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Is now the time to buy a Pentium 4?

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Is now the time to buy a Pentium 4?

Old 01-05-02, 09:07 PM
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Is now the time to buy a Pentium 4?

I remember awhile ago people were saying that the motherboard was going to change, or that the pentium 4 would soon be compatible with the more common ram type.

Well, is it now the right time to buy one? Or will things be changing again soon in the next couple of months? Thanks.
Old 01-05-02, 09:16 PM
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I heard that a price drop was happening this next week on the P4 so I would wait.

of course I could give you my "never" answer and talk about the faster Athlon
Old 01-05-02, 09:17 PM
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Originally posted by gcribbs
of course I could give you my "never" answer and talk about the faster Athlon
I could do the same
Old 01-05-02, 09:22 PM
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for home users:

athlon has had the edge on speed this past year.. even though they are trying to be sneaky with their naming scheme on the XP processors (a crappy move in my opinion).. currently.. the amd chips are the way to go..

the new intel core will put intel back on top, for at least the next year.. at least until amd releases hammer (their 64bit chip).. and then it will be up to intel to see if they will match it..

if your going to buy a p4.. hold off a little longer and grab one of the newer northwind chips.. these are going at .13, while the amd chips are still at .18..

if you read my post about overclocking to 3 gigs.. youll see the capabilities of the new intel core.. and why they will be back on top for at least the next year..


for business users:
still not an issue.. 90+% of all business workstations and servers are intel chips.. and will continue to be that way for at least the near future.
Old 01-05-02, 09:42 PM
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Originally posted by twikoff
.. even though they are trying to be sneaky with their naming scheme on the XP processors (a crappy move in my opinion).. currently.. the amd chips are the way to go..
just today i was in bestbuy and i overheard a customer ask a salesguy what computer he should buy, and the response was "just look at the hertz, the higher the better." to every question, this was his only answer.

sure, AMD is dumbing things down a bit, but if you had a product that is CHEAPER and FASTER at any particular clockspeed than Intel, you'd probably be frustrated by idiotic salespeople like the guy mentioned above.

as to the OP, you need to decide when the right time for YOU to buy is--part of buying a computer is the fact that in 6 months you'll see computers much faster than what you bought, for lower prices. if you forever wait for the right time, you'll never have a new computer... but you'll sure save a heck of a lot of money :>
Old 01-05-02, 09:45 PM
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Glad to hear AMD has some followers!!! Woo-hoo!! I work there.

Old 01-05-02, 09:47 PM
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Cool, can you get free samples for us?


Dave
Originally posted by Rupin
Glad to hear AMD has some followers!!! Woo-hoo!! I work there.

Old 01-05-02, 09:48 PM
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but everyone is use to the naming scheme being that the number in the name representing the clock speed.. when that is no longer true.. amd is taking it upon themselves to be deceptive because they think its their given right, for having better ipc

i dont think the ends justify the means in this case.. I think its a dirty trick.. when you tell someone how fast your computer is.. you tell them in mhz.. but with the xp processor.. few people actually realize that the speed in mhz really isnt all that close to what the name implies.
Old 01-05-02, 10:02 PM
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Originally posted by twikoff
but everyone is use to the naming scheme being that the number in the name representing the clock speed.. when that is no longer true.. amd is taking it upon themselves to be deceptive because they think its their given right, for having better ipc

i dont think the ends justify the means in this case.. I think its a dirty trick.. when you tell someone how fast your computer is.. you tell them in mhz.. but with the xp processor.. few people actually realize that the speed in mhz really isnt all that close to what the name implies.
but i hope you understand the frustration a company like AMD has when they build a better cpu that outperforms the Intel cpu and a minimum wage salesperson says the 1.5 Ghz Intel must be better than the 1.4 Ghz Athlon because it is .1 Ghz faster

I also do not really like the naming convention however i understand it.

sucks that people who walk by the salespeople know more than they do. I often interrupt them giving misinformation and openly correct them. then I even will spend a few minutes giving my advice much to the dismay of the salesperson.
Old 01-05-02, 10:05 PM
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Originally posted by gcribbs


but i hope you understand the frustration a company like AMD has when they build a better cpu that outperforms the Intel cpu and a minimum wage salesperson says the 1.5 Ghz Intel must be better than the 1.4 Ghz Athlon because it is .1 Ghz faster
yes.. that does suck for amd.. but it still doesnt give them any excuse to deceive the customers

maybe they should work harder to get the word out

although I guess with northwind, that would be a bad move.. they probably need to sit back now and wait for the hammer to be released
Old 01-05-02, 10:16 PM
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Originally posted by twikoff


yes.. that does suck for amd.. but it still doesnt give them any excuse to deceive the customers

maybe they should work harder to get the word out

although I guess with northwind, that would be a bad move.. they probably need to sit back now and wait for the hammer to be released
other than the ability to run at even faster clock speeds what has Intel improved in the northwind?
it will still be slower than the Athlon at anywhere near the same speed right. a 2 Ghz northwind will run slower than the athlon XP 2000+ which runs at 1.53 Ghz right?

so is it because you will be able to be overclock it enough to make up for this?
Old 01-06-02, 12:47 AM
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Originally posted by Rupin
Glad to hear AMD has some followers!!! Woo-hoo!! I work there.

YES!
Old 01-06-02, 03:12 AM
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Intel debuted the P4 processor with the original Willamette core made on a .18 micron and delivered in a 423 pin package. This was the one that everyone said to avoid since it wasn't that much faster than a P3 and Intel would soon be changing to a new 478 pin package.

Around fall of last year, Intel started selling P4's in the new 478 pin package. These P4's were still the .18 micron Willamette core, only in a package that would smooth the transition to the new 478 pin sockets to be used in the new version of the P4.

Sometime next week, Intel will be launching the new version of the P4. This chip is the new Northwood core with 512 KB cache (as opposed to Willamette's 256 KB) and manufactured on a .13 micron process. However, like they did with the Coppermine and Tualatin P3's, they're sticking with just the P4 name and only differentiating the new CPU's in the model number.

According to Mike Magee at The Inquirer, the new Northwood P4 will debut at a top speed of 2.2 GHz at $562. Apparently, Intel will be waiting until the 27th to adjust the prices of the older CPU's downwards a bit. For those of you who don't know, The Inquirer and it's sibling The Register are industry rumor rags so take this last bit of info FWIW.
Old 01-06-02, 03:23 AM
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Originally posted by belboz
Intel debuted the P4 processor with the original Willamette core made on a .18 micron and delivered in a 423 pin package. This was the one that everyone said to avoid since it wasn't that much faster than a P3 and Intel would soon be changing to a new 478 pin package.

Around fall of last year, Intel started selling P4's in the new 478 pin package. These P4's were still the .18 micron Willamette core, only in a package that would smooth the transition to the new 478 pin sockets to be used in the new version of the P4.

Sometime next week, Intel will be launching the new version of the P4. This chip is the new Northwood core with 512 KB cache (as opposed to Willamette's 256 KB) and manufactured on a .13 micron process. However, like they did with the Coppermine and Tualatin P3's, they're sticking with just the P4 name and only differentiating the new CPU's in the model number.

According to Mike Magee at The Inquirer, the new Northwood P4 will debut at a top speed of 2.2 GHz at $562. Apparently, Intel will be waiting until the 27th to adjust the prices of the older CPU's downwards a bit. For those of you who don't know, The Inquirer and it's sibling The Register are industry rumor rags so take this last bit of info FWIW.
so this is not just a change from .18 to .13 they have changed the core and added more cache. I assume they made other changes to improve performance.

so this might be a faster chip.

glad to know Intel might actually make a good cpu again. i figured they had lost the edge after the P3.

not sure I will give up on AMD but the competition will be good for us consumers

now I hope they are easy to overclock!
Old 01-06-02, 08:33 AM
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Originally posted by gcribbs


so this is not just a change from .18 to .13 they have changed the core and added more cache. I assume they made other changes to improve performance.

so this might be a faster chip.

now I hope they are easy to overclock!
yep.. this is why I was saying to hold off just a little longer.. because the intel chips are going to be back well ahead with the new core..

and as far as overclocking.. I posted a link in another thread, to a site that has already overclocked the 2.2 chip to 3 ghz..

and the benchmarks were unbelievable
Old 01-06-02, 03:30 PM
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Originally posted by belboz
Intel debuted the P4 processor with the original Willamette core made on a .18 micron and delivered in a 423 pin package. This was the one that everyone said to avoid since it wasn't that much faster than a P3 and Intel would soon be changing to a new 478 pin package.

Around fall of last year, Intel started selling P4's in the new 478 pin package. These P4's were still the .18 micron Willamette core, only in a package that would smooth the transition to the new 478 pin sockets to be used in the new version of the P4.

Sometime next week, Intel will be launching the new version of the P4. This chip is the new Northwood core with 512 KB cache (as opposed to Willamette's 256 KB) and manufactured on a .13 micron process. However, like they did with the Coppermine and Tualatin P3's, they're sticking with just the P4 name and only differentiating the new CPU's in the model number.

According to Mike Magee at The Inquirer, the new Northwood P4 will debut at a top speed of 2.2 GHz at $562. Apparently, Intel will be waiting until the 27th to adjust the prices of the older CPU's downwards a bit. For those of you who don't know, The Inquirer and it's sibling The Register are industry rumor rags so take this last bit of info FWIW.
Thank you very much. This was the information I was looking for.

BTW, what are the model numbers for the different chips? Is it easy to tell apart?
Old 01-06-02, 08:14 PM
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I really haven't been following the P4 developments as closely of late since I still expect to be buying Athlons for the next year. So I'm not really sure, but I don't believe that Intel has done anything to the P4 except expand the cache. Of course, the lower power dissipation "feature" that you get free with a die shrink is sort of nice too.

Apparently the 2 GHz Willamette will be the last of that line. There will be a 2 GHz Northwood as well as a 2.2 GHz Northwood when those are introduced (probably tomorrow). I believe that Intel will be calling the newer 2 GHz Northwood a Pentium 4 2.0A while the 2.2 GHz Northwood will just be the Pentium 4 2.2.

If you're still a bit worried about getting the right CPU, just check the L2 cache. If it's 256K, it's Willamette, if it'2 512K, it's Northwood.

BTW, for the best performance, you'll want to get a mainboard using Intel's i850 chipset and a pair of PC800 RDRAM RIMMs, but of course, that's expensive. Intel released an i845 board this summer that accepts regular SDRAM, but the performance of that board quite frankly sucked. They've recently released the updated version, i845D, that uses the faster DDR-SDRAM that Athlon platforms have been using. Boards using this chipset perform much more respectably but still lag slightly behind the i850. They are however, a bit less expensive so they're well worth considering.

When their NDA lapses tomorrow, I suspect that we'll see a flood of reviews from the various hardware sites comparing the new P4 2.2 vs. the Athlon XP 2000. It'll be close.

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