Netflix IPO -- It's all over now
03-08-02, 12:39 PM
#1
DVD Talk Hero
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 1999
Location: Not necessarily Formerly known as Solid Snake
Posts: 29,256
Received 1,244 Likes
on
855 Posts
Netflix IPO -- It's all over now
http://www.hive4media.com/index.cfm?sec_id=2
Netflix has again filed for an IPO for stock in their company. I have long contended that IPOs and turning a private company into a public one begins the downward spiral. No longer does the company answer to the customer, just the stockholder.
03-08-02, 12:56 PM
#2
Cool New Member
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Brooklyn, Ny
Posts: 37
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
2 dif . things
You are incorrect in you assumptions. When the public company's customer or any other service deteriorates it results in lost revenue. Then the stock market is reacting quickly in punishing the company.
Therefore the conclusion is that the public company has to try hard if not harder to achieve profitability and access to the public investments.
Regards,
Therefore the conclusion is that the public company has to try hard if not harder to achieve profitability and access to the public investments.
Regards,
03-08-02, 01:28 PM
#3
DVD Talk Legend
Re: 2 dif . things
Originally posted by Plohish
You are incorrect in you assumptions. When the public company's customer or any other service deteriorates it results in lost revenue. Then the stock market is reacting quickly in punishing the company.
You are incorrect in you assumptions. When the public company's customer or any other service deteriorates it results in lost revenue. Then the stock market is reacting quickly in punishing the company.
Therefore the conclusion is that the public company has to try hard if not harder to achieve profitability and access to the public investments.Regards,
03-08-02, 05:26 PM
#4
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2001
Posts: 443
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Amazon turned a pro-forma profit their last quarter. There still is the huge amt of debt to pay down, but that's true of a lot of companies.
I don't see how they're ever going to go out of business, unless people stop buying over the 'net.
I don't see how they're ever going to go out of business, unless people stop buying over the 'net.
03-08-02, 06:30 PM
#5
Member
Join Date: Mar 2000
Posts: 73
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Amazon's So-Called "Profit". Vive Le Euro!
Originally posted by happypants
Amazon turned a pro-forma profit their last quarter. There still is the huge amt of debt to pay down, but that's true of a lot of companies.
I don't see how they're ever going to go out of business, unless people stop buying over the 'net.
Amazon turned a pro-forma profit their last quarter. There still is the huge amt of debt to pay down, but that's true of a lot of companies.
I don't see how they're ever going to go out of business, unless people stop buying over the 'net.
StockPickReport.Com Announces Investment Opinion: Amazon.Com: ``We Would Have Reported a Fourth Quarter GAAP Net Loss''
SHREVEPORT, La.--(BUSINESS WIRE)--Jan. 24, 2002--Last Thursday, StockPickReport.Com said, ``Today, it is our opinion that Amazon.Com could be on its last legs (in its current form, and current management) before 2003 ends.''
``We stand by our comments of last week,'' says StockPickReport.Com founder, Don Harrold.
``Some investors may ask 'What? Amazon.Com reported a profit this quarter.' And, we say again, 'We stand by our comments of last week.'''
Mr. Harrold continues, ``Remember, we also said, 'Short term, there could be 'volatility' (mainstream wallstreet's euphemism for 'stocks go up, and stocks go down'). But, in our opinion, AMZN is headed DOWN.'''
``The move up in Amazon's stock price over the last few days may be a steep price to pay for retail investors,'' adds Mr. Harrold.
``Amazon Reported in their own quarterly report that, 'Other gains, net were $16 million for the three months ended December 31, 2001, primarily consisting of a foreign-currency gain on 6.875% PEACS. Currency gains and losses arising from the remeasurement of the 6.875% PEACS principal from Euros to U.S. dollars are recorded each quarter. We are unable to forecast the gains or losses associated with our PEACS that will result from fluctuations in foreign exchange rates in future periods. Absent the foreign-currency gain recorded this quarter, we would have reported a fourth quarter 2001 GAAP net loss,''' says Mr. Harrold.
View the report online at:
http://biz.yahoo.com/bw/020122/220044_1.html
``Amazon.Com's OWN QUARTERLY REPORT should, in our opinion, encourage investors to look further into the numbers,'' says Mr. Harrold.
``Amazon.Com's business model may or may not be a subject of debate. What is not in debate is that Amazon's own quarterly report clearly outlines the impetus for their 'operating profit' claims - an unexpected fluctuation in the Euro,'' adds Mr. Harrold.
``The notion that Amazon.Com made a profit with their BUSINESS MODEL last quarter may deserve further investigation,'' concludes Mr. Harrold.
Mr. Harrold continues, ``One analogy investors may find useful is this: You own a hardware store. You owe $1,000,000 to a bank. The interest rate you owe that money at is not fixed, and it drops a quarter point. VOILA! You have more money in your account this month due to the fluctuation in interest owed.''
``As we said in November of 2000, there are so many 'mainstream wallstreet' firms with cash 'tied up' in Amazon.Com stock that, the stock price will probably fluctuate up and down,'' says Mr. Harrold.
``For example, Legg Mason was high on Amazon.Com stock back in November of 2000 (with a STRONG BUY). Ian McDonald (Senior Writer, TheStreet.Com), said on January 22, 2002, 'Legg Mason's funds own some 65 million Amazon shares.'''
``In the same article, David Kathman (Morningstar Amazon analyst) is quoted, 'I've warmed up a bit to Amazon, but they've still got $2 Billion in debt, which is a big thing hanging over them.'''
Mr. Harrold adds, ``'Big thing?' THAT'S an understatement.''
``Long term, we believe the core business model at Amazon.Com continues to be flawed. LOW PRICES as the way to drive profitability ONLINE is a shaky way at best as a means to long term success. Amazon's own quarterly report says that, 'We are unable to forecast the gains or losses associated with our PEACS that will result from fluctuations in foreign exchange rates in future periods.' We don't believe investors should, either,'' says Mr. Harrold.
Mr. Harrold adds, ``Consumers can buy the basically the same items at Barnes and Noble (NYSE:BKS - news; online and real world), Ebay (Nasdaq:EBAY - news), Yahoo (Nasdaq:YHOO - news), (etc) that you can at Amazon.Com. And, it's not hard to CLICK away to get a better deal (MySimon.Com for example).''
On January 17, Mr. Harrold asked, ``Maybe Jeff Bezos never owned a lemonade stand?''
``Today we can imagine Jeff Bezos shouting, 'Vive' Le Euro!''' concludes Mr. Harrold.
03-10-02, 12:26 AM
#6
DVD Talk Hero
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 1999
Location: Not necessarily Formerly known as Solid Snake
Posts: 29,256
Received 1,244 Likes
on
855 Posts
If I am not mistaken, Amazon always could have shown a profit all along. However, Bezos' strategy is/was to take any and all profit (before it becomes profit) and re-invest it into the company (new technologies, new business areas, etc.). This would allow the company major tax benefits while constantly building and growing. It was never an issue of Amazon actually losing money.
As for investors rewarding a company for good customer service, well, that's the best joke I've heard in a long time! The stock market and customer service are HIGHLY independent of each other. Does Warren Buffet care that Circuit City does not actually have customer service policies? No, he only cares that DIVX failed miserably. Does Don Harrold care that Blockbuster's employees are the laughing stock of the known universe? No, he only cares that they can sell their most valuable asset, your name and address, to anybody willing to pay the price. Does any stock broker care that Best Buy can only manage to hire Blockbuster's rejects? No, they only care that Best Buy purchased Musicland Group (like it wasn't run poorly enough before).
Investors do not care about the microcosm. They do not care how much a certain movie costs this week. They care about the macro, they care how long it takes the company to pay its bill for the billion copies that went out to all their stores. One pissed off customer does not matter to a stock holder. One pissed off customer makes a world of difference to an independent owner.
When is the last time you saw "K-Mart closing 281 stores due to poor customer service"? Once a company becomes a "public" company, they do not serve the customer. It is no longer a cost-effective measure to find out WHY a store is not running smoothly and fix the problem for the customers. It must be a quick resolution of liquidating the assets and locking the door to stem the cash flow to keep the money-hounds happy.
Lets put this in human terms: If you get a small cut on your finger, you might put a bandaid and maybe some medicine on it to help it heal. If you were to sell public shares of your body, and then get a small cut on your finger, you should immediately amputate your whole arm to show the investors that the wound won't become gangrenous and infect the whole body.
03-10-02, 02:53 AM
#7
Member
Join Date: Mar 2000
Posts: 73
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally posted by Abob Teff
[B]If I am not mistaken, Amazon always could have shown a profit all along. However, Bezos' strategy is/was to take any and all profit (before it becomes profit) and re-invest it into the company (new technologies, new business areas, etc.). This would allow the company major tax benefits while constantly building and growing. It was never an issue of Amazon actually losing money.[B]
[B]If I am not mistaken, Amazon always could have shown a profit all along. However, Bezos' strategy is/was to take any and all profit (before it becomes profit) and re-invest it into the company (new technologies, new business areas, etc.). This would allow the company major tax benefits while constantly building and growing. It was never an issue of Amazon actually losing money.[B]
According to the Financial Review Network, Amazon is expected to break even or post about a 16 million dollar loss for this quarter.
http://afr.com/intlbusiness/2002/01/24/FFX0Z700SWC.html
Here is a quote from Bezos from last July, although I'm sure he has been saying he was concentrating on making a profit long before this. http://www.taipeitimes.com/news/2001...ory/0000095716
Bezos, 37, says he is focusing on profitability, and is leading an effort that he calls "Get the CRAP out" to identify items that "Can't Realize Any Profit." Bezos says he will either turn these products into money-makers or dump them.
Last edited by StealThisCoupon; 03-10-02 at 03:01 AM.
03-11-02, 12:00 AM
#8
DVD Talk Platinum Edition
Join Date: Sep 1999
Location: Seattle, Washington, America the Beautiful
Posts: 3,767
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like
on
1 Post
After the "good news" had gone out, Amazon's Chief Financial Officer (CFo) had resigned from the company to seek other challenges... At least he won't be on call for the next quarter.
