So here it is. The Buffy thread is 20 pages long & I only just finished Season 3, so I really didn't want to add Angel to the same thread & wade through pages of Buffy stuff to get to Angel discusion. So mods I hope this thread is cool.

I never planned on watching Angel now, but hell, I never planned on actually liking Buffy. So like the other thread, this will be a log of my thoughts, watching all of Angel for the very first time. Also like the other thread, these are my honest opinions, so not everything is going to be roses & cupcakes but I don't rag on anything without giving my reasons, if I never warm up to Angel or get bored with it, I will just stop the thread.

Please NO SPOILERS AT ALL ABOUT FUTURE EPISODES OR CHARACTERS. You can see how far I've watched & talk as much as you like up until then.

Now, on to the show. Watched the first 4 over the weekend.

"City Of" - Much like the first episode of Buffy, the first show didn't do much for me & has a lot to deter me from watching more. Starting right off was the Angel popping out the two knives from his sleeve in maybe the most done to death action cliche since bullet-time. Plus I just thought it was cheezy & out of character, Angel never made any vamp killing gadgets on Buffy. And I still have a hard time getting past where Angel gets all his money. But maybe most annoying was Angel just walking around in broad daylight. At the end of the ep he literally has sunlight directly on him inside the apartment talking to Cordy. Doyle is the standard comic relief, doesn't do anything for me so far. Are the "senior partners" already setting up the big bad of the season.

The good stuff. I always liked Cord, she had one funny line "I thought I was going to faint while barfing". I don't dislike Angel. They give him such corny lines sometimes that make me cringe, but if written right, he can deliver a good line very deadpan. And I like that he is introverted & not comfortable around people. He can pull off being a different type of hero.

"Lonely Hearts" - I thought the main story of this one was really boring. Maybe Kate the cop is a new supporting character. Doyle & Angels reaction to Cords apartment was funny & Cord has a funnly line also "It's a Donkey? We didn't see any donkey-demons." But aside from that I really thought this was dull.

"In The Dark" - Now this is the entertaining Spike, much better than the Buffy ep that starts this story line. His opening monologue was great. "And now I'm just a big, fluffy puppy with bad teeth...no! not the hair! Never the hair!". Much like those great scenes with evil Angel taunting Spike in Buffy, Spike plays off of Angel better than with Buffy, his worste moments are all with Buffy. Spike & a welcome appearance from Oz made this one pretty good, but also emphasized to me that Angel really needs a better supporting cast. But its early, so I could excuse that.

"I Fall To Pieces" - I don't know, maybe its that Buffy S4 isn't impressing me very much or that this is just too much Buffy in too short a time, but again I was just boooooored watching this. I wanted to fast foward through it, but I didn't. Kate the cop is back, but not a character I particularly care to see more of. Way too dainty & girly to be a cop in LA. Cord is good, doing her schtick well, detachable eyeyballs are cool, & Angel trying to lighten up his wardrobe was cute, but overally I was just bored.

So, while it sounds negative, its just like Buffy was so far. Very early on, & the early eps aren't really impressing me, but not to worry.

You're going to really get into this show.

I wasn't a huge fan of Angel's first season myself, there were just enough good episodes to bring me back for season 2. From year 2 on it far surpassed Buffy IMO though.

Welcome to a wonderful show.

Yeah, and FWIW, season 1 of Angel was just... okay, at best.
It doesn't get good until season 2, which has more of a season-long story arc.
And then by season 3, it gets fuckin' balls-to-the-wall awesome... ahem.
Anywho, stick with it, you won't be dissapointed.

I think that Angel s1 and BtVS s4 both suffered horribly from Joss trying to do too much. He proved he's no David E. Kelley

Angel in sunlight. Very, very effed up. Joss even announced his displeasure with this. It happened way too often.

Spike's opening monologue gets me rolling every time.

Add me to the list of people who thinks Angel Season 1 -- particularly the first half of the season -- is mediocre television at best. The series gets better and better with each succeeding season, though.

Could a mod fix the spelling of "Marathon" in the thread title? Otherwise, it will probably drive me mad by the time we work our way through all 110 episodes of Angel.

Yeah, we started wondering how he is getting around in the daylight. Later they run the "through the sewers" explanation. What, is Angel a Frickin' Ninja Turtle? I find it hard to believe he can really get around as effectively as he does through the sewers.

And sometimes the sunlight is kind of indirect, I.E. coming through the shades...so much for catching on fire or at least smoking a bit.

Yeah, definitely. It is already driving me nuts, evertime I see the thread title. I must have had a dyslexic moment. If a mod has a chance, could you please fix that.

Add one more voice to the choir: it does get better.

I really enjoyed it the first time around but when I went back to it I found it kind of . . . lacking, I suppose. It perks up towards the end of this season though and really begins to roll along about a third of the way through season two as it further breaks away from Buffy.

Hehe, I still don't understand how you're doing this. Buffy is one of my all-time favorite shows, but I got so bored watching an episode every day back when they first started showing reruns on FX. I didn't see season 1-4 of Buffy when they originially aired. When FX went to 2 episodes a day about a month after they started, I just had to put all the episodes on tape and watch them at my convenience. I think Buffy is an amazing show, but there's certain elements that are way too repetitive to watch the way you're watching it imo. Of course, I just get bored easily too, so maybe it's just me.

Yeah, I get that feeling when the obligatory fight scene starts up. Its a shame they didn't have the confidence to do away with them more.

Oh, and as for Angel's money; although it was never explained, I always assumed he got it via Whistler from The Powers That Be to get him back on his feet.

When you get to the bonus features, you'll see a deleted scene from the pilot in which Doyle has a vision of Angel selling shares of WorldCom and Enron short.

Edit: I was going to stay away from spoilers, but I checked an episode guide and see the issue of money has already come up among the characters by I Fall to Pieces. So they don't just ignore it and pretend that Angel has a chest full of gold dubloons in the basement.

For me, the turning point of Season 1 was the two-parter. I won't give away what happens(although the title is a big hint), but that's when Angel truly started going places even Buffy never dared.

Thanks for adding the spoiler tag.

when you hit season 2, im gonna watch them at the same time, because i still haven't made it through all of 2 and 3. i watched 4 and 5 when they aired, and i watched 1 when it was released, but i never found the time to watch 2 and 3, so i will look forward to it...

Angel is (in my opinion) far superior to Buffy. Seasons Two through Five are just great examples of epic storytelling and character development. I think I'm going to start over from the beginning and watch along with you...I have a feeling I'm going to enjoy this thread IMMENSELY.

The scenes you are referring to are quite possibly some of the funniest things I have seen on tv. Makes me want to go back and rewatch that episode right now.

Quit on Angel after "I will Remember You"

Came back for "Five by Five", and never missed an episode after that.

Vampires can walk around during the day, just not in direct sunlight. At least that's the story...

The rules for what kills vampires, especially fire and sunlight, aren't really hard and fast. Sometimes you'll see a vampire go into sunlight and start to smoulder and smoke, other times they'll burst into flames immediately.

Same with fire... sometimes you'll see a vampire dust after a small part of him is set on fire; in another case, you'll see a vampire doused with gasoline, torched, burn for about a minute before being put out, and not dust.

my favorite episode of the entire run...just for the bit in the credits...and for the 5 seconds of it in the episode. Watch the party part of the episode, and then just skip to the credits.

sooooo out of character and soooooo f'ing funny!

Spoiler for Bandoman that tells him what he missed, in case he can't wait to get home:

"Actually, in Hell, you tend to know a lot of the people." - Angel on the difference between Hell and Cordelia's party.