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New California budget deal includes sales tax at Amazon.com

Old 06-29-11, 05:58 PM
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New California budget deal includes sales tax at Amazon.com

I just learned the new budget deal in California is going to include a new law to collect online sales tax from online stores, including Amazon.com. I know Amazon has been fighting this and has threatened to cut ties with affiliates located in the state. This will definitely make me think twice about future purchases at Amazon or any other stores that collect sales tax online. I already pay sales tax on B&N.com purchases but always take the tax into consideration before completing the order that I'm getting the lowest price overall. Apparently our governor is going to sign this into law.

http://www.accountingtoday.com/news/...x-58981-1.html

California Budget Deal Includes ‘Amazon Tax’
Sacramento, Calif. (June 28, 2011)

By Michael Cohn, Accounting Today

California Governor Jerry Brown and Democratic lawmakers have struck a deal to close the state’s estimated $15 billion budget deficit, including provisions to force online retailers like Amazon.com to collect sales tax from customers

California lawmakers approved an online sales tax bill earlier this month and sent it to the governor’s desk, but Brown did not immediately sign it into law. The tax would bring in an estimated $200 million a year. The bill would allow California to collect taxes from any online retailer that has nexus with an affiliate site in California. Amazon.com and Overstock.com have been dropping their affiliates in several other states in a bid to fight against such laws.

The bill also includes two other bills that were also passed by the California State Legislature that would require online retailers that have corporate subsidiaries and distribution centers in a state to collect sales tax from customers, along with another bill that clarifies when other kinds of physical presence require a sales tax to be collected. The three bills were combined into one and sent to Brown's desk earlier this month.

The budget deal reportedly struck by Brown and Democratic lawmakers Monday was brokered without support from Republican lawmakers, but the Democratic legislators may be able to provide enough votes to get it passed, according to the Los Angeles Times. Brown had planned to call a special election later this year with tax increases on the ballot, but reportedly has abandoned that idea for now. He had wanted voters to approve the extension of several temporary tax increases that were due to expire this month, including an extra 1 percentage point sales tax increase. However, he was unable to attract the two Republican votes he needed in both the State Assembly and the Senate to allow a budget with those tax increases to go forward.

The tax increases may go on the ballot in November 2012, when they are more likely to pass with more voters heading to the polls for the presidential election.

The budget deal relies on an extra $4 billion in tax revenue that is expected from the state’s gradually improving economy. However, if the extra tax revenue does not materialize, there would be drastic cuts to programs such as education.

Other parts of the budget reportedly include an extra $12 fee for automobile owners to register their vehicles, and a new firefighting fee for residents in areas prone to wildfires. With the extension of the temporary tax increases left out of the bill, Democratic legislators were able to pass the budget deal on Tuesday with a simple majority vote.
Old 06-29-11, 06:49 PM
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Re: New California budget deal includes sales tax at Amazon.com

I'm surprised more states aren't doing this, to be honest.
Old 06-29-11, 07:06 PM
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Re: New California budget deal includes sales tax at Amazon.com

No sales tax is probably the biggest reason I shop online, but I knew it had to end some time. Too much money left on the table to leave it alone.
Old 06-29-11, 07:27 PM
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Re: New California budget deal includes sales tax at Amazon.com

I don't know why they bother. The can't seem to manage the money they already get. I have no doubt that taxes collected via online purchases won't change anything. They'll still be coming up short.
Old 06-29-11, 10:18 PM
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Re: New California budget deal includes sales tax at Amazon.com

Amazon is just cutting affiliates.

Which is just so awesome! Now, more people will lose their job and possibly move out of state. Amazon will continue to be tax-free. Good job guys!
Old 06-30-11, 05:24 AM
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Re: New California budget deal includes sales tax at Amazon.com

Looks like Amazon and Overstock just dropped all their California affiliates.

Online retailers strike back at new tax

Reacting swiftly to an online sales tax signed into law Wednesday by Gov. Jerry Brown, Amazon.com and Overstock.com announced they are severing their relationships with California affiliates to avoid having to collect the tax.

..........................

The State Board of Equalization estimates there are 25,000 affiliates in California, 10,000 of whom make money by being affiliates with Amazon.

"We oppose this bill because it is unconstitutional and counterproductive," Amazon said in an email to its affiliates. "It is supported by big-box retailers, most of which are based outside California, that seek to harm the affiliate advertising programs of their competitors."

Utah-based Overstock.com, which did $1 billion in online business last year, sent a similar note to its California affiliates Wednesday.

"We think this law is unconstitutional," said Mark Griffin, Overstock's general counsel. "We sent a final note to our California affiliates today. It's a business decision that we had to make."

Ken Rockwell, a La Jolla resident who writes a popular blog about cameras and photography, earns most of his income by being an affiliate. His blog links to retailers like Amazon and B&H Photo-Video, which has a large retail store in New York as well as a robust online sales operation. He's still trying to understand the impact of the law, but assumes that he'll no longer earn money from Amazon.

"This is not good for anybody, and it affects the companies who pay me," said Rockwell, 49, who has blogged about photography full time for 10 years. "It seems like the government is messing with something that it really doesn't understand. A lot of people make a few dollars here and there by being affiliates, and they really need the money."

FULL ARTICLE - http://www.mercurynews.com/business/...nclick_check=1
Old 06-30-11, 09:36 AM
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Re: New California budget deal includes sales tax at Amazon.com

I lose both ways. I'm in Washington State so I pay tax anyway, but I've been using affiliates more often and now the options will be reduced.

EDIT: Wrong, I'm not using affiliates, I'm using third-party sellers. I go to Amazon directly or the affiliates I use are located in WA so I won't be directly affected.

Last edited by davidh777; 07-06-11 at 01:09 PM.
Old 06-30-11, 12:03 PM
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Re: New California budget deal includes sales tax at Amazon.com

Another article, this one from LA Times http://www.latimes.com/business/la-f...,4344787.story

Looks like I will be going back to BB and Target for movies since Amazon matches those deals anyways. Unless Amazon can offer a 30 day price match guarantee I really see no reason to shop there anymore (for movies anyways, at least with games they offer credit towards your next game purchase).
Old 06-30-11, 01:14 PM
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Re: New California budget deal includes sales tax at Amazon.com

Get used to it. The states are eying more and more revenue streams, and online sales are a big one. They come with the deniability that it's an actual tax increase and instead just enforcing pre-existing taxes.
Old 06-30-11, 02:31 PM
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Re: New California budget deal includes sales tax at Amazon.com

Looks like I was misunderstanding part of it...so they dropped their affiliates so they could keep customers tax free? That is how I'm understanding it now.

CA is getting desperate and at the same time driving all their customers and population away. Not good.
Old 06-30-11, 04:29 PM
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Re: New California budget deal includes sales tax at Amazon.com

Originally Posted by quid squid
Looks like I was misunderstanding part of it...so they dropped their affiliates so they could keep customers tax free? That is how I'm understanding it now.

CA is getting desperate and at the same time driving all their customers and population away. Not good.
From what I heard yesterday that appears what Amazon is going to do to prevent collecting taxes in California. Also sales tax in California is supposed to drop by 1% on July 1.
Old 06-30-11, 09:12 PM
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Re: New California budget deal includes sales tax at Amazon.com

Originally Posted by quid squid
CA is getting desperate and at the same time driving all their customers and population away. Not good.
The only problem is, you guys are coming over and ruining Oregon. Get off my lawn!!!
Old 07-01-11, 02:49 AM
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Re: New California budget deal includes sales tax at Amazon.com

This article claims Amazon is supposed to start collecting taxes if they like it or not. I heard yesterday that Amazon intends to thumb their nose at the law and not collect the sales tax.

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/articl...BUI31K4P1U.DTL

Internet sellers must collect tax, like it or not

Andrew S. Ross, Chronicle Columnist

Thursday, June 30, 2011

Beginning today, Amazon.com is supposed to start collecting sales tax on goods it sells in California.

So are Overstock.com and other out-of-state online retailers and catalog houses doing business here. Ready or not, like it or not, it's now the law.

First payments will be due by the end of October, 30 days after the close of the third quarter, according to the State Board of Equalization, the state agency in charge of implementing the "e-fairness" law.

Amazon and Overstock, which announced they have cut off their California affiliates, are by no means alone. Approximately 2,000 letters and questionnaires are to be sent to individual out-of-state online retailers nationwide, to ascertain whether they fit the criteria outlined in the law.

The process will take some time, board officials said - they've been given a meager $1,000 out of the general fund to get the law up and running - but suggest companies start collecting now to meet their October bill.

"Any retailer that falls under the new criteria should begin collecting the (sales) tax as of July 1," spokeswoman Anita Gore said.

According to the law, an out-of-state online retailer with any kind of "nexus" in the state - a physical or corporate presence, not just a brick-and-mortar retail outlet - is liable. With one exception: retailers who have sold no more than $500,000 worth of goods in California in the previous 12 months. (Full text of the law, ABX1 28, at sfg.ly/kkSCkM.)

The concession was aimed primarily at San Jose's eBay, a strong opponent of all such online tax proposals, saying they hurt the company's "business model," which relies on individuals and small businesses selling stuff on their auction site. Ebay initially pushed for an exemption of $2 million.

In a statement Thursday, an eBay vice president, Tod Cohen, said, "We believe this exclusion covers the vast majority of all eBay sellers." But his statement added that eBay "is committed to protecting all sellers from unconstitutional sales tax laws."

Unclear on the concept: Apart from calling it "counterproductive," the law apparently "will not cause our retail business to collect sales tax for the state," according to Paul Misener, Amazon's vice president for global public policy.

Perhaps Misener believes tossing 25,000 heretofore loyal California "associates" over the side is enough to do the trick. Or, maybe he's not aware of that part of the law referring to any entity "that - either by itself or through a subsidiary (in California) - designs or develops products sold by the retailer."

On Amazon's corporate website, under "United States Subsidiaries," we find four California locations for A2Z Development Center Inc. - "an innovative customer-centric software development company" - including in San Francisco and Cupertino, where the Kindle was developed; a search engine technology company called A9.com in Palo Alto; and, in San Francisco, Alexa, another Amazon search company.

We don't know whether Amazon intends to close them down, or move them out of state - it didn't respond to a request for comment about its intentions toward the law, for example, whether it will be setting sales tax money aside beginning today.

Assurances: The real victims, so far, are Amazon's and Overstock's affiliates.

Utah's Overstock wouldn't say how many of them there are in California, except they number "in the hundreds." One wonders what Alameda County officials, who sold the naming rights to the Oakland Coliseum (now O.co Coliseum) for a song, are thinking about that.

According to Amazon's Dear John e-mail sent out Wednesday, "As of the termination date, California residents will no longer receive advertising fees for sales referred to Amazon.com, Endless.com, MYHABIT.COM or SmallParts.com."

But it goes on to assure the affiliates, "all qualifying advertising fees earned on or before the termination date will be processed and paid in full in accordance with the regular payment schedule."

Amazon and Overstock affiliates looking for alternatives might heed the advice of Board of Equalization member and former Chairwoman Betty Yee: "Other major retailers such as Sears, Barnes & Noble, Best Buy and Walmart have all extended invitations for these affiliates to join their network programs," she said in a statement Thursday.

Yee could have added Target, which has also opened its arms to those being spurned. Expect to see more invitations and full-page ads from these and other retailers in the near future.

Other options: Some affiliates are calling for more direct action. San Francisco writer and best-selling author Michelle Richmond is calling on fellow members of Word of Mouth Bay Area, a writers group, to delete Amazon links from their websites.

Said her e-mail to the group: "Amazon needs to know that the people who write and sell books (not to mention music, movies, etc) don't (think) Amazon and other big internet retailers deserve the unfair edge they get by not taxing products sold online in other states."
Old 07-01-11, 04:46 AM
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Re: New California budget deal includes sales tax at Amazon.com

I've lived in California my entire life... I support Amazon.com 100-fucking-%.

Send a message... BOYCOTT RETAIL IN CALIFORNIA!!!

Fuck Jerry Brown, and fuck those who voted for him.

They (The State of California) wouldn't need to fight this fight if they would just cut, and by cut, I mean eliminate all the welfare programs this State has. Survival of the fittest baby! With the exception of those who are physically beyond being self sufficient... basically those who are vegetables. Listen, I've been to Walmart and they have mentally handicapped greeters at the door so don't tell me it can't be done.

Every single one of those lazy welfare mother fuckers with their hands out are not only destroying California, they're destroying this entire country and they're enabled 100% by the Leftist Democrats who create the socialist policy's that are bankrupting this system.

I easily make 75% of my purchases online. And the sole reason... to avoid the 10% ass rape tax that The State of California charges.

Just this morning I purchased (online) a part for my MINI Cooper from a dealer in New Jersey!!! Remember, I live in California... but I'm saving $20 in taxes shopping out of State. And, that MINI dealership is shipping the part to me for free (and it's a part that weighs ten pounds)! Fuck you California!

Boycott retail in California... I'll still buy food here (obviously), but food isn't taxed at the grocery store. So take that Jerry Brown, you fuck, huzzah!

And if boycotting retail leads to even more people leaving this once great State, good, less traffic for me to deal with.

I really do hope what Amazon.com did today forces people to move out of State... if enough do, then hopefully the fucking retards that run this State will wake up and realize they truly are retarded. They've been forcing people and entire industries out of this State for the better part of the last 20 years.

Oh, and guess who gets to bail The State of California out when it goes broke... the other 49 States!!! (Keep in mind it's already bankrupt, but I'll leave my "I told you" for the inevitable thread).
Old 07-01-11, 10:34 AM
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Re: New California budget deal includes sales tax at Amazon.com

Originally Posted by hal9000
I've lived in California my entire life... I support Amazon.com 100-fucking-%.

Send a message... BOYCOTT RETAIL IN CALIFORNIA!!!

Fuck Jerry Brown, and fuck those who voted for him.

They (The State of California) wouldn't need to fight this fight if they would just cut, and by cut, I mean eliminate all the welfare programs this State has. Survival of the fittest baby! With the exception of those who are physically beyond being self sufficient... basically those who are vegetables. Listen, I've been to Walmart and they have mentally handicapped greeters at the door so don't tell me it can't be done.

Every single one of those lazy welfare mother fuckers with their hands out are not only destroying California, they're destroying this entire country and they're enabled 100% by the Leftist Democrats who create the socialist policy's that are bankrupting this system.

I easily make 75% of my purchases online. And the sole reason... to avoid the 10% ass rape tax that The State of California charges.

Just this morning I purchased (online) a part for my MINI Cooper from a dealer in New Jersey!!! Remember, I live in California... but I'm saving $20 in taxes shopping out of State. And, that MINI dealership is shipping the part to me for free (and it's a part that weighs ten pounds)! Fuck you California!

Boycott retail in California... I'll still buy food here (obviously), but food isn't taxed at the grocery store. So take that Jerry Brown, you fuck, huzzah!

And if boycotting retail leads to even more people leaving this once great State, good, less traffic for me to deal with.

I really do hope what Amazon.com did today forces people to move out of State... if enough do, then hopefully the fucking retards that run this State will wake up and realize they truly are retarded. They've been forcing people and entire industries out of this State for the better part of the last 20 years.

Oh, and guess who gets to bail The State of California out when it goes broke... the other 49 States!!! (Keep in mind it's already bankrupt, but I'll leave my "I told you" for the inevitable thread).
This is a good example of why Dave Bowman had to unplug him ...
Old 07-01-11, 12:10 PM
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Re: New California budget deal includes sales tax at Amazon.com

We have a city nearby that tried doing something similar. Instead of taxes, they were making businesses buy a license. So lots of small businesses that don't have a store there but do service in the city, decided to stop doing business there instead, since the licensing fees weren't enough to make it worthwhile.
Old 07-01-11, 01:33 PM
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Re: New California budget deal includes sales tax at Amazon.com

Originally Posted by LASERMOVIES
This article claims Amazon is supposed to start collecting taxes if they like it or not. I heard yesterday that Amazon intends to thumb their nose at the law and not collect the sales tax.

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/articl...BUI31K4P1U.DTL
This will end up taking years in court to sort out. How exactly does the state of California have the authority to require a business domiciled outside of their state (and with no presence in their state) to collect sales taxes for the state?
Old 07-01-11, 01:45 PM
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Re: New California budget deal includes sales tax at Amazon.com

I'm not sure if the Amazon sales tax for California was implemented beginning today, July 1, so I placed a big order yesterday just in case.
Old 07-01-11, 05:42 PM
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Re: New California budget deal includes sales tax at Amazon.com

Originally Posted by hal9000
They (The State of California) wouldn't need to fight this fight if they would just cut, and by cut, I mean eliminate all the welfare programs this State has. Survival of the fittest baby!
I'd love to see how long you last in such a society, where the people who are not only poor, but now DESPERATE (thanks to your ending of welfare) would be running amok in the streets and breaking into YOUR home for food and money. I wonder who's more "fit" to survive. The lone angry tea-partier trying to defend his home, or the throng of starving bashing in every window. Otherwise, good plan.
Old 07-01-11, 05:42 PM
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Re: New California budget deal includes sales tax at Amazon.com

It wasn't and will not be.

Regardless, they will likely charge as it ships, not when placed anyway.
Old 07-01-11, 06:05 PM
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Re: New California budget deal includes sales tax at Amazon.com

What percentage of the California budget goes to welfare? Based on the angry ranting above, I'm guessing it's 90-95%?
Old 07-02-11, 01:12 AM
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Re: New California budget deal includes sales tax at Amazon.com

Originally Posted by hal9000
I've lived in California my entire life... I support Amazon.com 100-fucking-%.

Send a message... BOYCOTT RETAIL IN CALIFORNIA!!!

Fuck Jerry Brown, and fuck those who voted for him.
.
Old 07-02-11, 03:26 AM
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Re: New California budget deal includes sales tax at Amazon.com

Originally Posted by Groucho
What percentage of the California budget goes to welfare? Based on the angry ranting above, I'm guessing it's 90-95%?
Give us a little more time. We're getting there.

http://articles.ocregister.com/2010-...welfare-reform

The numbers tell a bleak story. In 1996, California had 21 percent of the nation's welfare cases. Today, 32 percent of all welfare cases in the United States are in California, even though we only represent 12 percent of the total U.S. population. Consider this troubling comparison; California is nearly twice as big as New York state, but we have five times as many welfare cases.
Old 07-02-11, 11:23 AM
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Re: New California budget deal includes sales tax at Amazon.com

Originally Posted by hal9000
I've lived in California my entire life... I support Amazon.com 100-fucking-%.

Send a message... BOYCOTT RETAIL IN CALIFORNIA!!!

Fuck Jerry Brown, and fuck those who voted for him.

They (The State of California) wouldn't need to fight this fight if they would just cut, and by cut, I mean eliminate all the welfare programs this State has. Survival of the fittest baby! With the exception of those who are physically beyond being self sufficient... basically those who are vegetables. Listen, I've been to Walmart and they have mentally handicapped greeters at the door so don't tell me it can't be done.

Every single one of those lazy welfare mother fuckers with their hands out are not only destroying California, they're destroying this entire country and they're enabled 100% by the Leftist Democrats who create the socialist policy's that are bankrupting this system.

I easily make 75% of my purchases online. And the sole reason... to avoid the 10% ass rape tax that The State of California charges.

Just this morning I purchased (online) a part for my MINI Cooper from a dealer in New Jersey!!! Remember, I live in California... but I'm saving $20 in taxes shopping out of State. And, that MINI dealership is shipping the part to me for free (and it's a part that weighs ten pounds)! Fuck you California!

Boycott retail in California... I'll still buy food here (obviously), but food isn't taxed at the grocery store. So take that Jerry Brown, you fuck, huzzah!

And if boycotting retail leads to even more people leaving this once great State, good, less traffic for me to deal with.

I really do hope what Amazon.com did today forces people to move out of State... if enough do, then hopefully the fucking retards that run this State will wake up and realize they truly are retarded. They've been forcing people and entire industries out of this State for the better part of the last 20 years.

Oh, and guess who gets to bail The State of California out when it goes broke... the other 49 States!!! (Keep in mind it's already bankrupt, but I'll leave my "I told you" for the inevitable thread).


I shop online as much as possible. I can't stand paying taxes knowing where the money is likely going.
Old 07-02-11, 12:52 PM
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Re: New California budget deal includes sales tax at Amazon.com

Originally Posted by Kmical
This is a good example of why Dave Bowman had to unplug him ...

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