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Triple Crown

Old 06-05-04, 01:32 PM
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Triple Crown

on espn.com front page.. they have a poll. which is the more difficult triple crown.. of course, baseball triple crown has gotta be the toughest.. but Im surprised to see how many people picked horse racing..

did I hear right that 5 of the last 7 years, there has been a horse win the first 2 legs of the triple crown and then lose the last one?
that doesnt sound like its too terrible tough.. might not happen, but for them to be so close, so often, its bound to happen


here are the current voting results:

Win Triple Crown in baseball 52%
Win Triple Crown in horse racing 15%
Win Grand Slam in golf 27%
Win Grand Slam in tennis 5%
Total Votes: 142772
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Old 06-05-04, 01:33 PM
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remembering back.. gary sheffield use to flirt with that triple crown alot.. several years back.

barry hasnt had anyone in the lineup getting on base in front of him during his historic runs.. so no way he could ever compete with RBIs

pujols seems like a solid contender
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Old 06-05-04, 01:45 PM
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Triple crown in horse racing is clearly the toughest feat.

You're asking 3-year olds to run at a distance (1 1/4) that very very few have even run.

Two weeks later you ask them to run 1 3/16.

Three weeks later you ask them to run 1 1/2.

In addition, in the Belmont there are nearly always lightly raced 3-year olds to compete with.
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Old 06-05-04, 01:47 PM
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but if 5 out of 7 years, you get to the point where all they have to do is win 1 single race

you would think the odds are there for them to win it.. especially if they really are that good
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Old 06-05-04, 01:54 PM
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I'd say the golf Grand Slam. For one thing, it has never been done unless you count what Bobby Jones did as a Grand Slam. In any given year, you can have 4 very different courses so that is one problem. Second, there are so many good golfers that all it takes is one to find the ideal course and be hot to spoil a Grand Slam.

Last edited by Red Dog; 06-05-04 at 01:59 PM.
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Old 06-05-04, 01:59 PM
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Originally posted by Red Dog
I'd say the golf Grand Slam. For one thing, it has never been done unless you count what Bobby Jones did as a Grand Slam. In any given year, you can have 4 very different courses so that is one problem. Second, there are so many good golfers that it all it takes is one to find the ideal course and be hot to spoil a Grand Slam.
I'd also agree that this and the baseball one are the hardest to accomplish.
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Old 06-05-04, 02:00 PM
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Originally posted by twikoff

you would think the odds are there for them to win it.. especially if they really are that good


There is a huge difference in a 3-year old running 1 1/4 miles & 1 1/2 miles. Some horses simply won't rate for the distance. You had an example last year. That's why they call the Belmont the test of champions.

You have to have 3 almost perfect trips to win the triple crown in racing. That's a huge chore when you're talking about a 18-horse field in the Kentucky Derby (until last year you could have a 22-horse field. What if you draw the outside post? Do you realize how much farther you have to run to the first turn in order to get position? If the horse gets seriously bumped, he can't win. If he gets boxed in along the rail or anywhere else, he can't win.

I don't believe a baseball players position in the lineup is determined by a luck of the draw.
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Old 06-05-04, 02:06 PM
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and you need 4 perfect tournaments to win the grand slam in golf. golf is the hardest, because like Red Dog said, no one has ever done it.
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Old 06-05-04, 02:07 PM
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Originally posted by Stu 17

and you need 4 perfect tournaments to win the grand slam in golf. golf is the hardest, because like Red Dog said, no one has ever done it.
Bobby Jones did it.

BTW: You don't have 4 perfect tournaments to win the grand slam in golf.
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Old 06-05-04, 02:09 PM
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Originally posted by classicman2
There is a huge difference in a 3-year old running 1 1/4 miles & 1 1/2 miles. Some horses simply won't rate for the distance. You had an example last year. That's why they call the Belmont the test of champions.

You have to have 3 almost perfect trips to win the triple crown in racing. That's a huge chore when you're talking about a 18-horse field in the Kentucky Derby (until last year you could have a 22-horse field. What if you draw the outside post? Do you realize how much farther you have to run to the first turn in order to get position? If the horse gets seriously bumped, he can't win. If he gets boxed in along the rail or anywhere else, he can't win.

I don't believe a baseball players position in the lineup is determined by a luck of the draw.
i dont pretend to follow horse racing at all.. and really dont care much about it..

but what i see.. is that 5 out of the last 7 times.. you end up with a horse that is suppose to be the best one out there and only has to win 1 race to win a triple crown..

then that horse comes in as the extreme favorite by vegas to win...
now, the oddsmakers in vegas arent chumps.. they generally know what they need to do to make money.. and putting 1-9 odds on a horse that has no chance to win, doesnt seem to make much sense..
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Old 06-05-04, 02:10 PM
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Originally posted by Stu 17
and you need 4 perfect tournaments to win the grand slam in golf. golf is the hardest, because like Red Dog said, no one has ever done it.
didnt tiger hold them all 4 at one time.. just not technically in the same calender year or something
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Old 06-05-04, 02:12 PM
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What does Vegas have to do with horse racing?
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Old 06-05-04, 02:13 PM
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Originally posted by classicman2
Bobby Jones did it.

BTW: You don't have 4 perfect tournaments to win the grand slam in golf.

I already said that Jones did it. Fields were not as deep back then, and as I think you will agree, equipment has really leveled things and created a much deeper tour. Also winning a US Amateur is far different - in match play, you only need to beat a small number of golfers and you can make several mistakes without doing too much damage. Not sure if the British Amateur is match play but if it is, then that makes this point doubly important.

Jack Nicklaus - greatest golfer ever - the closest he ever came to a GS was 2/4 - a few times. I believe only once did he win the first 2 legs.
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Old 06-05-04, 02:13 PM
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Woods won the 4 in a 12-month period. It just didn't happen to occur in the same year.
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Old 06-05-04, 02:14 PM
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Originally posted by classicman2
What does Vegas have to do with horse racing?
who sets the betting odds?
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Old 06-05-04, 02:15 PM
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Must I remind Red Dog that not that long ago the PGA was match play?
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Old 06-05-04, 02:16 PM
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Originally posted by twikoff

who sets the betting odds
You don't know much about horse racing, do you?

I'll give you a hint - it ain't Los Vegas.

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Old 06-05-04, 02:16 PM
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Originally posted by twikoff
didnt tiger hold them all 4 at one time.. just not technically in the same calender year or something

Yeah but that is not a Grand Slam. Close, but no cigar. However, think about the courses Tiger won on - of course, Augusta is the perfect course for Tiger - he hit the 2 Open rotations at the perfect time - Pebble (his ideal US Open course) and St Andrews (his ideal British Open course). This is the kind of setup you need to see one player sweep the majors.
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Old 06-05-04, 02:17 PM
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Originally posted by classicman2
You don't know much about horse racing, do you?

I'll give you a hint - it ain't Los Vegas.

not at all

why would I?

i dont bet.. and 99% of interest in horse racing is the gambling.. the other 1% is the jockeys.

and i assumed that any betting odds would be set in vegas... like they are for everything else
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Old 06-05-04, 02:18 PM
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Originally posted by classicman2
Must I remind Red Dog that not that long ago the PGA was match play?

Of course. I'll remind you that BJ's Grand Slam did not include a PGA Championship.
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Old 06-05-04, 02:22 PM
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The odds in horse are true odds - determined by a paramutual system - both at the track where the race is held and in all of the multitude of OTB establishments throughout the country.
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Old 06-05-04, 02:26 PM
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Golf is the hardest. Followed by Baseball.
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Old 06-05-04, 02:27 PM
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true odds

is that like 'military intelligence'?
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Old 06-05-04, 02:32 PM
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twikoff,

I think your reference of 5 out of 7 horses winning the first two legs, (and C-Man's subsequent counter), is akin to a batter winning the Homerun and RBI titles, while also being in the top ten or twelve in Batting Average. How many times has that happened? Quite a few I'd venture to guess. However, that last component, Batting Average in this case, is the hardest to attain, just like the Belmont is usually the most difficult race to win. Just another viewpoint.

Personally, I'm with RedDog on this one, the Golf GS is the hardest. Horse racing's is second, followed by baseball.




Yet, with the specialisation now seen in Tennis, that Grand Slam, (mens only), may be the most impossible?

Now I've confused myself.
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Old 06-05-04, 02:34 PM
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definitly have to specify women's when talking about tennis

because i dont think its out of the question to think serena will win at least a grandslam, if not multiple ones
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