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The Final Sopranos - "Made in America" - 06/10/07 (WARNING SPOILERS)

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The Final Sopranos - "Made in America" - 06/10/07 (WARNING SPOILERS)

Old 06-11-07, 01:54 PM
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Originally Posted by abrg923
Meadow was never shown coming in the door on the East Coast feed - assuming you mean the first airing of the show from last night.
Yes she was, on the HD feed at least.
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Old 06-11-07, 01:54 PM
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Originally Posted by KillerCannabis
Anyone else notice that on East Coast feeds the last shot was Meadow coming in the door and in the West Coast feeds it was Tony's face? At least, that's what I recall seeing since I watched them both...
I was wondering about that, because I swore I saw Meadow coming in as the very last shot (although it was a split second before it cut to black, borderline subliminal) and yet many people on here were insisting the final shot was Tony looking up.
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Old 06-11-07, 01:56 PM
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Originally Posted by DRG
I was wondering about that, because I swore I saw Meadow coming in as the very last shot (although it was a split second before it cut to black, borderline subliminal) and yet many people on here were insisting the final shot was Tony looking up.
It was.
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Old 06-11-07, 01:57 PM
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Damn. I shouldn't have erase dmy HD recording. I staye dup and watched the non-HD west coast feed and they did not show Meadow entering. Not sure why the East Coast HD feed would. Some still have a recording they can screenshot?
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Old 06-11-07, 01:58 PM
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Originally Posted by KillerCannabis
Anyone else notice that on East Coast feeds the last shot was Meadow coming in the door and in the West Coast feeds it was Tony's face? At least, that's what I recall seeing since I watched them both...
I dont know if that is true but I wouldn't doubt it.

ONLY BECAUSE...I watched this with a friend who taped it on VHS (yes we still VCR things here in Nebraska from time to time) and after watching it I could swear that Meadow was the last thing we saw.

But then later he called me after I left and we discussed more...and he replayed the tape and said the last thing was Tony looking up.

Perhaps you made the same mistake I did...because it all went so fast.
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Old 06-11-07, 01:59 PM
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But Meadow was NEVER seen coming into the bar - only running up to it. I'm not sure how people are making that mistake, when it was never even shown.
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Old 06-11-07, 02:00 PM
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Originally Posted by bunkaroo
Damn. I shouldn't have erase dmy HD recording. I staye dup and watched the non-HD west coast feed and they did not show Meadow entering. Not sure why the East Coast HD feed would. Some still have a recording they can screenshot?
It didn't. I'm rewatching it right now - Tony hears the bell jingle, looks up, "Don't stop!" - black.
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Old 06-11-07, 02:04 PM
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Originally Posted by IIG
I rewatched the ending again, and for me it is definitive. Tony did not get killed. I challenge everyone to rewatch the ending. There is a scene with Tony telling everyone he ordered something for the table, then everyone is shown eating the onion rings. Where Tony is seated, we can see everything behind him, and there is no one there (except a waittress that walks past him). We can all see the restaurant from where everyone else is seated. Again, nobody suspicious is to be seen. Then we see Meadow running to the restaurant. The door opens, and Tony looks up at the sound of the bell, like he's been doing all night. There was no one closer to the door than Meadow, so common sense tells you it was her who entered. Again, no one is standing behind Tony. Granted the bathroom that the guy went to is to the right of Tony, and the entrance is to the left, so the camera does not show a great deal of what is happening to the right of him. But from a few quick flashes before Tony's final glance at the door, we don't see a barrel anywhere in or on the immediate outside of the final frame.

Now you mean to tell me, that someone pulled out a gun and shot Tony from long range in a crowded restaurant? Especially with the possibility of missing the target by any increasing distance? All angles were accounted for just at the Sopranos table, and this place was bustling with business. No screams, no ruckus, no warnings, no hysteria as a gunman pulls a gun out, aims, and shoots? Bologna. Even at close range, SOMEONE from the table would have said something. The guy would have had to hurried to the table, aimed the gun, and shot. From the shots that we see, he would not have had time to do that. There is no way Tony would have been looking at a door, even if his family was so petrified by what they saw that their voiceboxes temporarily gave out. The lack of concern on Tony's face, shows nothing was amiss in that restaurant at the time the door opened.

No. Tony and his family are still alive as far as the show is concerned. And though its fine for fans to discuss the ending until they are blue in the face, nothing in the world happened here.

This is one of the best series finales I have ever seen after the second viewing, by the way.

It's funny you say that because I originally agreed with you...but I have rewatched that last two seconds now a couple times...he simply does not just look up...but quickly moves his hand from the Jukebox down to his side and has a look fear in his face almost. How does one make animated gifs from movie files?
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Old 06-11-07, 02:06 PM
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Originally Posted by Matto1020
It's funny you say that because I originally agreed with you...but I have rewatched that last two seconds now a couple times...he simply does not just look up...but quickly moves his hand from the Jukebox down to his side and has a look fear in his face almost. How does one make animated gifs from movie files?

thats because he had to take a shit
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Old 06-11-07, 02:08 PM
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Originally Posted by abrg923
But Meadow was NEVER seen coming into the bar - only running up to it. I'm not sure how people are making that mistake, when it was never even shown.
You are arguing semantics. Running up to the bar and coming into the bar means the same thing. No one is saying differently. You are right, and they are right, it's the same damn thing.
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Old 06-11-07, 02:09 PM
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Originally Posted by Matto1020
It's funny you say that because I originally agreed with you...but I have rewatched that last two seconds now a couple times...he simply does not just look up...but quickly moves his hand from the Jukebox down to his side and has a look fear in his face almost. How does one make animated gifs from movie files?
He looks up on the EC HD feed. And I'm sure it will be that way on the DVD. It's the whole point of the scene - he looks up every time the bell rights.
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Old 06-11-07, 02:09 PM
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Originally Posted by DVD Josh
Yes she was, on the HD feed at least.
She was never shown coming into the diner on any feed. She is shown running up, bell rings, Tony looks up, cut to black and silence.
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Old 06-11-07, 02:10 PM
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Originally Posted by Quake1028
She was never shown coming into the diner on any feed. She is shown running up, bell rings, Tony looks up, cut to black and silence.
Again, it's just a friggin' term. Coming into the bar does not necessarily mean walking through the door. She was running up to door and come in the bar. Does that make everyone happy?
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Old 06-11-07, 02:10 PM
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Originally Posted by DVD Josh
You are arguing semantics. Running up to the bar and coming into the bar means the same thing. No one is saying differently. You are right, and they are right, it's the same damn thing.
Not really. Coming into the diner means we see her physically doing the act; we don't see that, we see her running towards the door.
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Old 06-11-07, 02:11 PM
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Originally Posted by Quake1028
Not really. Coming into the diner means we see her physically doing the act; we don't see that, we see her running towards the door.
I'm not going to argue semantics with you either. It plainly does, especially in a conversational manner.
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Old 06-11-07, 02:13 PM
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Originally Posted by dadaluholla
Cancelled HBO this morning. I'm thinking I'll sell off my previous Sopranos DVD sets as well. This show is pretty much dead to me.
Oh... that will show 'em. Do realize how many people cancel HBO after every season of Sopranos, just because its an added expense? I didn't start watching Sopranos on HBO until the third season, when I called my cable company to add HBO they had a full staff working on a Sunday just to add HBO for new Sopranos veiwers. And selling your DVDs for far more then half of what you paid for them will do nothing but make some penny-pincher happy. You've already ponied up the money that went to HBO/Chase anyway. I'll tell you what I'll give you $25 for all of them.
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Old 06-11-07, 02:19 PM
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Originally Posted by VitiminJ
Oh... that will show 'em. Do realize how many people cancel HBO after every season of Sopranos, just because its an added expense? I didn't start watching Sopranos on HBO until the third season, when I called my cable company to add HBO they had a full staff working on a Sunday just to add HBO for new Sopranos veiwers. And selling your DVDs for far more then half of what you paid for them will do nothing but make some penny-pincher happy. You've already ponied up the money that went to HBO/Chase anyway. I'll tell you what I'll give you $25 for all of them.
I'm keeping HBO for Entourage at least. Then I'll re-evaluate. But it's nothing special for people to order and drop HBO for the Sopranos. That's why its hard to get a deal when it's on the air, and never cheaper to pick it up right after it's off.
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Old 06-11-07, 02:19 PM
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Originally Posted by IIG
I rewatched the ending again, and for me it is definitive. Tony did not get killed. I challenge everyone to rewatch the ending. There is a scene with Tony telling everyone he ordered something for the table, then everyone is shown eating the onion rings. Where Tony is seated, we can see everything behind him, and there is no one there (except a waittress that walks past him). We can all see the restaurant from where everyone else is seated. Again, nobody suspicious is to be seen. Then we see Meadow running to the restaurant. The door opens, and Tony looks up at the sound of the bell, like he's been doing all night. There was no one closer to the door than Meadow, so common sense tells you it was her who entered. Again, no one is standing behind Tony. Granted the bathroom that the guy went to is to the right of Tony, and the entrance is to the left, so the camera does not show a great deal of what is happening to the right of him. But from a few quick flashes before Tony's final glance at the door, we don't see a barrel anywhere in or on the immediate outside of the final frame.

Now you mean to tell me, that someone pulled out a gun and shot Tony from long range in a crowded restaurant? Especially with the possibility of missing the target by any increasing distance? All angles were accounted for just at the Sopranos table, and this place was bustling with business. No screams, no ruckus, no warnings, no hysteria as a gunman pulls a gun out, aims, and shoots? Bologna. Even at close range, SOMEONE from the table would have said something. The guy would have had to hurried to the table, aimed the gun, and shot. From the shots that we see, he would not have had time to do that. There is no way Tony would have been looking at a door, even if his family was so petrified by what they saw that their voiceboxes temporarily gave out. The lack of concern on Tony's face, shows nothing was amiss in that restaurant at the time the door opened.
Their voiceboxes gave out? Wow, talk about going eight steps beyond anything we saw in this fictional universe. You're right, when Tony is seated we don't see anything behind him.. except the rest of the television set that Gandolfini and the other actors are on.

Even if ten guys had rushed Tony while he reached into his jacket, if it cuts to black after that, that's how it ends. Once the show is over, it's over. The credits roll, and there's nothing more to the story than what made it into that last hour. We only see what was written, produced, and aired. There was no future story ala Six Feet Under, the show simply ended. Whether or not Meadow made it inside or bathroom guy went #1 or #2 don't matter, as those details were not part of the story we were told. Anything else is conjecture, and even an 'explanation' from David Chase in the NY Times wouldn't put things on the screen that weren't there. The finale sucked hard, and guessing at what happens in a fictional story after it ends won't make that last 'chapter' any better. Like I said a few pages ago, it's not a Choose Your Own Adventure Book.

I challenge you to realize that you only saw what you saw, nothing more and nothing less. Meadow NEVER had Frosted Flakes for breakfast.. or DID SHE!?
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Old 06-11-07, 02:28 PM
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Oh... that will show 'em.
I'm not trying to "show" 'em. I'm just done with HBO, and after the past few seasons of lame Sopranos episodes, I don't think I even want to go back to watch the first few seasons I originally enjoyed. My interest in the product is dead.

Keep your $25.
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Old 06-11-07, 02:29 PM
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Originally Posted by VitiminJ
Oh... that will show 'em. Do realize how many people cancel HBO after every season of Sopranos, just because its an added expense? I didn't start watching Sopranos on HBO until the third season, when I called my cable company to add HBO they had a full staff working on a Sunday just to add HBO for new Sopranos veiwers. And selling your DVDs for far more then half of what you paid for them will do nothing but make some penny-pincher happy. You've already ponied up the money that went to HBO/Chase anyway. I'll tell you what I'll give you $25 for all of them.
I think a lot of people have HBO just for "The Sopranos" and that was my insinuation (although I did not make the post above).

Frankly, I am one of those and I canceled this morning as well. Had nothing to do with "showing" HBO how pissed I was at the show itself, just that my current use for HBO is done.
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Old 06-11-07, 02:30 PM
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Originally Posted by DVD Josh
I'm not going to argue semantics with you either. It plainly does, especially in a conversational manner.
I'll argue, because you're talking nonsensically. "Coming into" the bar (actually a restaurant) means entering the building. We never see her at the door, nor opening the door, and least of all stepping foot into the building. The last shot of her, she is still in the street. That certainly isn't the same as "coming into" the place. "Heading for" is more appropriate.
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Old 06-11-07, 02:30 PM
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Originally Posted by Dignam
Their voiceboxes gave out? Wow, talk about going eight steps beyond anything we saw in this fictional universe. You're right, when Tony is seated we don't see anything behind him.. except the rest of the television set that Gandolfini and the other actors are on.

Even if ten guys had rushed Tony while he reached into his jacket, if it cuts to black after that, that's how it ends. Once the show is over, it's over. The credits roll, and there's nothing more to the story than what made it into that last hour. We only see what was written, produced, and aired. There was no future story ala Six Feet Under, the show simply ended. Whether or not Meadow made it inside or bathroom guy went #1 or #2 don't matter, as those details were not part of the story we were told. Anything else is conjecture, and even an 'explanation' from David Chase in the NY Times wouldn't put things on the screen that weren't there. The finale sucked hard, and guessing at what happens in a fictional story after it ends won't make that last 'chapter' any better. Like I said a few pages ago, it's not a Choose Your Own Adventure Book.

I challenge you to realize that you only saw what you saw, nothing more and nothing less. Meadow NEVER had Frosted Flakes for breakfast.. or DID SHE!?
So we disagree on nothing except for the quality of the show then? I'm no longer interpreting the show. After the rewatch, there's nothing there to interpret. I saw what was there, which was a living Tony Soprano looking up at a door that most likely was being opened by his own daughter.
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Old 06-11-07, 02:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Giantrobo
The more I think about the more i realize Paulie has always been my favorite character. For all his faults he's still pretty cool and to me, he's no where near as evil as Tony.
Apparently you've forgotten when Paulie cold-bloodedly killed the old lady just for her mattress money.
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Old 06-11-07, 02:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Numanoid
I'll argue, because you're talking nonsensically. "Coming into" the bar (actually a restaurant) means entering the building. We never see her at the door, nor opening the door, and least of all stepping foot into the building. The last shot of her, she is still in the street. That certainly isn't the same as "coming into" the place. "Heading for" is more appropriate.
Yep.
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Old 06-11-07, 02:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Numanoid
I'll argue, because you're talking nonsensically. "Coming into" the bar (actually a restaurant) means entering the building. We never see her at the door, nor opening the door, and least of all stepping foot into the building. The last shot of her, she is still in the street. That certainly isn't the same as "coming into" the place. "Heading for" is more appropriate.
Fine, heading. In a message board, in casual conversational speaking, they mean the same thing. That's what everyone posting it meant.

It's amazing how everyone on a message boards turns into English majors and grammar teachers when they don't agree with someone.
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