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The NCAA Conference Expansion Thread - Part II

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The NCAA Conference Expansion Thread - Part II

Old 02-08-12, 08:12 AM
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The NCAA Conference Expansion Thread - Part II

Since this discussion could go on forever, it's probably a good time to go for a next thread.

Previous thread HERE
Old 02-08-12, 08:48 AM
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Re: The NCAA Conference Expansion Thread - Part II

They would have 14 in 2013 if no one can leave early, and everyone else including Memphis joins as scheduled.
I think all 3 will be out by 2013-14. I think WVU is as good as gone after this year....they dumped their FSU game next season (paying a $500K penalty) to accomodate a 9-game (B12) conference schedule. I can't see them doing that if they weren't certain they'd be in the B12.
Old 02-08-12, 11:48 AM
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Re: The NCAA Conference Expansion Thread - Part II

Originally Posted by Red Dog View Post
I think all 3 will be out by 2013-14. I think WVU is as good as gone after this year....they dumped their FSU game next season (paying a $500K penalty) to accomodate a 9-game (B12) conference schedule. I can't see them doing that if they weren't certain they'd be in the B12.
The general feeling around Syracuse fandom is that we'll start in the ACC for the 2013 football season and the 2013-2014 basketball season. There were some rumblings that there was still a chance for a 2012 entry, but that seems doubtful.
Old 02-08-12, 01:24 PM
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Re: The NCAA Conference Expansion Thread - Part II

It sure looks like the Big XII thinks WVU will be in their league in 2012 regardless. It's my understanding that their TV deal would be void with less than 10 teams and without WVU, they're down to IX. I know there's a nasty legal battle going on and Syracuse and Pitt are just sitting back and watching the show, but something's gotta give because that schedule has to be set pretty damned soon, right?
Old 02-08-12, 01:35 PM
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Re: The NCAA Conference Expansion Thread - Part II

FWIW, I still think that the Big XII should cherry-pick Louisville and Cincy for their conference, but from what I read, it seems like they're happy at X, splitting their TV deal 10 ways instead of 12. Their other point was that they could always expand further later. Maybe they're holding out hope for a BYU addition, but I really think that the hoops BYU would make the conference jump through probably wouldn't be worth it for what they gain by adding them. Wish they could add an AAU school to the conference, but don't really see a viable candidate except Tulane and Rutgers

Anyways, it looks like the Big XII football schedule is coming in the next few days and that WVU is on it (saw that OU will be playing TCU and WVU on the road in 2012).
Old 02-08-12, 03:51 PM
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Re: The NCAA Conference Expansion Thread - Part II

Originally Posted by Decker View Post
It sure looks like the Big XII thinks WVU will be in their league in 2012 regardless. It's my understanding that their TV deal would be void with less than 10 teams and without WVU, they're down to IX. I know there's a nasty legal battle going on and Syracuse and Pitt are just sitting back and watching the show, but something's gotta give because that schedule has to be set pretty damned soon, right?
Syracuse and Pitt are sitting back waiting to pounce if WVU happens to win their lawsuit.

What I think will happen: WVU goes to the Big XII for 2012. WVU and the Big East settle their lawsuit, with WVU making payment to the Big East (with help from the Big XII). Pitt and Syracuse negotiate 2013 exits. Big East at 7 football schools in 2012, 11 in 2013-2014, 12 in 2015.

Syracuse and Pitt can't leave in 2012 anyways. The Big East would lose its football conference status (for having fewer than 6 teams).

EDIT: Right after I posted, I saw this: http://brett-mcmurphy.blogs.cbssport...32522/34757696 . The Big East and WVU are close to a $20 million settlement to leave right now.

Considering how this fucks up Syracuse's schedule (will force 2 FCS teams, since they can't get another FBS team in right now), I say screw it. Don't care if the Big East only has 5 football schools. We need to find $20 million somewhere, put it in a briefcase, take it to John Marinatto, and then run to Greensboro.
Old 02-08-12, 03:57 PM
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Re: The NCAA Conference Expansion Thread - Part II

Random Big East facts:

Once Syracuse and Pitt and WVU leave, Rutgers will be the only remaining Big East football school that was there during the 2003 season.

Which is funny, cuz it's Rutgers. And it's also why the Big East needs to change their name to Conference USA II.
Old 02-08-12, 05:02 PM
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Re: The NCAA Conference Expansion Thread - Part II

Looks like the Mountain West and the tattered remains of Conference USA are deep in merger talks now. It makes sense because neither conference is viable anymore after this round of conference expansion. Here's the story:
Spoiler:
Conference USA's board of directors will meet later this week to discuss the possibility of a full-scale merger with the Mountain West Conference, according to a source with knowledge of the situation.

The prospect of a merger was already on the meeting agenda, even before C-USA member Memphis was on the verge of joining the Big East, the source said.

Memphis was officially invited into the Big East on Wednesday and has accepted the invitation. The school will join in 2013.

In the past year, C-USA members Houston, SMU and Central Florida accepted invitations to join the Big East in 2013-14.

That, along with Memphis' pending departure, would leave C-USA with eight members: Southern Miss, Tulsa, Marshall, Rice, UAB, Tulane, East Carolina and UTEP.

The Mountain West is adding Nevada and Fresno State from the Western Athletic Conference for all sports and Hawaii in football. But the MWC is losing San Diego State to the Big East in football and the Big West for all other sports; Boise State to the Big East in football and the WAC in other sports; and TCU to the Big 12.

That means in 2013-14, the MWC would have eight football members, including Hawaii, and seven in all sports: UNLV, New Mexico, Wyoming, Colorado State, Air Force, Fresno State and Nevada.

A merger between C-USA and the MWC could consist of a conference with its current 2013-14 membership of 15 in all sports and 16 in football.

On Wednesday, Conference USA commissioner Britton Banowsky said he's not expecting to lose any more schools to the Big East.

"Based upon my conversations with commissioner (John) Marinatto, the Big East has now completed its future membership plan. If this is true, it is very helpful as we can now move forward with our plans in a more stable national environment," he said. "We hope that the other conferences appreciate the value of stability in intercollegiate athletics and higher education."


I'm trying to decide on a name for the new conference. Mixing up MWC and C-USA, the best anagram I could come up with is the SCUM-WAC, which I kind of like (but doubt will catch on).

Poor Rice, spurned yet again and essentially unloved & unwanted since the dissolution of the Southwest Conference. Always the bridesmaid, never the bride.
Old 02-08-12, 05:54 PM
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Re: The NCAA Conference Expansion Thread - Part II

I'm sure the Fresno State basketball teams will be looking forward toward Wednesday night games at East Carolina.

I don't see how it can happen unless it's a very loose conglomeration where you might play a couple crossover games in a season.
Old 02-09-12, 07:12 PM
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Re: The NCAA Conference Expansion Thread - Part II

Originally Posted by wildcatlh View Post
Syracuse and Pitt are sitting back waiting to pounce if WVU happens to win their lawsuit.

What I think will happen: WVU goes to the Big XII for 2012. WVU and the Big East settle their lawsuit, with WVU making payment to the Big East (with help from the Big XII). Pitt and Syracuse negotiate 2013 exits. Big East at 7 football schools in 2012, 11 in 2013-2014, 12 in 2015.

Syracuse and Pitt can't leave in 2012 anyways. The Big East would lose its football conference status (for having fewer than 6 teams).

EDIT: Right after I posted, I saw this: http://brett-mcmurphy.blogs.cbssport...32522/34757696 . The Big East and WVU are close to a $20 million settlement to leave right now.

Considering how this fucks up Syracuse's schedule (will force 2 FCS teams, since they can't get another FBS team in right now), I say screw it. Don't care if the Big East only has 5 football schools. We need to find $20 million somewhere, put it in a briefcase, take it to John Marinatto, and then run to Greensboro.
Syracuse and Rutgers are talking about playing 2 games next year with the 2nd game at Yankee Stadium (would count as a non-conference game).

http://www.fbschedules.com/2012/02/r...twice-in-2012/

Also, Boise is working on getting to the Big East in 2012. They've apparently talked to the WAC about getting their Olympic sports in there next season.

http://brett-mcmurphy.blogs.cbssport...32522/34773204
Old 02-10-12, 10:18 AM
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Re: The NCAA Conference Expansion Thread - Part II

I'd much rather have Boise in next season than have to play Rutgers twice. Even if the Big East would force both Pitt and Syracuse to play at Boise. You know Boise wants to do it, because it would more or less assure them of a BCS game next year.

We're gone in 2013 at this point. It's inevitable. And I can't wait to go.

It's amazing how badly the Big East handles everything. Back when the move was originally announced back in September, there was a good chunk of the Syracuse fanbase that didn't like it, wanted to stay in the Big East. Most of them have changed their minds.
Old 02-10-12, 10:23 AM
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Re: The NCAA Conference Expansion Thread - Part II

Syracuse can help with the ACC attendance problems. There was a big article in the WP today about significant basketball attendance declines in the ACC. Once again, thank you expansion.
Old 02-10-12, 11:53 AM
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Re: The NCAA Conference Expansion Thread - Part II

Interestingly, if Boise had beaten TCU and went to a BCS Bowl, their exit fee to the MWC would have been around $14M due to the agreement they had when they joined the conference this past season. Since they didn't, their exit fee to leave this year is just their share of the conference take -- around $2M I think. It would really behoove them to leave now and be in the Big East in time for next season.

edit: I found the article from last year which laid out the details. I was off : their exit fee would have been $21M to leave had they made the BCS.

Boise State exit fee from Mountain West could be $21 million
Submitted by Brian Murphy on Thu, 10/20/2011 - 1:50pm, updated on Thu, 10/20/2011 - 5:58pm

By Brian Murphy
[email protected]

Boise State could owe as much as $21 million if it decides to change conferences for next season, the Mountain West confirmed Thursday. The Albuquerque Journal first reported the exit fees.

Here's how it works (and all numbers are approximate):

— If Boise State reaches a BCS game this season, its year-end revenue distribution from the Mountain West would be roughly $7 million. According to the Mountain West's exit fee clause, the Broncos would forfeit that amount AND the greater of $5 million OR double the year-end distribution ($14 million).

That's how you get to $21 million.

— If Boise State did not make a BCS game this season, the Broncos would forfeit their year-end distribution (around $1.9 million) AND the greater of $5 million OR double the year-end distribution ($3.8 million).

In that case, it would be $1.9 million plus $5 million for a total of $6.9 million.

— If Boise State were to give a year's notice (and leave for 2013), the Broncos would only forfeit their year-end distribution from the 2012-13 academic calendar.

Here is the Mountain West bylaw regarding exit fees that was passed in June and voted on by Boise State. The Mountain West added the exit fee after Utah, BYU and TCU left without penalty.

"Effective June 6, 2011 and thereafter any notice of resignation given by any member shall be subject to the notice dates referenced in subparagraph (a) above and the following: (a) the resigning member shall forfeit its final year of revenue payable no later than the Effective Date; (b) if the resigning member gives notice after the established “Notice Date”, the resigning member shall forfeit its final year of revenue and shall pay to the Conference a sum of five million dollars ($5,000,000) OR double the amount of the final year’s revenue, whichever is greater. All monies shall be paid no later than the Notice Date. (Revised June 2011)
Old 02-10-12, 12:19 PM
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Re: The NCAA Conference Expansion Thread - Part II

Originally Posted by Red Dog View Post
Syracuse can help with the ACC attendance problems. There was a big article in the WP today about significant basketball attendance declines in the ACC. Once again, thank you expansion.
College basketball regular season games are basically meaningless if everyone qualifies for the league tournament. You could go 0-26 and get lucky and win the tournament. The NY Giants weren't the best team in the NFL,but they were the best over the last 6 weeks.

If the regular season had more meaning,more fans would attend.
Old 02-10-12, 12:24 PM
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Re: The NCAA Conference Expansion Thread - Part II

Old 02-10-12, 12:25 PM
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Re: The NCAA Conference Expansion Thread - Part II

Originally Posted by Red Dog View Post
Syracuse can help with the ACC attendance problems. There was a big article in the WP today about significant basketball attendance declines in the ACC. Once again, thank you expansion.
If the VA legislature hadn't stuck their noses in the 2004 expansion and Syracuse had gone then, you wouldn't have this problem.
Old 02-10-12, 04:54 PM
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Re: The NCAA Conference Expansion Thread - Part II

Report: WVU, Big East reach settlement. ESPN.com news services.

The Big East and West Virginia reached a settlement Thursday night that would end their bitter legal hostilities over the Mountaineers' plans to quit the conference, according to a newspaper report.

The Charleston (W.Va.) Daily Mail, citing an anonymous source, reported that a settlement of the competing lawsuits over WVU's plan to join the Big 12 includes terms for the Big East to receive $20 million from the conditional deal. WVU would contribute $11 million, with the Big 12 covering the remaining amount.

The newspaper says the settlement would clear the way for WVU to gain full membership of the conference on July 1.

An official announcement could come as soon as Friday, according to the paper.

The league is expected to turn out football schedules that include West Virginia in the coming weeks, a Big 12 source told ESPN.com's Andy Katz on Thursday.

WVU sued the Big East in Morgantown in November, challenging the conference bylaws in a bid to join the Big 12 before the 2012 football season.

The Big East countersued in Rhode Island four days later, arguing WVU should remain in the conference for 27 months.

Judges in both states have denied motions to dismiss the lawsuits.

Big East commissioner John Marinatto declined to answer questions on Wednesday related to the legal issues or when the Big East's 2012 schedule might be released.

But in the event of a settlement for WVU's immediate exit, the Newark (N.J.) Star-Ledger reported Wednesday that the Big East plans to compensate Rutgers football's lost conference game against the Mountaineers by having the Scarlet Knights play Syracuse twice.

Meanwhile, Boise State has had talks with the WAC, a source said, about placing the rest of the teams in the league a year early if it were to leave for the Big East in football a year early to replace WVU.

The source said the move is up to Boise State and that the WAC would accept the Broncos a year early if they were to ask.
Old 02-10-12, 06:11 PM
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Re: The NCAA Conference Expansion Thread - Part II

I wonder if that $20 Million is on top of the $5M or $10M exit fee WVU was expecting to pay already. I hope that the $9M that the Big XII is kicking in is coming completely out of the pockets of either exclusively Mizzou or MU and aTm, since it was their exit that necessitated the rapid absorption of WVU in the first place. I'd be pissed if the remaining Big XII got stuck with any of this settlement (well, except Texas, which kind of deserves it).
Old 02-10-12, 09:49 PM
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Re: The NCAA Conference Expansion Thread - Part II

It's a total of 20m. Apparently the 9m/11m split isn't accurate though.
Old 02-10-12, 11:28 PM
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Re: The NCAA Conference Expansion Thread - Part II

Originally Posted by wildcatlh View Post
If the VA legislature hadn't stuck their noses in the 2004 expansion and Syracuse had gone then, you wouldn't have this problem.
Without VT the ACC would be the Big East in football over the last few years.

I wasn't a fan of the VT inclusion but they helped far more in football then Syracuse would have especially considering the whole purpose of the last expansion was football.
Old 02-11-12, 08:36 AM
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Re: The NCAA Conference Expansion Thread - Part II

If we had to have expansion, I was pretty clear that I wanted VT over BC, not Cuse. Their idiotic love affair with the Boston TV market (fools gold for college sports) scuttled that idea.
Old 02-13-12, 01:32 PM
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Re: The NCAA Conference Expansion Thread - Part II

CUSA and the MWC are dissolving after next year, and will become one conference. 15 team basketball conference, 16 team football conference (Hawaii as a football-only member).

http://brett-mcmurphy.blogs.cbssport...32522/34822810
Old 02-13-12, 01:47 PM
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Re: The NCAA Conference Expansion Thread - Part II

I certainly hope they don't think they're deserving of an AQ.

With these conferences merging it means more room for at larges in the NCAA. Should make for some even tougher first round match ups.
Old 02-14-12, 09:01 AM
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Re: The NCAA Conference Expansion Thread - Part II

Originally Posted by wildcatlh View Post
It's a total of 20m. Apparently the 9m/11m split isn't accurate though.
It's $10 million from WVU, and $10 million from the Big XII. WVU will repay the Big XII $5 million of that, which is less than what they're going to gain in revenues in one year by moving away from the Big East.
Old 02-14-12, 09:05 AM
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Re: The NCAA Conference Expansion Thread - Part II

Originally Posted by Timber View Post
I certainly hope they don't think they're deserving of an AQ.

With these conferences merging it means more room for at larges in the NCAA. Should make for some even tougher first round match ups.
I would have been interested to see what would've happened had this happened when the tournament was 65 teams. Would they have gone back to 64? I'm guessing no since the majors would've probably gotten their way with an extra at-large.

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