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The 2019 Pro Wrestling Thread

Old 01-08-19, 07:39 PM
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Re: The 2019 Pro Wrestling Thread


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Old 01-08-19, 08:02 PM
  #52  
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Re: The 2019 Pro Wrestling Thread

Originally Posted by Deadman31 View Post
That's a big get. I could've sworn he said he wouldn't go to another promotion, then that changed to he wouldn't go to another American promotion, and now here we are. Really surprising since he was really close to Vince.

They also signed Daniels and Kazarian, PAC/Neville, and a lot of others. The most surprising thing to me is that Brandy Rhodes talked about equal pay for women. Plus they're actually providing health care. So any changes that they can make for the betterment of the talent is long overdue.

They really need to just avoid Jarrett-level early TNA booking (I'm assuming Cody and the Guns are going to have a hand in booking) and stuff like hiring Vince Russo after the network clearly stated not to hire Vince Russo.
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Old 01-08-19, 08:12 PM
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Re: The 2019 Pro Wrestling Thread

Originally Posted by Hazel Motes View Post
Not only that but pro wrestling itself is kind of outdated in 2019. I think real change could only come about through complete reinvention of what the current product is. It's just so far gone from being presented as legitimate competition that putting the genie back in the bottle is impossible at this point.
That's why I like Lucha Underground so much. They try to approach a pro wrestling show in a completely different way than everything else. Instead of even trying to pass itself off as real competitive fighting, it embraces being a weird crazy action/drama/sci-fi/fantasy show (whose characters mostly happen to be professional wrestlers).
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Old 01-08-19, 08:45 PM
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Re: The 2019 Pro Wrestling Thread

PAC, formerly known as Neville in WWE, has also joined AEW. Billy Gunn will also be part of the company as producer.
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Old 01-09-19, 12:28 AM
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Re: The 2019 Pro Wrestling Thread

Originally Posted by Hazel Motes View Post
Change isn't possible when you're so fundamentally out of touch with reality. Not only that but pro wrestling itself is kind of outdated in 2019. I think real change could only come about through complete reinvention of what the current product is. It's just so far gone from being presented as legitimate competition that putting the genie back in the bottle is impossible at this point.
And yet the NWA is doing a great job of putting the kayfabe back in wrestling and putting out a great product that is growing in popularity. If the NWA can do it, so can WWE. Well, they could if they weren't so clueless...
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Old 01-09-19, 01:50 AM
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Re: The 2019 Pro Wrestling Thread

They're putting the kayfabe back in the storytelling and build up aspect of it and are doing a great job.. But nothing has changed once they step inside the ring. No fan watches a match and gets worked by it and thinks its a fight. I know it sounds like I'm being hyper critical, and I am, but I'm a regular watcher of ROH , NXT and NWA and I really enjoy all 3, but wrestlings not what it used to be. There was once a palpable MAGIC to professional wrestling that no longer exists, for a MULTITUDE of reasons. Don't get me wrong I still like it, but its just not the same.
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Old 01-09-19, 02:13 AM
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Re: The 2019 Pro Wrestling Thread

Originally Posted by Hazel Motes View Post
They're putting the kayfabe back in the storytelling and build up aspect of it and are doing a great job.. But nothing has changed once they step inside the ring. No fan watches a match and gets worked by it and thinks its a fight. I know it sounds like I'm being hyper critical, and I am, but I'm a regular watcher of ROH , NXT and NWA and I really enjoy all 3, but wrestlings not what it used to be. There was once a palpable MAGIC to professional wrestling that no longer exists, for a MULTITUDE of reasons. Don't get me wrong I still like it, but its just not the same.
Maybe not, but it's still entertaining as hell. And I stopped believing they were real fights once I turned 14 (after watching 5 or 6 wrestling shows from cable when I was 13).

I wasn't sure if it was real or not when I was 13, I thought it was fake, but they sold the moves so well that I wasn't sure - except for the punches when they stomped their feet on the ring mat to make it sound like a massive punch. That clued me in to how pre-determined it was. I won't call it fake, though - I don't want to end up like Stossel.
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Old 01-09-19, 06:04 AM
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Re: The 2019 Pro Wrestling Thread

Originally Posted by B5Erik View Post
Maybe not, but it's still entertaining as hell. And I stopped believing they were real fights once I turned 14 (after watching 5 or 6 wrestling shows from cable when I was 13).

I wasn't sure if it was real or not when I was 13, I thought it was fake, but they sold the moves so well that I wasn't sure - except for the punches when they stomped their feet on the ring mat to make it sound like a massive punch. That clued me in to how pre-determined it was. I won't call it fake, though - I don't want to end up like Stossel.
Agreed.

I knew it was a work around the same time too, but it was also right around the time that the business was being exposed left and right. So I'm not 100% sure if it was my age, or all the magicians secrets coming out, or a combination of both that made me know it was a work. If I lived in the 40's/50's/60's, in the territory days, when the business was protected and there was no internet and people were generally less cynical, I think even if I thought it was a work, I'd probably be able to suspend disbelief.
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Old 01-09-19, 06:12 AM
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Re: The 2019 Pro Wrestling Thread

Some RAW/Smackdown thoughts:

There is something just so odd about the fact that Hulk Hogan is bald, but wears a hairpiece, but doesn't wear the hairpiece where he is bald.

I just can't deal with heel environmentalist Daniel Bryan, its just so awful. The thing that just drives me nuts about how heels are still being booked in 2019 is the fact that everyone knows its a work, so if you hate a heel, theres no such thing as seeing the heel get his comeuppance because everyone knows he's really not. So all you're left with is watching someone on your tv that irritates you.

Also I've banged this drum on here many times but Braun Strowmans promos are just the absolute shits.

That Mean Gene video montage was phenomenal. In the last 2 days I've probably watched the Wendy Richter clip where Gene breaks like 100 times
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Old 01-09-19, 07:52 AM
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Re: The 2019 Pro Wrestling Thread

Originally Posted by Hazel Motes View Post

I just can't deal with heel environmentalist Daniel Bryan, its just so awful. The thing that just drives me nuts about how heels are still being booked in 2019 is the fact that everyone knows its a work, so if you hate a heel, theres no such thing as seeing the heel get his comeuppance because everyone knows he's really not. So all you're left with is watching someone on your tv that irritates you.
Heels still work if done right. Elias Samson was a good heel until he got a catch phrase. The Miz is a heel that plays a great smarmy heel. Braun was a good heel in a monster sense but they didn't book him like they should book a monster heel so now he's a monster face who again isn't being booked right. I think it's pretty much like most old timers say...they can't or they're afraid to book heat. Maybe because they don't want to throw out merchandise sales or whatever but it's just another reason the product is suffering.
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Old 01-09-19, 10:09 AM
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Re: The 2019 Pro Wrestling Thread

Heels don't come across like they did back in the day. Heels got real heat. Fans used to get worked up so much they threw stuff in the ring, made physical threats against heels to the point they needed to be escorted to the ring by security (real security, not kayfabe security).

You will never see that again. For several reasons:
  • Kayfabe ended, pulling the curtains open on the magic of "wrestling".
  • Fans changed and started rooting for the heels instead of hating on them.
  • Culture changed and started becoming more politically correct severely limiting the amount of heat a heel could get away with. Heels need the ability to offend and hurt people with their words and actions, not just "your sports teams sucks!"
  • Too much Heel/Face swapping back and forth for no reason. The gimmick wears thin when you are a heel one week and a face the next with no real reason for the change other then to boost a rating.
With no real heels then it makes the reason for the faces to exist kind of...meh.

And so the whole product is...meh.
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Old 01-11-19, 11:58 AM
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Re: The 2019 Pro Wrestling Thread

Meltzer said that the Bucks, Cody, and Page all got pretty big offers from WWE, mainly because Vince knew that AEW wouldn't go forward without them, that they turned down. I'm not the biggest fan of Cody or the Bucks in terms of wrestling (but if they land Omega...) but man they went out on a limb to make this a reality, and this can really only be good for the business, so I'm excited. I mean, think about if they could land Punk, given the way they're trying to change a lot of the things he had a problem with.

I think Vince would agree that this would be good for business, but he's gotta be at least a little scared of the guy bankrolling AEW.
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Old 01-11-19, 02:21 PM
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Re: The 2019 Pro Wrestling Thread

Originally Posted by fujishig View Post
Meltzer said that the Bucks, Cody, and Page all got pretty big offers from WWE, mainly because Vince knew that AEW wouldn't go forward without them, that they turned down. I'm not the biggest fan of Cody or the Bucks in terms of wrestling (but if they land Omega...) but man they went out on a limb to make this a reality, and this can really only be good for the business, so I'm excited. I mean, think about if they could land Punk, given the way they're trying to change a lot of the things he had a problem with.

I think Vince would agree that this would be good for business, but he's gotta be at least a little scared of the guy bankrolling AEW.
The thing right now for Vince is that he doesn't want competition and not for the sake of not having competition, but to control the narrative of what professional wrestling is. By this I mean that he wants the current WWE product what people think pro wrestling is and Vince wants to prevent stunts like what happened with David Arquette, the Puertorican wrestlers who got his head busted by a dumbass throwing a concrete block and the girl using her tampon last week to not be part of the business. I agree with Vince in some respects about this but the issue here is he and the WWE need competition. Right now the roster is bloated with talent is not getting any TV time, even after the brand split. There are tons of talented wrestlers out there in and out of the company that need TV time. I still don't understand why Zack Ryder doesn't get a break. Why don't they pair him with Curt Hawkins and do something? Because there isn't enough TV time for them and writers have nothing. Then, they could certainly benefit from a company like AEW existing and giving them a chance.

One of top stars ever, Stone Cold Steve Austin, became the biggest thing ever after being fired from WCW, where he was a midcarder, and then went to ECW and then was saddle with the horrible Ringmaster gimmick in WWE until he got his big break. His example is the exact reason why we need competition in the wrestling business in the US. Maybe now with AEW, a guy like CM Punk will be motivated enough to come back to the business. Him and his wife are 2 of the most over stars of the past 15 years, and they have been out of the business since 2014-15.

I hope AEW works. Jericho signed a 3 year deal with them, so unless something drastic happens, he won't be in WWE at all during this time. Other veterans are still available out there including Wade Barrett and Aaron Stevens/Damien Sandow. There are tons of other wrestlers they can build a solid company around. I hope they do and become a real threat to the WWE monopoly.
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Old 01-11-19, 02:30 PM
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Re: The 2019 Pro Wrestling Thread

Originally Posted by Red Hood View Post
Right now the roster is bloated with talent is not getting any TV time, even after the brand split. There are tons of talented wrestlers out there in and out of the company that need TV time. I still don't understand why Zack Ryder doesn't get a break. Why don't they pair him with Curt Hawkins and do something? Because there isn't enough TV time for them and writers have nothing. Then, they could certainly benefit from a company like AEW existing and giving them a chance.
Zack Ryder sucks...but I'd rather see him on TV then The Bar/New Day/Uso's in some variation of the same match every week.
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Old 01-11-19, 02:35 PM
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Re: The 2019 Pro Wrestling Thread

Originally Posted by Red Hood View Post
The thing right now for Vince is that he doesn't want competition and not for the sake of not having competition, but to control the narrative of what professional wrestling is. By this I mean that he wants the current WWE product what people think pro wrestling is and Vince wants to prevent stunts like what happened with David Arquette, the Puertorican wrestlers who got his head busted by a dumbass throwing a concrete block and the girl using her tampon last week to not be part of the business. I agree with Vince in some respects about this but the issue here is he and the WWE need competition. Right now the roster is bloated with talent is not getting any TV time, even after the brand split. There are tons of talented wrestlers out there in and out of the company that need TV time. I still don't understand why Zack Ryder doesn't get a break. Why don't they pair him with Curt Hawkins and do something? Because there isn't enough TV time for them and writers have nothing. Then, they could certainly benefit from a company like AEW existing and giving them a chance.

One of top stars ever, Stone Cold Steve Austin, became the biggest thing ever after being fired from WCW, where he was a midcarder, and then went to ECW and then was saddle with the horrible Ringmaster gimmick in WWE until he got his big break. His example is the exact reason why we need competition in the wrestling business in the US. Maybe now with AEW, a guy like CM Punk will be motivated enough to come back to the business. Him and his wife are 2 of the most over stars of the past 15 years, and they have been out of the business since 2014-15.

I hope AEW works. Jericho signed a 3 year deal with them, so unless something drastic happens, he won't be in WWE at all during this time. Other veterans are still available out there including Wade Barrett and Aaron Stevens/Damien Sandow. There are tons of other wrestlers they can build a solid company around. I hope they do and become a real threat to the WWE monopoly.
You make a compelling argument about Vince wanting to control the narrative... I don't think I've ever heard that before. I'm not sure he even cares, though, this just seems to me like an extension of when he was buying out the territories, monopolizing talent. He certainly doesn't want to be forced to pay for health care or to endure unions.

I also don't agree about Sandow, unless it's in a non-wrestling capacity or at the very least, a tag team where he doesn't have to rely on wrestling ability. The guy has charisma and can talk, which makes him super valuable in the right role, but I haven't really seen a stellar match from him.
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Old 01-11-19, 04:16 PM
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Re: The 2019 Pro Wrestling Thread

There are so many guys just toiling away in WWE that I think could be doing amazing work and be stars if AEW pans out. Cesaro is someone that immediately comes to mind. Gallows and Anderson.
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Old 01-11-19, 04:23 PM
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Re: The 2019 Pro Wrestling Thread

Vince is so out of touch, he thought they were opening an A&W.
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Old 01-11-19, 05:56 PM
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Re: The 2019 Pro Wrestling Thread

Kind of interested in seeing how AEW plays out. Only thing is that I have a hard time seeing myself getting back into a wrestling product regularly again, but it feels like a big deal for the industry as a whole with how the company is going to handle itself and its performers and potentially gives WWE some competition.
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Old 01-11-19, 06:47 PM
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Re: The 2019 Pro Wrestling Thread

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Old 01-11-19, 09:38 PM
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Re: The 2019 Pro Wrestling Thread

Originally Posted by fujishig View Post
You make a compelling argument about Vince wanting to control the narrative... I don't think I've ever heard that before. I'm not sure he even cares, though, this just seems to me like an extension of when he was buying out the territories, monopolizing talent. He certainly doesn't want to be forced to pay for health care or to endure unions.

.
This argument doesn't come out of nowhere. Bruce Prichard has mentioned this too on his podcast and I believe is almost common knowledge in the business. The impression other wrestling promotions leave on mainstream media affect how marketing people and sponsors perceive professional wrestling to be. Remember how when something like the Owen Hart and Chris Benoit deaths happened, the media tied it up to deaths of other talent that were not even part of WWE at the time, or that never were part of the promotion at all during their careers. Vince and Kevin Dunn deeply care about the perception of the business in general and how it affects their bottom line being a public company. That's the reason the company is PG (besides their deal with Mattel) and why he tries to put the kibosh on the competition.
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Old 01-11-19, 10:46 PM
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Re: The 2019 Pro Wrestling Thread

The rumor is that Lars Sullivan was supposed to debut on Raw last Monday but a panic attack prevented this from happening. On Tuesday, he had a dark match scheduled and he didn't make it either due to another panic attack.
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Old 01-12-19, 05:40 AM
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Re: The 2019 Pro Wrestling Thread

If AEW gets good tv and can really get the ball rolling, I wonder if they could coax CM Punk and AJ Lee into signing. Say its a year down the road and they have made some progress, they have health insurance in place, they have tv, they are running big venues a few times a year, things are going good. Punk may have finally exhausted all his opportunities in MMA by then. I'm sure AJ isn't satisfied with her WWE exit being the end of her time in the wrestling business. I dunno. One can dream.
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Old 01-12-19, 07:29 AM
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Re: The 2019 Pro Wrestling Thread

I had no idea AEW had major money backing it. This thing could really go somewhere if done right.

[color=left=#1e1e1e]AEW is being funded by Jaguars’ owner Shahid Khan and co-founded with his son, Tony Khan — an established wrestling fan. The Khans represent a $6.4B net worth entering the world of wrestling, dwarfing Vince McMahon’s $2.9B and coming at a time that McMahon is getting ready to invest significant amounts of money in his new version of the XFL.[/color]

https://www.sbnation.com/2019/1/9/18...n-jacksonville
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Old 01-12-19, 12:05 PM
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Re: The 2019 Pro Wrestling Thread

Originally Posted by Hazel Motes View Post
If AEW gets good tv and can really get the ball rolling, I wonder if they could coax CM Punk and AJ Lee into signing. Say its a year down the road and they have made some progress, they have health insurance in place, they have tv, they are running big venues a few times a year, things are going good. Punk may have finally exhausted all his opportunities in MMA by then. I'm sure AJ isn't satisfied with her WWE exit being the end of her time in the wrestling business. I dunno. One can dream.
I doubt AJ would wrestle due to spine injuries that she suffered towards the end of her run, but she's great on the mic so having her as a personality would be good enough.
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Old 01-12-19, 12:07 PM
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Re: The 2019 Pro Wrestling Thread

The rumor now is that Jim Ross will be the voice of AEW. That's another big get.
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