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2018 MLB Week 8 May 21-27

Old 05-21-18, 11:05 AM
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2018 MLB Week 8 May 21-27

We interrupt your previously scheduled playoff-prediction poll to ask about a guy I'd only heard about peripherally before this year.

https://www.mlb.com/brewers/news/jos...ds/c-277537948

Is Josh Hader pitching his way onto the National League All-Star team? What about the way-too-early NL Cy Young Award debate?

Brewers manager Craig Counsell will leave those questions to observers outside the clubhouse.

"I think Josh is pitching really well and affecting a lot of our games -- and affecting them in a pretty meaningful way," Counsell said. "And we highly value the impact he's making. Whether that merits [honors and awards], that's what baseball fans love to debate.

"I hope he keeps pitching like this, and I hope he makes them debate it."

In the wake of Hader's latest strikeout special, a 2 1/3-inning outing Saturday in which he struck out the final six batters he faced for a 5-4 win over the Twins, here are some of the more eye-popping things about the left-hander's start to the season: [spoiled for length]

Spoiler:
Ninety-five hitters have dug in against Hader. Fifty-six of them have struck out. That 59-percent strikeout rate would shatter the all-time record (min. 25 batters faced) set by the Reds' Aroldis Chapman in 2014, when he struck out 52.5 percent of hitters. The only other pitcher in history to strike out more than half of the hitters he faced was then-Braves closer Craig Kimbrel at 50.2 percent in '12.

Hader, 24, is also on a pace to break Chapman's record for strikeouts per nine innings (min. 25 batters faced). Hader has 18.44 so far, to Chapman's 17.67 in '14.

Hader's Major League-leading 0.51 WHIP after 27 1/3 innings is also historic. According to STATS Inc., the record-low WHIP for a pitcher in 25-plus innings is 0.36, by Ed Cushman of the Milwaukee Cream Citys in 1884. Hader's 0.51 is next, then Boston's Koji Uehara's 0.57 in 74 1/3 innings in 2013.

Hader, a relief pitcher, entered Sunday ranked 11th in the NL in strikeouts. Every other pitcher in the top 28 is a starter who had pitched at least 15 more innings than Hader.

His strikeout rate is not abating as hitters get more aggressive earlier in counts. Twenty-seven of Hader's last 38 outs have come via strikeout.

"I don't know if anybody has struck out 200 people out of the bullpen before, but " Twins manager Paul Molitor said Saturday after Hader's outing left him on pace for 197 strikeouts in 56 games spanning 95 1/3 innings. His instinct was correct; nobody in Major League history has ever topped 200 strikeouts pitching exclusively in relief. Only six men have topped 150 strikeouts, led by 181 for Boston's Dick Radatz in 157 relief innings in 1974. The closest thing to what Hader is doing was Astros closer Brad Lidge in 2004, when he struck out 157 batters in 94 2/3 innings.

Both of Hader's wins, five of his six saves and 10 of his 16 outings overall have spanned at least two full innings. The Dodgers' Mike Marshall owns the Major League record with 62 multi-inning appearances in 1974, the year he won NL Cy Young Award honors. Hader won't get to 62, but he does have a chance to become the first reliever since Mariano Rivera in '96 to get to 35 appearances of two-plus innings.

His sling-like delivery makes Hader death on left-handed hitters, who are 1-for-28 (.036) against him. Miami's Justin Bour singled off Hader on April 22 at Miller Park.

Hader has gotten to two strikes against 75 batters, for whom it looks like walk or bust. Five have walked. One -- Steven Souza Jr., with a full-count single off Hader last week -- has gotten a hit, for a batting average of .014.

Hader's 57.1-percent contact rate is the lowest in baseball for pitchers who have logged at least 10 innings this season, but the Twins didn't come close to that on Saturday. They made zero after Eddie Rosario hit consecutive foul balls while leading off the eighth inning. That's a span of six different batters, 21 pitches/16 strikes, with no contact. In all, Hader threw 22 strikes, and the Twins had 15 swings and misses.

The Reds know the feeling. On April 30 at Great American Ball Park, Hader logged an eight-out save while getting every out via strikeout. No one had ever struck out all eight batters in a 2 2/3-innings appearance.

"I'm really just trying to do my best to attack hitters and keep them off-balance," Hader said. "[On Saturday] the fastball was there, so it just came down to executing."
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Old 05-21-18, 04:22 PM
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Re: 2018 MLB Week 8 May 21-27

The Rays created some conversation recently by starting a reliever for 1-2 innings. Thought dvd-4-life might enjoy this tweet:


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Old 05-21-18, 04:50 PM
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Re: 2018 MLB Week 8 May 21-27

Are the Dodgers finally pulling out of their tailspin? They had a great weekend series in Washington where they swept the Nationals, but their record is still terrible

This morning I saw a 2 month old baby in Dodgers diapers.

I told his parents that this was the most honest, appropriate marketing agreement I had ever seen.
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Old 05-22-18, 01:14 AM
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Re: 2018 MLB Week 8 May 21-27

Originally Posted by Cardsfan111 View Post
The Rays created some conversation recently by starting a reliever for 1-2 innings. Thought dvd-4-life might enjoy this tweet:


I think the Rays are going to do this more and more with their younger starters. This upsets the structure of baseball more than any other change in modern strategy and has potentially devastating consequences for the game as actual entertainment.

Baseball as entertainment loses more and more appeal if the league completely abandons starting pitching. This is a slippery slope into hordes of anonymous relievers taking over the game.

I would greatly worry about this as commissioner.
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Old 05-22-18, 07:56 AM
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Re: 2018 MLB Week 8 May 21-27

Fear the Greek Freak!

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Old 05-22-18, 10:55 AM
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Re: 2018 MLB Week 8 May 21-27

It's a good thing the Cubs won the Series when they traded Gleyber Torres for a rental of Aroldis Chapman, because it looks like he might be something special. The one concern about his game was that he didn't have enough power and he's answered that with 6 homers with an average distance of 417 feet.

One of those rare trades that worked out well for both teams.
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Old 05-22-18, 11:20 AM
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Re: 2018 MLB Week 8 May 21-27

I was just over at MASN(Orioles,Nationals TV website) and the Orioles bullpen got most of the credit for last night's win even though it's the relief pitchers job to get people out.

Sorry-starting pitching,three run homers and defense are what win baseball games not Orioles one inning useless relief pitchers.
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Old 05-22-18, 11:40 AM
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Re: 2018 MLB Week 8 May 21-27

Originally Posted by PhantomStranger View Post
I think the Rays are going to do this more and more with their younger starters. This upsets the structure of baseball more than any other change in modern strategy and has potentially devastating consequences for the game as actual entertainment.

Baseball as entertainment loses more and more appeal if the league completely abandons starting pitching. This is a slippery slope into hordes of anonymous relievers taking over the game.

I would greatly worry about this as commissioner.
There was an interesting ESPN article about this. They started Sergio Romo (the former Giant closer, but not their closer) in the first inning against the Angels because he's best against RHers, and the Angels start with their top hitters who are RH, then the woulda-been starter was able to come in and have an easier time with the rest. And it said they would use their top three starters conventionally, but the other two spots might be "bullpen games."

I agree that there's market appeal to the kingpin starter, but there's also a concern that those anonymous guys are all throwing 98, and then you'd get even more strikeouts, and less action, than you have already.

Originally Posted by JeremyM View Post
It's a good thing the Cubs won the Series when they traded Gleyber Torres for a rental of Aroldis Chapman, because it looks like he might be something special. The one concern about his game was that he didn't have enough power and he's answered that with 6 homers with an average distance of 417 feet.

One of those rare trades that worked out well for both teams.
Yeah, there's a reason he was like the #3 prospect in the minors at the time. I'd do the trade 100 times again, though.
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Old 05-22-18, 11:43 AM
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Re: 2018 MLB Week 8 May 21-27

I like teams doing thing's differently(start a relief pitcher).

All of MLB has become boring when every manager manage's the same way and everyone is afraid too do something different(like pitch a relief pitcher more than one inning late in a game).
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Old 05-22-18, 12:37 PM
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Re: 2018 MLB Week 8 May 21-27

Starting relief pitchers, I believe, is where the game is heading. Start a guy that will throw gas and hard breaking stuff for 3 innings, replace him with another reliever that will do the same thing and go from there. It won't completely change - the really good starters will keep their spot but instead of a 5 guy rotation it'll go to 3 or 4 rotation with the last spot or two reserved for starting relievers.
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Old 05-22-18, 12:48 PM
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Re: 2018 MLB Week 8 May 21-27

Originally Posted by Goat3001 View Post
Starting relief pitchers, I believe, is where the game is heading. Start a guy that will throw gas and hard breaking stuff for 3 innings, replace him with another reliever that will do the same thing and go from there. It won't completely change - the really good starters will keep their spot but instead of a 5 guy rotation it'll go to 3 or 4 rotation with the last spot or two reserved for starting relievers.
I'm not sure how far it will go, but I tend to agree. I think statistics in recent years show that by the third time through the order, the performance of most starting pitchers drops pretty significantly. That means, on the whole, batters are adjusting better in-game after seeing what the pitcher wants to do. So, to counter that you either need pitchers who are skilled enough and have enough quality pitches to change their approach each time through the order, which is pretty rare, or you start mixing in things like more bullpen starts (or going to the bullpen earlier) such that batters don't see the same pitcher more than twice at most within a game.
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Old 05-22-18, 01:37 PM
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Re: 2018 MLB Week 8 May 21-27

I wish they would throw the save rule out the window.

Nowadays a relief pitcher gets a 4-out save and it's the greatest accomplishment of all-time and I can still remember back in the 1970's when Mike Marshall would pitch three inning saves at a moments notice.

I would also like too see it banned that teams like the Orioles from carrying 13 pitchers(unless it's with expanded rosters).
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Old 05-22-18, 05:33 PM
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Re: 2018 MLB Week 8 May 21-27

Here is a little thought experiment. Think to yourself your ten most favorite baseball players of all time. I bet half of them are starting pitchers with maybe one or two relievers at most. No one playing high school baseball dreams of being a situational reliever.

The flood of relievers taking over pitching is a horrible development in promoting baseball stars. I understand why teams would use them within the context of baseball strategy. It's simply lesser entertainment, which is what professional sports are all about and why the industry is worth $10 billion.

It's the biggest threat to the game since the Black Sox scandal. MLB attendance has been down over the past decade as nameless, faceless relievers take more and more innings from starters. Everyone likes seeing Chapman or Kimbrel come in, but we have some teams now aiming for their bullpen in the fifth inning.

This is driving many of the worst trends in the game's play, from higher strikeout rates to shorter outings and longer game times. Unless a starter has a no-hitter going, he is virtually never allowed beyond the 7th inning anymore.
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Old 05-22-18, 08:37 PM
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Re: 2018 MLB Week 8 May 21-27

For me, only 3 pitchers and one was a reliever.

Over all I think your post is overly dramatic and off the mark.
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Old 05-22-18, 09:37 PM
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Re: 2018 MLB Week 8 May 21-27

Fucking Chatwood. Four hits, six walks, and one K in 2.1 IP.
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Old 05-22-18, 10:08 PM
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Re: 2018 MLB Week 8 May 21-27

Chatwood is awful, I can't take all those walks. At this point I kind of wish he would get hurt and put on the DL.
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Old 05-22-18, 10:54 PM
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Re: 2018 MLB Week 8 May 21-27

The Cardinals are down 3-1 going into the 9th and Matheny brings in Greg Holland. Predictably, Holland has given up two more runs and there are still no outs. Bravo Matheny, bravo.
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Old 05-22-18, 11:41 PM
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Re: 2018 MLB Week 8 May 21-27

I spoke up here and elsewhere that the Holland move was a good one. I think my logic was that there's no such thing as a bad 1-year deal. I've been proven incorrect. But thank goodness it was a 1 year deal.
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Old 05-23-18, 12:04 AM
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Re: 2018 MLB Week 8 May 21-27

Originally Posted by Cardsfan111 View Post
I spoke up here and elsewhere that the Holland move was a good one. I think my logic was that there's no such thing as a bad 1-year deal. I've been proven incorrect. But thank goodness it was a 1 year deal.
Not to be the eternal optimist, but I think it's too early to say it was a bad 1-year deal. Maybe he gets right by, say, September and is a helpful asset in the late innings at that point in the season. It's a long season.

BUT he has absolutely been misused so far this season. I know he's a veteran who has had a solid track record prior to this season and I know Matheny is loathe to do anything that might bruise a veteran's ego, but with no spring training, Holland should have started the season in mop up duty roles and worked up to higher leverage situations after demonstrating success.
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Old 05-23-18, 02:58 PM
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Re: 2018 MLB Week 8 May 21-27

Originally Posted by Cardsfan111 View Post
I spoke up here and elsewhere that the Holland move was a good one. I think my logic was that there's no such thing as a bad 1-year deal. I've been proven incorrect. But thank goodness it was a 1 year deal.
He had no spring training and clearly showed up to the Cards out of shape. He's never looked this bad before since becoming a premier reliever.

He needs innings in the minors to get back in shape.
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Old 05-23-18, 05:14 PM
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Re: 2018 MLB Week 8 May 21-27

The Cards drop 2 of 3 at home to the lowly Royals. Yay baseball!
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Old 05-23-18, 05:34 PM
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Re: 2018 MLB Week 8 May 21-27

Joey Bats finds a new home! Not sure how I feel about this.
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Old 05-23-18, 05:59 PM
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Re: 2018 MLB Week 8 May 21-27

Originally Posted by dsa_shea View Post
The Cards drop 2 of 3 at home to the lowly Royals. Yay baseball!
And Ozuna who has been rather ordinary (and that's putting it mildly) overslept and showed up after the game started.
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Old 05-23-18, 10:32 PM
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Re: 2018 MLB Week 8 May 21-27

Welington Castillo of the White Sox the latest to get an 80 game drug-related (non steroid, reportedly) suspension.
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Old 05-24-18, 09:35 AM
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Re: 2018 MLB Week 8 May 21-27

Originally Posted by Cardsfan111 View Post
Welington Castillo of the White Sox the latest to get an 80 game drug-related (non steroid, reportedly) suspension.
Before the new's came out,I was going to mention that I bet the Orioles wish they still had Castillo because their catching situation(among other things) is a mess but now I can't say it because of the suspension.
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