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HP bails on TouchPad after one month...

Old 08-18-11, 04:47 PM
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HP bails on TouchPad after one month...

HP is getting out of the TouchPad and WebOS phone market...

Thoughts?

http://www.hp.com/hpinfo/newsroom/pr...1/110818b.html
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Old 08-18-11, 04:52 PM
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Re: HP bails on TouchPad after one month...

I'm not surprised. I just hope this means they're working out a deal with other manufacturers to license out to. I'd love to see a Samsung WebOS device. Phone or tablet; or both.
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Old 08-18-11, 05:07 PM
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Re: HP bails on TouchPad after one month...

The new WebOS phones haven't even come out yet. Something must have really scared HP off.
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Old 08-18-11, 05:21 PM
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Re: HP bails on TouchPad after one month...

I read that Best Buy has only sold through 25K of their 270K buy-in of TouchPads and is trying to return them. That's a huge blow, especially after dropping the price.
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Old 08-18-11, 05:23 PM
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Re: HP bails on TouchPad after one month...

Interesting that this comes so close after the news of Google acquiring Motorola mobility.
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Old 08-18-11, 05:57 PM
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Re: HP bails on TouchPad after one month...

Some guy in finance is going to get a nice bonus for running the simulation that showed palm is worth more as a tax loss
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Old 08-18-11, 06:18 PM
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Re: HP bails on TouchPad after one month...

The genius who made the HP TouchPads in Best Buy a non-interactive unit has to be gone by now.
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Old 08-18-11, 08:34 PM
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Re: HP bails on TouchPad after one month...

They may spin off their entire PC division as well. HP shares are taking a huge hit, down 6% on the day and another 10% in after hours trading.
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Old 08-18-11, 08:53 PM
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Re: HP bails on TouchPad after one month...

A shame, since I keep hearing how good WebOS actually is.

Palm really screwed the pooch by putting the Palm Pre only on Sprint during it's release. I think if they went to all carriers they could have had a more successful launch before all the Android madness.
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Old 08-19-11, 09:31 AM
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Re: HP bails on TouchPad after one month...

HP announced the purchase of a UK based software company for an all cash purchase price well above current stock value.

Competitors are having a hard enough time competing with the iPad as it is. Next year will be worse when they release the iPad 3 with a higher resolution screen.
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Old 08-19-11, 09:35 AM
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Re: HP bails on TouchPad after one month...

Interesting info that came out: WebOS ran twice as fast on an iPad 2 that they tested than it did on the Touchpad. It even ran faster in the iPad 2's browser as web app than it did natively on the Touchpad.

http://www.slashgear.com/hp-ipad-2-w...ider-19172970/
HP was painfully aware of the TouchPad‘s hardware shortcomings, insider sources have suggested, with ports of webOS running “over twice as fast” on Apple’s iPad 2....The team was even apparently able to run webOS as a web-app in the iPad 2 browser, where it similarly out-performed native code on the TouchPad slate. At the core of the issue was old hardware: the TouchPad that launched just a few months ago was based on the same specification as Palm’s original tablet plan, from around two years ago.

HP already had the 9.7-inch TouchPad successor in the pipeline, complete with a high-resolution display to take on what’s believed to be a “Retina Display” panel in the iPad 3 and a slimmer, lighter metal chassis... HP had [also] already prepared an overclocked, 1.5GHz TouchPad 4G for AT&T to answer criticisms of the tablet’s potency.

http://www.businessinsider.com/web-os-on-ipad-2011-8
Could WebOS have survived on some ultra-fast hardware?
Possibly, but that still doesn't make up for the fact that there are still barely any apps for WebOS in a world where all people care about are apps.
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Old 08-19-11, 09:57 AM
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Re: HP bails on TouchPad after one month...

^^ Interesting. I also knew that they had a 7" TouchPad ready to go...I believe it was in folks hands already...
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Old 08-19-11, 10:17 AM
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Re: HP bails on TouchPad after one month...

supposedly the A5 CPU in the ipad 2 has features that other ARM CPU's don't have. SIMD I think and a few others.
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Old 08-19-11, 10:22 AM
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Re: HP bails on TouchPad after one month...

It baffles me how a company can make a $12 billion acquisition, tout new products in February, and then fold everything 6 months later. If you couldn't make it work why even buy it to begin with? Based on their direction it doesn't even sound like they're going to benefit from the patents. It's not like they're talking about shifting webOS to the enterprise sphere either.
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Old 08-19-11, 10:31 AM
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Re: HP bails on TouchPad after one month...

Originally Posted by al_bundy View Post
supposedly the A5 CPU in the ipad 2 has features that other ARM CPU's don't have. SIMD I think and a few others.
SIMD has been available since ARMv6, which means ARM11 and all Cortex CPUs (the original iPhone was ARM11):
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ARM11

I think you meant The Advanced SIMD/NEON instruction set, which is newer. However, all Windows Phone 7 smartphones have an ARM CPU with this feature:
http://blogs.msdn.com/b/abhinaba/arc...-in-netcf.aspx
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ARM_arc...IMD_.28NEON.29

The A5 is basically a Cortex A9 CPU, similar to the chips from other manufacturers, although the Tegra 2 is missing the NEON instruction set:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ARM_Cortex-A9_MPCore


All that said, it's doubtful that the WebOS team optimized their port for instruction sets on the A5 that weren't on the Touchpad's CPU. They basically were just porting it over quick and dirty for testing purposes.
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Old 08-19-11, 10:34 AM
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Re: HP bails on TouchPad after one month...

apple was killing them in the PC market and then the ipad came out. i guess the investment bankers said they needed to make a tablet since that was a high margin product unlike most of their PC's. buying Palm on paper was a good decision since they had shipping products and stuff in the pipeline. and it would give them their own OS

but when your competition is selling every product they make and you can barely sell 10% it's time to cut your losses and stop pouring money into a black hole. they will probably write this off as a tax loss for the next few years and make more in tax savings then selling product
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Old 08-19-11, 10:37 AM
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Re: HP bails on TouchPad after one month...

Originally Posted by Jay G. View Post
SIMD has been available since ARMv6, which means ARM11 and all Cortex CPUs (the original iPhone was ARM11):
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ARM11

I think you meant The Advanced SIMD/NEON instruction set, which is newer. However, all Windows Phone 7 smartphones have an ARM CPU with this feature:
http://blogs.msdn.com/b/abhinaba/arc...-in-netcf.aspx
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ARM_arc...IMD_.28NEON.29

The A5 is basically a Cortex A9 CPU, similar to the chips from other manufacturers, although the Tegra 2 is missing the NEON instruction set:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ARM_Cortex-A9_MPCore


All that said, it's doubtful that the WebOS team optimized their port for instruction sets on the A5 that weren't on the Touchpad's CPU. They basically were just porting it over quick and dirty for testing purposes.
Wiki says the Pre had an OMAP CPU from Texas Instruments. i bet the code wasn't optimized for a snapdragon or was too tied to OMAP

slashdot had a story yesterday about how all the ARM CPU's have a lot of differences between them and it's causing problems for the software guys to optimize for all of them
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Old 08-19-11, 10:39 AM
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Re: HP bails on TouchPad after one month...

Apple wasn't killing HP in the PC market.
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Old 08-19-11, 10:39 AM
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Re: HP bails on TouchPad after one month...

Originally Posted by Superman07 View Post
It baffles me how a company can make a [$1.2 billion] acquisition, tout new products in February, and then fold everything 6 months later.
Fixed. You were missing a decimal point there.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palm,_I...uisition_by_HP

HP royally fumbled this acquisition. They simply took too long to get a product to market. By the time the Touchpad launched, the iPad was on its second iteration and there's a dozen or so Android tablets. Even RIM got their Blackberry Playbook out before HP.
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Old 08-19-11, 10:45 AM
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Re: HP bails on TouchPad after one month...

So whens the liquidation start? I'll gladly pick up a TouchPad for $100.
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Old 08-19-11, 10:53 AM
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Re: HP bails on TouchPad after one month...

Originally Posted by al_bundy View Post
Wiki says the Pre had an OMAP CPU from Texas Instruments. i bet the code wasn't optimized for a snapdragon or was too tied to OMAP
The WebOS team had nearly a year a to port and optimize it for the Touchpad (not counting any development done prior to announcement):
http://www.pcworld.com/businesscente...os_tablet.html

Also, that doesn't explain why it ran so fast on an iPad 2, on a CPU that WebOS was definitely not optimized for.
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Old 08-19-11, 10:59 AM
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Re: HP bails on TouchPad after one month...

Originally Posted by RichC2 View Post
So whens the liquidation start? I'll gladly pick up a TouchPad for $100.
It depends on whether anyone wants to liquidate them:

http://www.dailytech.com/article.aspx?newsid=22492
HP says [the remaining Touchpads' fate] will be up to its sales partners... It will give them a case payout for the devices, which they can either return to HP or using the cash, sell the stock at fire sale prices... the rough edges of the TouchPad may become lovable quirks, if it's offered for, say, $150 USD.
I wonder if someone will create an Android port for it, since WebOS is just going to become increasingly outdated on it, and app development for WebOS is going to vanish.
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Old 08-19-11, 11:21 AM
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Re: HP bails on TouchPad after one month...

Originally Posted by Chrisedge View Post
Apple wasn't killing HP in the PC market.
units shipped apple is way behind HP. but if you look at the profits then apple takes home most of the profits in the desktop/laptop market. if not most then enough to leave everyone else with the crumbs.

apple makes a nice profit on every single computer they sell. HP sells most of their computers for little or no profit. most of their high end computer customers went Mac over the last few years.

even unit volume of computers over $1000 i think apple leads in that category. and that's where most of the profits are

same with phones. last i read apple takes home 66% of all cell phone profits.

it's an old business strategy. even disney did something like this years ago

Last edited by al_bundy; 08-19-11 at 11:26 AM.
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Old 08-19-11, 11:24 AM
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Re: HP bails on TouchPad after one month...

Originally Posted by Jay G. View Post
The WebOS team had nearly a year a to port and optimize it for the Touchpad (not counting any development done prior to announcement):
http://www.pcworld.com/businesscente...os_tablet.html

Also, that doesn't explain why it ran so fast on an iPad 2, on a CPU that WebOS was definitely not optimized for.

i've read that qualcomm impements the ARM instruction set, but their CPU's are extremely customized compared to other ARM vendors. the A4 and A5 are closer to ARM reference designs than snapdragons

the reason HP bailed so fast is the rule is you never take on an entrenched competitor unless you can find a niche that they don't address. Apple got it's foothold in the computer business because dell and HP made it their mission to make the experience of buying their most expensive systems as painful as possible and there was the hysteria about vista. even then apple is not trying to go into the low end of the market probably because they do a lot of business with microsoft.

Last edited by al_bundy; 08-19-11 at 11:37 AM.
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Old 08-19-11, 01:57 PM
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Re: HP bails on TouchPad after one month...

Originally Posted by RichC2 View Post
So whens the liquidation start? I'll gladly pick up a TouchPad for $100.
same here. i'm pretty happy with my pixi that i got for $32 without contract. hard to find a wifi capable mp3 player,and Pandora and and Spotify. it can be used as a web browser or mail too, but it's pretty slow for that.
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