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2020 Presidential/Vice-Presidential Debates

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2020 Presidential/Vice-Presidential Debates

Old 09-29-20, 11:39 AM
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2020 Presidential/Vice-Presidential Debates

I thought this might be a more elemental topic in general worthy of it's own thread, rather than getting posted in one of the others only to be buried and lost by a lot of the usual, of-the-moment trivialities . What is relayed below are general principles to keep in mind for any debate viewing.

There''s a more complete write up here by Molly McKew-
Here's the condensed version

"Tonight is the 1st presidential debate. Likely there will be a lot of mis/disinformation + conspiracies thrown around.

How can you fight malign narrative & improve online discourse on social media during the debate?"

Originally Posted by Molly McKew
Don’t elevate false or misleading information or conspiracies from POTUS by reposting them in outrage.

When you post/reply/engage sub content, it amplifies them in algorithms/trends & helps them reach more people. It also pressures traditional media to cover these claims.

You should consider not engaging or posting them at all. Deprive toxic claims of the attention economy. Just leave it alone.

But, if you want to push back on toxic information, here are some ideas how to do it better:

Option 1: Always offer the truth or a factual claim before and after presenting the false statement.

People remember what they see first, so lead with the truth, close with the truth.


Option 2: Post the truth without the false claim, or post an issue/fact that you think is more important than the diversion offered.

Change the tone of the online discussion. Have an arsenal of stories or facts handy for such a purpose.


Option 3: Wait for a professional factchecker to post the facts, and post the factcheck instead of the naked claim.

Know the narratives and deflections that are likely to be used in advance, and be ready to respond or ignore them as needed.


By now, POTUS especially has road-tested his toxic narratives in tweets and press conferences and via presidential defenders over the past weeks.

Understand the inherent tension of this call-and-response style narrative warfare. Don’t respond as expected. Find a different way to participate in the discussions of crucial themes. Stay focused on what is important to you in the election instead, offer those perspectives


Don’t mimic the reflexive response that is expected or conditioned, because often whatever that is is designed to amplify the perception of an irreconcilably divided America on the brink of collapse — a narrative our adversaries enjoy, particularly when we push it ourselves.

- Know what is important to you and your community, and offer posts from those perspectives.

This is a very powerful way to rebut/counter something you disagree with during the debates, for statements made by either candidate, or to enhance a point.
These are just a few simple strategies, but ones that I think will serve you well instead of just amplifying the expected noise.
Overall:
-take time to think about the issue
-consider what kinds of positive, fact-driven, authentic content you can offer beyond outrage tweets or point-scoring
-avoid behaving or responding to narratives in the ways adversaries, be they foreign or domestic, will cheer

This is not the time to inflame divisions, but to remind that real leadership is needed to address the issues that face us and bridge those divisions.
FWIW, I think Biden has almost nothing to gain in tonights debate and everything to lose. Trump is the exact opposite.
Biden is vulnerable in so many ways, and not just politically. And having a live audience is a total bullshit, Trump move. But, it is what it is...
Old 09-29-20, 11:43 AM
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re: 2020 Presidential/Vice-Presidential Debates

How about I just post pics of turd piles with the word "Trump" written above or below the turd pile?
Old 09-29-20, 11:48 AM
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re: 2020 Presidential/Vice-Presidential Debates

How can you fight malign narrative & improve online discourse on social media during the debate?
Don't engage.
Old 09-29-20, 11:54 AM
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re: 2020 Presidential/Vice-Presidential Debates

Originally Posted by Dan View Post
Don't engage.
Donít run specials titled like 20/20 is - Trump vs Biden: The Main Event.
Old 09-29-20, 11:54 AM
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re: 2020 Presidential/Vice-Presidential Debates

Originally Posted by Bandoman View Post
How about I just post pics of turd piles with the word "Trump" written above or below the turd pile?
That's "Option 2: Post the truth without the false claim, or post an issue/fact that you think is more important than the diversion offered."
Old 09-29-20, 12:03 PM
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re: 2020 Presidential/Vice-Presidential Debates

Better yet, I'll be watching the MLB playoffs.
Old 09-29-20, 12:04 PM
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re: 2020 Presidential/Vice-Presidential Debates

This all may seem like condescending, no-brainer stuff.

However it may help, post-debate, to have something in black & white to point to when people are doing the exact opposite of what was suggested.
Old 09-29-20, 12:32 PM
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re: 2020 Presidential/Vice-Presidential Debates

I'll be watching baseball.
Old 09-29-20, 12:36 PM
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re: 2020 Presidential/Vice-Presidential Debates

Curious why people watch debates? In the past, it was so undecided folk could get more info on the candidates stances. But with social media, we hear from them every day. Is it just for entertainment's sake?

I will stay far, far away from any news channel tonight.
Old 09-29-20, 12:39 PM
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re: 2020 Presidential/Vice-Presidential Debates

Originally Posted by Noonan View Post
Curious why people watch debates? In the past, it was so undecided folk could get more info on the candidates stances. But with social media, we hear from them every day. Is it just for entertainment's sake?

I will stay far, far away from any news channel tonight.
I watched most of the primary debates because I honestly was looking to see who would be the best choice (the whole purpose, I suppose). I'm watching tonight - not because I'm not already decided - but I'm hoping to see trump do a total meltdown. But if the audience is too overbearing, I'll just wait for highlights later.
Old 09-29-20, 12:42 PM
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re: 2020 Presidential/Vice-Presidential Debates

Originally Posted by Paul_SD View Post
This all may seem like condescending, no-brainer stuff.

However it may help, post-debate, to have something in black & white to point to when people are doing the exact opposite of what was suggested.
For what, online discussion wars?

I won't watch the debate - I can't sit there waiting for Trump to muddle his way through a response. I'll catch the highlights later. I have a shed door to fix anyway. A much better use of my time.
Old 09-29-20, 12:54 PM
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re: 2020 Presidential/Vice-Presidential Debates

Originally Posted by Draven View Post
For what, online discussion wars?

I won't watch the debate - I can't sit there waiting for Trump to muddle his way through a response. I'll catch the highlights later. I have a shed door to fix anyway. A much better use of my time.
Don't you want to win Twitter?
Old 09-29-20, 01:08 PM
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re: 2020 Presidential/Vice-Presidential Debates

Originally Posted by Draven View Post
For what, online discussion wars?

I won't watch the debate - I can't sit there waiting for Trump to muddle his way through a response. I'll catch the highlights later. I have a shed door to fix anyway. A much better use of my time.
Physical activity is good. Very therapeutic.

I'll miss your insight, though, when others here are re-hashing whatever it is the MSM is focused on coming out of it.

Old 09-29-20, 01:16 PM
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re: 2020 Presidential/Vice-Presidential Debates

Originally Posted by Paul_SD View Post
Physical activity is good. Very therapeutic.

I'll miss your insight, though, when others here are re-hashing whatever it is the MSM is focused on coming out of it.
Well that's nice to hear, thank you.

My hope is that Biden doesn't slip up in a way that gives red meat to the right. The whole drug test and checking Biden for hidden earpieces is silly enough to ignore. If Biden has a big stumble, that's more problematic.

Considering that Clinton easily beat Trump yet plenty said he won means the debates don't actually matter. Right now, it's Biden's to lose. Just gotta get to November 3rd.
Old 09-29-20, 01:26 PM
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re: 2020 Presidential/Vice-Presidential Debates

Did you already vote?

My friend in Albert Lea excitedly texted me last week after he had. I'll have to wait till the last week in October before we are able to here.

And yes, I'm cringing at what can happen, while everyone else is so certain they will only see a rout. Trump may be a lumbering choad, but there are plenty on his team who aren't, and who are absolutely remorseless when it comes to saving their own hides. (which means saving Trump's).
Old 09-29-20, 02:02 PM
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re: 2020 Presidential/Vice-Presidential Debates

Originally Posted by Paul_SD View Post
Did you already vote?

My friend in Albert Lea excitedly texted me last week after he had. I'll have to wait till the last week in October before we are able to here.

And yes, I'm cringing at what can happen, while everyone else is so certain they will only see a rout. Trump may be a lumbering choad, but there are plenty on his team who aren't, and who are absolutely remorseless when it comes to saving their own hides. (which means saving Trump's).
No - I'm voting on Election Day. I trust the mail-in processes completely but I want to get up, stand in that line and cast my vote that day. It's symbolic, I know, but it's important to me.
Old 09-29-20, 03:27 PM
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re: 2020 Presidential/Vice-Presidential Debates

Originally Posted by Draven View Post
but I want to get up, stand in that line and cast my vote that day. It's symbolic, I know, but it's important to me.
We can't do that in NJ as it's all Mail-in. Which I think is wrong as we should have the option to vote by Mail (because of Covid19) or vote at a polling booth like I have for the past 30 years.
Old 09-29-20, 03:37 PM
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re: 2020 Presidential/Vice-Presidential Debates

I'll be watching the debate for the same reason I will stare at a car crash if it happens in front of me. I can remember the first one I watched, too--when Carter debated Reagan in the 1980 campaign. I was writing a paper for my sophomore social studies class in high school and I sat up with my parents to take notes. So I got a front seat to the whole "There he goes again" thing, which four years later Fritz Mondale tried to use against Reagan when he ran for President, only to be slapped down with a stinging rejoinder since Reagan knew he'd try to use it.
Old 09-29-20, 03:56 PM
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re: 2020 Presidential/Vice-Presidential Debates

I’m dvr’ing it since I’ll be at work late. I plan on having a few drinks and watching it when I get home.
Old 09-29-20, 04:12 PM
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re: 2020 Presidential/Vice-Presidential Debates

Originally Posted by Noonan View Post
Curious why people watch debates? In the past, it was so undecided folk could get more info on the candidates stances. But with social media, we hear from them every day. Is it just for entertainment's sake?

I will stay far, far away from any news channel tonight.
Thanks to Biden, this is entirely for entertainment. I cannot believe this is actually going to happen.
Old 09-29-20, 04:18 PM
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re: 2020 Presidential/Vice-Presidential Debates

Originally Posted by DVD Polizei View Post
Thanks to Biden, this is entirely for entertainment. I cannot believe this is actually going to happen.
Why wouldn't it?
Old 09-29-20, 04:22 PM
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re: 2020 Presidential/Vice-Presidential Debates

Originally Posted by Noonan View Post
Curious why people watch debates? In the past, it was so undecided folk could get more info on the candidates stances. But with social media, we hear from them every day. Is it just for entertainment's sake?

I will stay far, far away from any news channel tonight.
Seems like politics are just like sports anymore (been that way a while, just getting worse).

I think a lot of people watch to root for their "guy" and/or to see how their team did. And then go and listen to the talking heads. And then go and argue, taunt, claim victory, and rant on social media.
Old 09-29-20, 04:43 PM
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re: 2020 Presidential/Vice-Presidential Debates

Originally Posted by Draven View Post
Why wouldn't it?
Because heís living in a bubble where Biden is a doddering, senile old fool. The projection would be laughable if it werenít so transparently pathetic.
Old 09-29-20, 04:45 PM
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re: 2020 Presidential/Vice-Presidential Debates

Originally Posted by coli View Post
We can't do that in NJ as it's all Mail-in. Which I think is wrong as we should have the option to vote by Mail (because of Covid19) or vote at a polling booth like I have for the past 30 years.
Good news, then.

You may choose to vote in person at your polling place, from 6:00 a.m. to 8:00 p.m. on election day, November 3, and you will be provided a provisional paper ballot. ADA compliant voting machines will only be available to voters who certify they have a disability that prevents them from voting independently on a paper ballot.


https://www.nj.gov/state/elections/vote-how-to.shtml

GOP delenda est.
Old 09-29-20, 04:49 PM
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re: 2020 Presidential/Vice-Presidential Debates

Originally Posted by Draven View Post
Why wouldn't it?
Originally Posted by whaaat View Post
Because he’s living in a bubble where Biden is a doddering, senile old fool. The projection would be laughable if it weren’t so transparently pathetic.
Ok, well, let's see how this debate goes. Hearing devices, drugs, et al.

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