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An idea for who should take over the Star Trek franchise...

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An idea for who should take over the Star Trek franchise...

Old 06-17-03, 02:29 AM
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An idea for who should take over the Star Trek franchise...

As we all know, Star Trek as a franchise is in sad shape right now. Enterprise is mediocre, Nemesis was either pretty good or pretty bad depending on who you ask, the ratings for Enterprise are not great, and Nemesis tanked at the box office.

Clearly it's time for someone new to run Trek.

Rick Berman has run it pretty much into the ground, and Brannon Braga has been his right hand man. Sayonara suckers - time to go.

So who to replace them?

How about Jonathan Glassner and Brad Wright?

Stargate SG1 is closer in style and tone to the original Star Trek series than any of the spin offs, and it is consitently more fun to watch.

I'd love to see these guys take over the franchise. After, of course, a 3 or 4 year hiatus following the end of Enterprise.... (I think we could all use a break.)
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Old 06-17-03, 05:38 AM
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I was thinking das could do it...
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Old 06-17-03, 07:53 AM
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Maybe the series should just die already or lay dormant for a good 5-10 years while it recovers and comes back fresh
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Old 06-17-03, 08:10 AM
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My vote is Michael Piller. I personally think he is one of the reasons DS9 kicked major butt. Something tells me Paramount won't drag him away from The Dead Zone but we can wish can't we? But only after a really long hiatus (like 5 years).
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Old 06-17-03, 11:01 AM
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Quoth Buck Turgidson
I was thinking das could do it...



To quote jms, "I don't know how to write while hand-cuffed."

While I'd like to drop all the blame in the laps of B&B, I think a part of the problem is Paramount's "cash cow" mentality with the franchise. Instead of producing high quality programming and as a result making money from it, they seem to proceed with making money as the primary (and only) goal. When it comes to television, this strategy sometimes works, but it often fails, especially when it comes to genre programming.

No matter what you do, there are only a certain number of people who are going to watch a Trek show, even if you pack it with T&A and drop the "Star Trek" name. Alienating most of those people in the hopes of going "mainstream" just doesn't work. Ask Bonnie Hammer. 2 years of cancelling everything good they have (and dropping mad cash to buy SG-1's established audience), and they're no more mainstream today than before.

I say this because I think replacing B&B is only the first step. If they do bring in new blood, they have to give it a chance to flourish. They have to accept up front that it's a new start and things may be rocky at the beginning. I don't see any of this happening, though, so I guess it's a moot point.

If I had to pick someone (or a team), I'd go with David Kember and Rockne S. O'Bannon. They've oft noted that their primary writing influences are the original Star Trek and the original Twilight Zone, and they've demonstrated a willingness to fight for quality, a trait that seems lost. I also wouldn't object to Piller, but it's unlikely he'd ever return to the franchise. Unlike Braga, he understood that characters are more important than "lasers."

The main problem comes back to the jms quote. No established writer/producer is going to want to involve himself with the Trek universe. It's too restrictive, and it's unlikely that Paramount is going to change their approach. I hate that I feel this way, but it's probably time to take the franchise out back and shoot it. The messages from the original series are timeless, and maybe one day in the distant future, the show can return ... but not for a long time, not until Berman and Braga no longer have any association with the franchise, not until the nameless controlling entities at Paramount have moved on to other things. Everyone needs some time away from Trek -- including the fans -- and if it is to return, it should be because the story is so great it demands to be told ... not because it's simply time for another series.

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Last edited by das Monkey; 06-17-03 at 11:03 AM.
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Old 06-17-03, 11:27 AM
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Originally posted by Jackskeleton
Maybe the series should just die already or lay dormant for a good 5-10 years while it recovers and comes back fresh
I agree. It was off for a long time after TOS, and came back strong. Another break would probably serve them well.
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Old 06-17-03, 11:36 AM
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I'd love to see Leonard Nimoy, Harve Bennett or even Nick Meyer take over the franchise, but I'm sure those guys are far from interested.

Someone like Ken Johnson would be cool, but I doubt he's interested anyway.

If Paramount was smart, they'd yank Enterprise off the air and sit back and wait until whatever contract Berman has with them has expired...he has truly destroyed a once great franchise.
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Old 06-17-03, 12:00 PM
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Although I see the point of the entire "kill it now, wait 5 years" posts, I'm not sure it wouldn't backfire. Trek has reached an all-time low in support and killing it now could very well lead to it never returning.

Take Dr. Who as an example. It was in a fairly similar situation back in the McCoy days: quality wasn't what it was, ratings fairly low, etc. It was yanked off the air. It came back several years later as a TV movie, didn't do very well, and once again it's hanging out there (now nearly 15 years later).

Lost in Space: same deal. Movie tanked, nothing further done.

Babylon 5 hasn't been doing very well either. Crusade? Rangers? But, we can all blame Bonnie for the Rangers

Trek, as a franchise, is on a different level than all of these due to the bigger fanbase however and might survive a long hiatus. It did before. But, we had Kirk, Spock, and McCoy to bring it back to life then.

Who do we have now? Archer? Janeway? A new cast of unknowns?

They don't inspire much confidence to carry the future and bring it back from the dead.

As a die-hard Trek geek: I'll happily take bad Trek with the small glimmer of hope for improvement over no Trek at all.

.....besides, what space-based sci-fi would I have to turn to? Andromeda? -shudder-
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Old 06-17-03, 01:50 PM
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A long, long, long hiatus is the only viable solution. Of course Paramount won't hear that as they need their film and tv divisions to perform, which by and large they aren't. Well, we have our memories.
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Old 06-17-03, 02:48 PM
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Originally posted by das Monkey
The main problem comes back to the jms quote. No established writer/producer is going to want to involve himself with the Trek universe.
Well, maybe George R.R. Martin [1] & Harlan Ellison [2] could be persuaded?!?

Are there any other science fiction & fantasy writers with an established tv background? Perhaps K W Jeter and some of the better writer who have engaged in regular "bread and butter" novelisations could get involved; perhaps Bill Shatner Ron Goulart!!!

[1] George could organise a stable of writers as he did with his Wildcard books!
[2] Harlan could contribute one episode a decade and spend the rest of the time bitching about it and everything else
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Old 06-17-03, 03:54 PM
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I have no long term outline but I will say this: Piller, Jeri Taylor and (especially) Ron Moore and Ira Steven Behr are deeply missed.
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Old 06-17-03, 04:52 PM
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Piller was the first name to pop into my head. Why does it seem like the franchise took a hit after he left?

The Dead Zone is one of the top 5 shows on TV right now if you ask me, and i'd like to think he has a huge hand in that.
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Old 06-17-03, 05:32 PM
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Originally posted by ClarkKentKY
Piller was the first name to pop into my head. Why does it seem like the franchise took a hit after he left?

The Dead Zone is one of the top 5 shows on TV right now if you ask me, and i'd like to think he has a huge hand in that.
A very huge hand. He and Shawn created that show and saw it through from the networks rejecting it to finally finding a home at USA.
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Old 06-17-03, 05:36 PM
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Originally posted by Jepthah
Well, we have our memories.
Gee, how about watching some old episodes of Next Generation and reaquaint ourselves with reality? Perhaps that episode in Season 2 with the lost clone colony and their hayseed "breeding-stock" brethern?

As much as we love this Trek bidness, seems way too easy these days to poo poo the current crop and laud the good-ol-days that weren't always as rosey as we'd prefer to remember them.

And since when did Trek T&A become a taboo? They wore go-go boots and miniskirts on Kirk's Enterprise. Troi's neckline boldly went where few had gone before. Jeri Ryan saved an entire series simply by donning a silver unitard. So as far as I'm concerned, T'Pol's high-beams merely shine toward Trek's bright future.
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Old 06-17-03, 05:51 PM
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Am I the only one that liked Rene Echevarria? He was a nice guy and you could always tell his episodes from Ron Moore's. His stories were character driven while Ron was more action oriented.
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Old 06-17-03, 07:51 PM
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I agree with the people saying a hiatus might be a great idea. I have not followed Trek since about season four of next gen. It just doesn't hold my attention any more.
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Old 06-17-03, 11:07 PM
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Originally posted by G. Noel Gross


And since when did Trek T&A become a taboo? They wore go-go boots and miniskirts on Kirk's Enterprise. Troi's neckline boldly went where few had gone before. Jeri Ryan saved an entire series simply by donning a silver unitard. So as far as I'm concerned, T'Pol's high-beams merely shine toward Trek's bright future.
T&A is cool w/ me. I have more of a problem (and it's not really a major one, all things considered), with how Bragman collectively took such a big on established continuity.
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Old 06-18-03, 12:44 AM
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I agree with Piller as the big boss, but I definitely would push hard for Ira Behr and Robert Wolfe to run the day to day aspects. Those guys took DS9 and turned it into a kick-ass, deep, serialized, emotional, epic drama. This was no spaceship planet hopping episodic cookie cutter show. The last few seasons feel like Band of Brothers set in space. what was there, 26 reocurring/supporting characters? and we cared for them ALL. Who can deny liking Weyoun, Nog, Martok, and everyone's favorite, Garok.

I'm sorry, as I didn't mean this to turn into a DS9 hand job, but The show really showed us a new direction the series could take, but instead B&B fell back onto tired formula. And they didn't even do it well.

As for Das' point about Paramount's vicelike grip, I agree. But Ira Behr had the same constraints put on him by Berman, and he did his own thing anyway. I love the interview I read once where the writers were saying that when they showed Berman the plans for the finale, he said "no way... but I know you're going to do it anyway."

Now I'm not a violent man, but if any of you trek fans DO have plans to kill B&B and instate anyone from the DS9 team, gimme a call...
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Old 06-18-03, 01:13 AM
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My vote is Michael Piller. I personally think he is one of the reasons DS9 kicked major butt.
No, but he's the major reason the first seasons didn't suck like Enterprise does, and the early Voyager ones aren't so bad (Jerri Taylor also helped there... though I don't like a lot of her stuff, she's brilliant compaired to Braga.) I like Piller, don't get me wrong, I like him a lot, but he's not why DS9 ruled. The falls on people like Behr, Moore, Wolfe, Echevarria...

But all their work since then has left something to be desired... Andomeda? Roswell?? Dark Angel??? don't ask me the reasons why...

I'd love to see it done by all the old DS9 crew (which is really just the best of the TNG crew)... but remember, Behr only went there because it was less restrictive then TNG (which is why he left TNG.) DS9 was far far less restrictive, but I happen to know they still couldn't do all they wanted... I don't know, I think that is sometimes a good thing, restrictions make you think harder! but it's something no one wants to work under, and when you can't do the great stuff, then it's hard.

I read a funny story in Time when Nemisis first came out... they were going on about how Trek has survived because it has adapted to a big explosions and big breasts show, practically having an interview with Berman being proud of it. The logic was that First Contact did well in theaters, and it was an action movie... so it must be what fans want... whereas Insurrection did poorly, and it was a more traditional Trek story, so it mustn't be what fans want. They just forgot to fact in that one had a good story and one was crappy!

In the end though, my favorite Trek incarnation probably is the Nick Meyer stuff... he's just an awesome director! and writer! he should seriously win an Oscar for direction... just look at the way his films are shot.
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Old 06-18-03, 02:12 AM
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I still think that Glassner and Wright would be perfect for the job. They have a great approach to SG1, and they haven't been involved with the debacle that has been the Trek franchise since DS9 went off the air.

They could come in and work well from within the system, and still give the franchise new life - and a sense of fun.

Give Trek that 3 or 4 year rest that I mentioned after Enterprise goes off the air, and THEN look at bringing it back. Whether it's a new movie first or a new series, there needs to be a break and then a fresh start.

I'm actually a bit surprised that no one else has even commented on Glassner and Wright....
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Old 06-18-03, 02:54 AM
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Group hug time...

I've mentioned this before in other threads, but I'm always impressed and pleased that discussions on these shows often include people who like Babylon 5 and people who like the Trekverse, and that we don't get any of the asinine battle royales that sometimes occur when those two fandoms mix. Most of us sem to like both in some measure, and I find that refreshing.
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Old 06-18-03, 02:15 PM
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Yeah really.

I still think that Glassner and Wright would be perfect for the job. They have a great approach to SG1, and they haven't been involved with the debacle that has been the Trek franchise since DS9 went off the air.
Neither has Behr, Piller (unless you count Insurrection), Wolfe, or Echevarria. Only person who did on the "good guy" list is Moore, who went over to Voyager for an entire TWO EPISODES before realising he made a huge mistake and the rest of the Niners crew were right for not going over :P

But I do agree that those guys would be good. I think even if we did get the others back, some new fresh blood would be great to have in there.
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Old 06-19-03, 01:44 AM
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That's part of the reason I'd like to see Glassner and Wright get the gig - they would have a completely fresh perspective AND they've done a great job with SG1.

The others would all be capable, but their ideas have already been used - been there, done that. Trek needs something new, something not from anyone previously involved in the franchise.

They don't need to reinvent the wheel, but to come at Trek from a different perspective is the most important thing to resurrect the franshise from the doldrums that it's in right now.

That and a break of at least 3 years after Enterprise finishes its run (I'd kill it after 5 seasons - enough for a decent syndication run).
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Old 06-20-03, 11:07 AM
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Personally, I'd like someone familiar with the franchise to do something with it, but someone whose work never fell off the way B&B did.

I'm think a Robert Hewitt Wolfe, here. He was one of the forces that made DS9 a creative powerfouse its final few years. Andromeda also had its best stories when he was in charge and controlling the direction (before Hercules got him booted and the show became awful).

But I do also think that there needs to be an overall influx of new writers and new rules. For instance, no reliance on technobabble to save the day. Futurama joked about how the original Trek would explain its technobabble with a simple metaphor, but that actually worked. The current Trek doesn't even bother to do that. And no more time travel. There needs to be a complete moratorium put on Trek time travel stories.

Realistically, though, I do think the whole franchise needs a rest of 5-10 years. After that, I think the viewing audience will be more receptive and will have had time to let the bad taste of Berman and Braga dissipate.
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Old 06-20-03, 12:24 PM
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Here's the thing - who ISN'T familiar with the franchise?

Glassner and Wright know plenty about Star Trek to do a great job and keep a semblance of continuity.

Going with someone who has already worked on the show in some capacity (writer, producer) will lead to a "samey" kind of feel. It's hard to think outside the box when you're inside the box (and you've been inside for a while).

Trek needs a complete overhaul. New blood is required to do it right. That doesn't mean that some of the people who've worked on it before can't work on it in the future, but the people in charge need to come in with a fresh perspective.

That's why I don't want to see anyone promoted from within this time. The series desperately NEEDS change - a positive change and new ideas that can fit in with what has already been established with the Trek universe.
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