically killing herself by ignoring all the warning signs that her ship was going to break up). This means she was either stupid, crazy or suicidal. I don't like to think of Starbuck that way.
Her being an "angel" was her destiny and the part she played in the overall stroyline, but that's not really what her arc as a character was. Starbuck was always a character that flirted with death; she admitted to not being afraid of it and practically embraced it. Her death and subsequent resurrection were all about taking this punk kid without respect for her own life into a woman who appreciated it.

Originally Posted by Joe Schmoe
I didn't like watching Roslin die all season. If they had to resurrect the cancer storyline, couldn't they have waited till the bitter end? And I didn't like watching her die in the finale. I wish they had implied she died soon after the show ended just so we could have had a happy ending with Adama and Roslin sitting on the grass together.
She may have died, but I don't think anything could have been happier than seeing just how deep the love was that she shared with Adama. The scene where she said "So much life" and Adama slipped his ring on her finger when she passed was nothing short of beautiful. As was the scene of Adama describing the spot for their cabin at her gravesite. Makes me cry every time.

It's a tragic ending, but it's also uplifting. They're finally able to live without conflict, but they also had to give up so much in order to get to that point.

The finale has many flaws, but I overlook them and don't let them hinder my enjoyment of it just because the endings for the characters were so beautiful. The abandonment of technology is silly and all that jazz, but I really just don't care. I cared about what happened to the characters I loved and I felt that their send-offs were incredible. When Baltar, a character I despised for four years, could be redeemed with one line of dialogue, I knew just how good the finale was. I've never watched a show that got me so emotionally involved and if a show can keep that up for four years & make me truly care what happens to the characters, then it accomplished what it set out to do.
Old 08-02-09, 05:27 PM
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Re: Battlestar Galactica -- "Daybreak Parts 2 & 3" -- 03/20/2009 -- Series Finale

Originally Posted by pinata242
Yeah, because the series began on such a high note...

The war and the running were over. The found "Earth". It's as happy as it could possibly be.
It's because so much of what came earlier was such a downer that they had actually earned themselves a happier ending than what they went with, even if slightly so.
Old 08-02-09, 06:36 PM
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Re: Battlestar Galactica -- "Daybreak Parts 2 & 3" -- 03/20/2009 -- Series Finale

Originally Posted by golden_rod
The finale has many flaws, but I overlook them and don't let them hinder my enjoyment of it just because the endings for the characters were so beautiful. The abandonment of technology is silly and all that jazz, but I really just don't care. I cared about what happened to the characters I loved and I felt that their send-offs were incredible. When Baltar, a character I despised for four years, could be redeemed with one line of dialogue, I knew just how good the finale was. I've never watched a show that got me so emotionally involved and if a show can keep that up for four years & make me truly care what happens to the characters, then it accomplished what it set out to do.
I feel like I've just had this meal that I've craved for so long, that went down ok, and got points for satisfying a craving- but is now coming back up like acid reflux the more thought I put into it.
The finale, at the time, was emotionally satisfying for me.

Maybe Return Of The Jedi was a poor comparision, because I never ever got any emotional satisfaction out of that conclusion.
Probably a better one would be The Dark Knight. There was so much righteous cool interspersed with the teeth-grindingly stupid that it makes for very frustrating reflection. As both were initially unspooling, I was able to go with the flow and not get hung up by obvious lapses of character motivation and logic, but it didn't take long afterwards for all of that to come home to roost.

I'm still digesting this, and it's possible that in a few days I may revisit Daybreak and watch the extended version and see if smoothes over any of my problems.

I've spent the last day going thru various forums, seeing what other peoples reactions were to the end when it first aired. Probably the best give and take I've seen so far has been on CHUD. Some of the response there, to people arguing the same points I have, have given me a little pause.

After a bit of distance I may come around to just shrugging off most of the problems here as just unfortunate lapses in execution rather than conceptual weaknesses, which to me would be the bigger sin. At least I hope so. This show entranced me like few others for the majority of its 4 seasons. Even when it was less than magical, it still scored on the most basic level of leaving me curious to see what came next.

I will say that one aspect of the end that I loved was how much time was devoted to a slow exit. The show definitely earned that time. I just believe/wish that there had been more nods to pragmatic reality sprinkled in. I didn't need to see full on shouting matches- but I would have liked to have seen what were sure to be upcoming sources of conflict at least being anticipated by some of the characters. Even just a line or two about arguing the position of moving away from the technology- it didn't need to nor should have been resolved on screen, and it didn't need to trample on the graceful 'winding down' tone of the last forty minutes. I would have like to have seen at least one short scene where some of the educated elites were hashing out how to pragmatically proceed, and at least anticipating what would be some of the first (of many) big conflicts to come up.

The people that shepherded this show thru 2 whip smart first seasons, should have recognized the glaring omission of some scene like that, and ordered pickups right quick to address it.

Last edited by Paul_SD; 08-02-09 at 06:57 PM.

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