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Paul Hamm wins Gold Medal by mistake

Old 08-21-04, 12:09 PM
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Paul Hamm wins Gold Medal by mistake

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmp...inted_gold_gym


Judging Error Gave Hamm Gold

23 minutes ago

By EDDIE PELLS, AP Sports Writer

ATHENS, Greece - Paul Hamm (news - web sites)'s gold medal just lost its luster. A scoring mistake at the all-around gymnastics final cost South Korea (news - web sites)'s Yang Tae-young the gold that ended up going to Hamm, the International Gymnastics Federation ruled Saturday. Yang got the bronze instead.


AP Photo



Three judges were suspended, but the results will not be changed, the federation said. The South Korean Olympic team will ask the Court of Arbitration for Sports to determine if Yang deserves a gold medal.


"We want obvious mistakes to be corrected," said Jae Soon-yoo, an official with the South Korean delegation.


The error Wednesday cost Yang a tenth of a point on his parallel bars score that made the difference between third and first.


South Korea failed to lodge a protest during the event, so the scoring was not changed, said the federation, known as FIG. The South Koreans, however, said they did question the scoring as soon as the routine was over and were told by the judges to file a protest letter after the meet, Jae said.


If the mistake hadn't been made, Hamm would have won the silver and South Korea's Kim Dae-eun would have received the bronze instead of silver.


USA Gymnastics president Bob Colarossi compared the mistake to a bad call in football that wasn't discovered until after the game. He insisted the decision by gymnastics' governing body should not put an asterisk on Hamm's gold medal.


Hamm scored 9.837 on parallel bars and high bar to close the meet, rallying from 12th place to first and becoming the first American man to win the event.


"Paul Hamm's performance the other night was absolutely incredible," Colarossi said. "It's unfortunate the judges didn't have the right start value."


A start value is based on the difficulty of the routine. Yang received a start value of 9.9 on parallel bars, a tenth lower than he got for the same routine in team qualifying and finals.


After reviewing a tape of the all-around, federation officials determined Yang should have been awarded a start value of 10. With the extra 0.10, he would have finished with 57.874 points and defeated Hamm by 0.051.


Matthieu Reeb, general secretary of CAS, talked to the South Korean team about an appeal and expected it to be filed by Sunday. Still, he said it was unclear whether the court would hear the case.


"Our regular practice is that field of play decisions cannot be reviewed by CAS," Reeb said. "We'll see if the Korean delegation has other legal arguments to submit to the court. We haven't had a similar case involving a problem of judging or scoring."


Hamm, practicing Saturday for event finals, was not available for comment. He was asked Thursday about the judging and his close victory.


"I feel like I just barely edged them out," he said. "If you go back and look at the tapes, people can analyze it, and they'll all come to that conclusion, I think."


The case brought back memories of the figure skating scandal at the 2002 Salt Lake City Games. A French judge said she was pressured by her federation's chief to favor the Russians in pairs over the Canadians. Jamie Sale and David Pelletier of Canada were ultimately awarded duplicate golds.


In Athens, however, there were no signs of impropriety. The scoring error was made with one event left, and there was no way the judges could have known the significance of reducing Yang's start value on the parallel bars.





In another case at the 2002 Games, South Koreans fumed when short track speed skater Kim Dong-sung was disqualified in the 1,500-meter race, allowing American Apolo Anton Ohno to win the gold.

Gilbert Felli, the IOC (news - web sites)'s executive director for the Olympics, said the IOC had not been approached by the South Koreans or gymnastics officials. He said the figure skating case bore little resemblance to this one.

"In Salt Lake City it was a decision from the federation to change the ruling," he said. "The IOC never changed any results on its own. It's up to the federation if they feel the need to change something. It has to come from the federation."

Felli said the IOC would only consider changing results on its own "if there is an obvious manipulation, not a human mistake in judging."

Hamm won the meet over Kim by 0.012 in the closest men's all-around in Olympic history. Yang was 0.049 behind Hamm.

The South Korean delegation asked for a review of the scoring after the meet, and the gymnastics federation's executive committee met Friday to look at the tapes.

Messages left for the South Korean delegation by The Associated Press were not immediately returned.

A news release announcing the federation's decision said the rules "do not allow for a protest against judges' marks. The judges' marks have to be accepted as a final decision and cannot be changed."

Still, the suspensions were necessary to protect the integrity of the organization and "maintain and ensure the highest possible judging standard at the Olympic Games (news - web sites)," the group said.

The federation did not release the names of the suspended judges, who will not be on the panel for event finals.

But Spain's Benjamin Bango and Columbia's Oscar Buitrago Reyes were responsible for determining the start values. America's George Beckstead was the panel chairman, and therefore had ultimate responsibility for all the judges. But because the other judges agreed on the 9.9 start value, Beckstead would have had no cause to step in.

Countries can complain about the scoring but only before the following rotation is over. After that, scores cannot be changed.

"Judges can make mistakes. That's human," federation spokesman Phillipe Silacci said Friday. "But it's like football. They cannot change the score once the game is over."
Old 08-21-04, 12:15 PM
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Would you give the medal back?
Old 08-21-04, 12:32 PM
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I'd always be thinking now that I have a gold medal that i didnt deserve. So, yeah, maybe Id give it back.
Old 08-21-04, 12:38 PM
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Kind of reminds me of that fiasco last Olympics were the Romanian woman lost the all around gold. Weird how it involves South Korea and the U.S. again and Korea gets the bad end of things.
Old 08-21-04, 01:06 PM
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Originally posted by Jericho
Kind of reminds me of that fiasco last Olympics were the Romanian woman lost the all around gold. Weird how it involves South Korea and the U.S. again and Korea gets the bad end of things.
She also won that gold because the vault was setup incorrectly which caused the leading contenders to fall on that event and subsequently not try as hard afterward since it was a lost cause (they had the choice to go again).

Also, the way this happened isn't in the right format. You can't go back and watch every single routine again for start value mistakes just like you can't go back and watch an entire football game and look for mistakes against teams. It has to be brought up and challenged on the spot. Otherwise you'd have to rewatch every single routine for mistakes, maybe if they rewatched Paul's routines he'd come out .1 ahead and this would be nullified.
Old 08-21-04, 01:10 PM
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Originally posted by Lara Means
I'd always be thinking now that I have a gold medal that i didnt deserve. So, yeah, maybe Id give it back.
No. Missing a start value total is like a missed penalty in any other sport. It happens. Yeah it decided something here on the surface, but in reality they'd have to go back and watch all the routines rescore them all make sure they get all the right start values and deducted properly. Start Values are also subjective, if you decide a gymnast didn't hit everything properly along with all their connections, you can adjust their start value accordingly.

The Federation here should have done this in private. It doesn't do anyone good to tell the world. There seems to be an agenda at work.

Also see my above post.
Old 08-21-04, 01:33 PM
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Hey, no one is going to give the Hurricanes the 2002 National Title. Terrible, ungodly, life altering mistakes happen.
Old 08-21-04, 01:55 PM
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But still, the guy didn't really win the gold. He should give it back. I think that I would, otherwise, it's not worth as much.

D
Old 08-21-04, 02:01 PM
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after watching his last two events.. its hard to argue that he didnt win it
definitly deserved it


should we go back and review every football, baseball, basketball game of all time.. and find every missed call and reverse the results??

thats just plain silly

calls are missed all the time.. both for and against you.. the world has a way of evening out in the long run.
Old 08-21-04, 02:04 PM
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Payback for Roy Jones Jr.

... but yeah, it is unfortunate.
Old 08-21-04, 02:21 PM
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Originally posted by Derrich
But still, the guy didn't really win the gold.
No... Actually, he DID! Here's a picture if you don't believe me:





The event is JUDGED. That's the price you pay for a subjective event.

If they're gonna do this, they should also review the hundreds of times that a newcomer nails an event and gets a 9.5 when the experienced veteran does a half-hearted performance and "earns" a 9.85.
Old 08-21-04, 02:31 PM
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Originally posted by Y2K Falcon
The event is JUDGED. That's the price you pay for a subjective event.
Exactly.
Old 08-21-04, 02:34 PM
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Originally posted by Gallant Pig
She also won that gold because the vault was setup incorrectly which caused the leading contenders to fall on that event and subsequently not try as hard afterward since it was a lost cause (they had the choice to go again).
Well it was really only one big contender that fell, and is she gave up and didn't try as hard because of it, I don't exactly have a lot of sympathy for her. It was a big fuck up on the part of the organizers, but one has to make the best of a bad situation. Plus, there's no guarantee the Russian would have won. Just ask the Chinese men about being a gold medal favorite (team or individual).
Old 08-21-04, 03:21 PM
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Very unfortunate and I'd have a hard time keeping the medal myself.

However...if those SKs want to bitch and moan and be anti-American about things, fine. I seem to recall a SK boxer getting his ass kicked in the summer olympics in Seoul by an American (Roy Jones, Jr, right?) and he was awarded the victory. What happened w/ Hamm was an unfortunate oversight. What happened in Seoul was blatant cheating yet many SKs would never acknowledge that.

Shit happens. There are more worthy causes to be anti-American about

Last edited by indianajdp; 08-21-04 at 03:25 PM.
Old 08-21-04, 03:21 PM
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typical American arrogance and bad sportmanship not to give back the gold medal


how can Paul Cramm live with himself knowing he wasn't the best ?

dick
Old 08-21-04, 03:24 PM
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a Scoring mistake is HUGELY different to a bad call

Bush's bad influence on the american people has spread to the olympics
Old 08-21-04, 03:27 PM
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Originally posted by Original Desmond
typical American arrogance and bad sportmanship not to give back the gold medal
Yup.

We are all like that. All 290,000,000 of us.

Especially people in Buffalo.
Old 08-21-04, 03:27 PM
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Originally posted by Original Desmond

Bush's bad influence on the american people has spread to the olympics
Old 08-21-04, 03:35 PM
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Originally posted by indianajdp
Yup.

We are all like that. All 290,000,000 of us.

Especially people in Buffalo.
Old 08-21-04, 03:38 PM
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Somewhere Roy Jones Jr. is smiling.
Old 08-21-04, 03:40 PM
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i heard the women in Buffalo are especially ugly too mate so yeah people there have it doubley bad
Old 08-21-04, 03:46 PM
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Originally posted by Original Desmond
a Scoring mistake is HUGELY different to a bad call

Bush's bad influence on the american people has spread to the olympics

Desmond, if you want to make a statement about politics, find an appropriate thread in the Other forum. This event has nothing to do with anyone's country of origin or their political leaders.
Old 08-21-04, 03:57 PM
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USA! USA! USA!
Old 08-21-04, 04:01 PM
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Re: Paul Hamm wins Gold Medal by mistake

Actually, I'm pretty sure he was TRYING to win the medal.

Old 08-21-04, 04:08 PM
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Originally posted by Dead
Desmond, if you want to make a statement about politics, find an appropriate thread in the Other forum. This event has nothing to do with anyone's country of origin or their political leaders.
i was only kidding mate, was just a friendly jib

suprised you didn't pick up on that mate

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