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-   -   The Apple Thread (https://forum.dvdtalk.com/tech-talk/606056-apple-thread.html)

hahn 10-29-12 05:03 PM

The Apple Thread
 
I figure there's enough discussion about Apple, that it warrants a thread. Especially after today's news - Scott Forstall and John Browett are leaving Apple. They didn't give specifics, but they almost certainly were fired. Forstall came under heavy criticism b/c he oversaw Siri and Maps. He was also responsible for the recent out-of-place interface changes ("skeuomorphism") that we saw in some apps like Contacts and Calendars.

Additional good news is that Jony Ive is now taking over Human Interfaces. I think we can expect to see some really great changes coming from this. He's essentially being given complete control over hardware and software. In my view, this is a good thing since I think he's the only person in management that has the design sensibility that defines Apple. Possibly even more so than Steve Jobs.

cungar 10-29-12 05:18 PM

Re: The Apple Thread
 
Wouldn't it be best to segment it into seperate threads for iPhone, iPad, Mac etc.?...


Which is what will happen anyway.

kefrank 10-29-12 05:20 PM

Re: The Apple Thread
 

Originally Posted by cungar (Post 11446972)
Wouldn't it be best to segment it into seperate threads for iPhone, iPad, Mac etc.?...

Isn't that what we already have?

cungar 10-29-12 05:20 PM

Re: The Apple Thread
 

Originally Posted by kefrank (Post 11446976)
Isn't that what we already have?

Pretty much

hahn 10-29-12 05:31 PM

Re: The Apple Thread
 
But in this thread, we don't have to talk about just products. Like what I posted about above isn't about any one product - it's just company news that could produce some interesting results down the road and will affect all product lines - hardware AND software.

I like MacRumors, but the threads grow way too fast and there seem to be 50 different discussions going on at once. The forum being unthreaded only makes it harder to read and post.

RoboDad 10-29-12 06:21 PM

Re: The Apple Thread
 
I think this could be a good thread, especially as Ive's influence starts to show up in iOS and OSX. This news isn't specific to any one device, or even OS. It affects the company as a whole.

Who knows, we might start to see some (small) changes as early as iOS 6.1. For the first time in a long time, Apple is not being viewed as the trendsetter, and there may be a sense of urgency to right the ship.

Supermallet 10-29-12 09:19 PM

Re: The Apple Thread
 
They don't like Siri? I thought Siri was really popular.

Groucho 10-29-12 09:23 PM

Re: The Apple Thread
 
I didn't realize they were branching out in such an unusual direction. Where should I line up, the sewing shop or the Apple store?

hahn 10-29-12 09:24 PM

Re: The Apple Thread
 

Originally Posted by Supermallet (Post 11447263)
They don't like Siri? I thought Siri was really popular.

It is and I've always been satisfied with it, but I only use it for setting appointments and alarms. But just the fact that there are criticisms of it means there's a public perception that it's flawed. And with all things Apple, it gets magnified until it becomes a fatal flaw. I haven't run into any issues with Maps either. I guess they're there if you look hard enough, but until it becomes a hindrance to my day-to-day usage of my phone, it's not a problem for me.

Supermallet 10-29-12 09:49 PM

Re: The Apple Thread
 
I feel like the flaws in the Maps app were far more publicized than any issues with Siri. The only problem I remember hearing about is that Siri increased data usage.

hahn 10-29-12 10:04 PM

Re: The Apple Thread
 

Originally Posted by Supermallet (Post 11447295)
I feel like the flaws in the Maps app were far more publicized than any issues with Siri. The only problem I remember hearing about is that Siri increased data usage.

For me, the biggest flaw of Siri is that it requires an internet connection rather than being built into iOS. I'm hoping that once Siri becomes "good enough" they'll enable it offline. Or least enough of it so that I can use it to txt, set meetings and alarms, and perform simple functions (like searching for a youtube video, or getting driving directions on Maps).

RoboDad 10-29-12 10:44 PM

Re: The Apple Thread
 

Originally Posted by hahn (Post 11447331)
For me, the biggest flaw of Siri is that it requires an internet connection rather than being built into iOS. I'm hoping that once Siri becomes "good enough" they'll enable it offline. Or least enough of it so that I can use it to txt, set meetings and alarms, and perform simple functions (like searching for a youtube video, or getting driving directions on Maps).

That is exactly the cause of the perception that it is flawed. Requiring an internet connection causes slow responses, at least for some people. For me it has always been fairly quick, but I have seen it take 5-10 seconds for some other people at times.

I too hope that they are able to build enough of the intelligence into the phone to handle routine recognition processing offline. I hate to say this, but if Google can do it, why can't Apple?

Mr. Salty 10-30-12 12:51 AM

Re: The Apple Thread
 

Originally Posted by RoboDad (Post 11447374)
That is exactly the cause of the perception that it is flawed. Requiring an internet connection causes slow responses, at least for some people. For me it has always been fairly quick, but I have seen it take 5-10 seconds for some other people at times.

In the first few months after Siri was launched it seemed to only work about half the time. The servers couldn't handle the traffic. Apple has been increasing server capacity and tweaking Siri's responses, but they're still trying to recover from the poor first impression.

RoboDad 10-30-12 02:54 AM

Re: The Apple Thread
 
The irony is that if they focused on getting the voice recognition processing in the phone itself, rather than on the server, then they wouldn't need more capacity.

Groucho 10-30-12 08:22 AM

Re: The Apple Thread
 
Regarding Apple Maps, am I the only one NOT having problems with it? Never been directed to drive into a building or over a cliff or any of the other things that people are screaming about.

Nefarious 10-30-12 09:18 AM

Re: The Apple Thread
 

Originally Posted by RoboDad (Post 11447484)
The irony is that if they focused on getting the voice recognition processing in the phone itself, rather than on the server, then they wouldn't need more capacity.

But doesn't this go against the very nature and point of Siri? The idea that you can ask it the same question dozens of different ways and can pretty much ask it anything? How much storage would it end up taking to build an internal piece that would house that much data and variations, etc.? It seems implausible and then it doesn't have the benefit of being updated every second by the continued questions, answers, etc. that are happening on the cloud/server approach it is currently using.

They launched it as beta and that's how it's behaving.


Originally Posted by Groucho (Post 11447559)
Regarding Apple Maps, am I the only one NOT having problems with it? Never been directed to drive into a building or over a cliff or any of the other things that people are screaming about.


I haven't had many issues with it. The only criticisms I have are that it couldn't find a gas station that was built 2-3 years ago. It had all the others in the chain but not that one (which was the newest). But I've certainly not had any major issues and the turn-by-turn navigation feature is such a major bonus that it far outweighs any negatives I've experienced.

hahn 10-30-12 11:05 AM

Re: The Apple Thread
 

Originally Posted by Groucho (Post 11447559)
Regarding Apple Maps, am I the only one NOT having problems with it? Never been directed to drive into a building or over a cliff or any of the other things that people are screaming about.

I think the problem got magnified because of a couple of high profile errors such as the Washington Monument. Most of the other problems seemed to be cited by people in the UK which we Americans could care less about, whether in politics or in tech. ;) And now it's easy to make jokes about it so that increases the perception of the problem. eg. This tweet: "BREAKING: APPLE MAPS SAYS HURRICANE SANDY TO HIT CALIFORNIA BY MIDNIGHT" True, it's funny, but it only reinforces the perception. Of course, it was on Forstall to make sure the perception didn't crop up to begin with.

hahn 10-30-12 11:08 AM

Re: The Apple Thread
 

Originally Posted by RoboDad (Post 11447484)
The irony is that if they focused on getting the voice recognition processing in the phone itself, rather than on the server, then they wouldn't need more capacity.

Well, to be fair, I think there are a couple of good reasons for keeping it on the server for now. 1) It works like a search engine so Apple can build an index of things people are trying to use their phone for. 2) It builds a voice recognition database so they can improve the voice recognition algorithm.

I think when #2 is improved to their satisfaction, they may build it into iOS at that point and then just cache the index on the phone to be uploaded to Apple servers when there's an internet connection. That's just my guess.

Shazam 10-30-12 11:19 AM

Re: The Apple Thread
 

Originally Posted by Groucho (Post 11447559)
Regarding Apple Maps, am I the only one NOT having problems with it? Never been directed to drive into a building or over a cliff or any of the other things that people are screaming about.

Apple maps doesn't have nearly the amount of stores as Google Maps does (it can't find the Costco in Okotoks, for instance), but other than that the directions have been fine. I never use the 3D view, I'd actually prefer to disable it somehow since I keep activating it with my chub fingers.

But Yelp is a piece of shit and I hate that Apple partnered with them.

Dan 10-30-12 11:22 AM

Re: The Apple Thread
 
There's a Costco in Okotoks?!?!?!
;)

Shazam 10-30-12 11:29 AM

Re: The Apple Thread
 

Originally Posted by SomethingMore (Post 11447756)
There's a Costco in Okotoks?!?!?!
;)

Yes, and it's gloriously quiet.

Psi 10-30-12 11:57 AM

Re: The Apple Thread
 
I wonder when they will release the new iTunes (11?). They mentioned this new version with the launch of the iPhone 5, and said it will released by end of Oct. Well, tomorrow is the last day... I am hoping for a big upgrade over the current iTunes which is getting tired and boring after all these years.

Dan 10-30-12 12:08 PM

Re: The Apple Thread
 

Originally Posted by Shazam (Post 11447767)
Yes, and it's gloriously quiet.

That's like the Home Depot in my area. I don't think I've ever seen more than 20 people in the store at once. Unfortunately people have discovered my nearest Costco, and I can't be bothered to shop there anymore.

On topic: I'm genuinely interested in how Apple handles the next iOS release. Will it be a major change due to new management, or will they slowly phase out the things that Jony Ive and friends dislike? I hope they don't make changes purely to prove that they're "innovating" now that Forstall is gone. I've seen managers do the whole "See! I took over and look how much I've done!" thing. Apple's management must be smarter than that.

They were definitely smart to make the announcement while the stock market is closed. :)

Shazam 10-30-12 12:18 PM

Re: The Apple Thread
 
I hope they get rid of all the skeumorphism. I can't stand that shit.

I'd like to see some sort of built-in file transfer app, but I don't think that'll ever happen.

The ability to remove built-in apps like the pitiful Stock and Weather apps would be great.

Psi 10-30-12 12:43 PM

Re: The Apple Thread
 

Originally Posted by Shazam (Post 11447836)
The ability to remove built-in apps like the pitiful Stock and Weather apps would be great.

And don't force me to put my newspaper apps in a Newstand folder.


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