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Socialism defeated in Bolivia!

Old 11-22-19, 12:26 AM
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Socialism defeated in Bolivia!

Updated 11.22.19

Background
Socialist president Evo Morales wanted to run for President of Bolivia for a fourth time well past the term limits. He held a vote to get the constitution changed to get rid of term limits but the people voted it down. Unhappy with the results, he then went to the country's supreme court and, full of socialist judges, they ruled that term limits violated his human rights, so he was good to run for president as much as he wanted.
Election takes place but as Evo Morales is losing the vote count mysteriously stops. When it restarts Morales is suddenly ahead. The people are protesting and claiming election fraud. The OAS gets involved and says yeah, "manipulations" occurred in the process. Evo Morales says okay, okay, lets have a do-over. The military and police side with the opposition party and the protesters and suggest that Evo Morales just steps down for the good of the country. He flees to Mexico where has has political asylum. Capitalism wins again!

The above was the interpretation I got from people who were supposedly following what's going on. After Giantrobo and Inri posted in the meme section I looked more into it, and saw footage of indigenous Bolivians being rounded up, beaten, and smoked out of their homes by the police and military. I then found this video on the story by Kyle Kulinski of Secular Talk:

Takeways
-Bolivia didn't have term limits on the presidency until Morales took office. He instituted them.
-The Supreme Tribunal of Justice are not comprised of judges appointed by the president, but are democratically elected by the people.
-The election count that was stopped and re-started wasn't even the official count. It's the "quick count" and never goes all the way to 100%. The only reason they re-started and continued the quick count was because of protests.
-The rural parts of Bolivia, where Morales has the most support, are the last to be counted which explains the jump in votes for Morales.
-When the votes were disputed, Morales invited the OAS to check the results and agreed to have another vote if there were any irregularities found. They did find "manipulations" and Morales says, okay, lets have a fresh vote again.

There's more points made by Kulinski in the video. I personally think that Kulinski might be a little biased but so far it seems to match up with the facts. For example, his point about the "Supreme Court" (actually SToJ) being democratically elected. Yup, that's true.

I'll try to update this later with more points from the video and footage on the ground in Bolivia.

Last edited by brayzie; 11-22-19 at 01:17 PM.
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Old 11-22-19, 12:42 AM
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Re: Socialism defeated in Bolivia!

Bolivia? Barely know him.
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Old 11-22-19, 01:23 AM
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Re: Socialism defeated in Bolivia!

Morales was an extremely effective and successful leader. But his consolidation of power over the last few years was straight out of the dictator playbook and he needed to go.

That said, what's happening with interim president Anez is horrific, and she should be prosecuted as a murderer.
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Old 11-22-19, 09:01 AM
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Re: Socialism defeated in Bolivia!

Originally Posted by JasonF View Post
Morales was an extremely effective and successful leader. But his consolidation of power over the last few years was straight out of the dictator playbook and he needed to go.

That said, what's happening with interim president Anez is horrific, and she should be prosecuted as a murderer.
Yeah but, socialism had been defeated, and that's all that matters, right? /s
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Old 11-22-19, 09:15 AM
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Re: Socialism defeated in Bolivia!

Doesn't the socialist party still have a majority in their congress?
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Old 11-22-19, 09:44 AM
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Re: Socialism defeated in Bolivia!

Originally Posted by Dan View Post


Yeah but, socialism had been defeated, and that's all that matters, right? /s
It's weird how all the countries that Republicans like to point to, to breed socialist fear are run by dictators. They always seem to leave out the 'run by a dictator' part.
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Old 11-22-19, 10:02 AM
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Re: Socialism defeated in Bolivia!

Have to have someone in charge that allows wealthy countries to plunder the resources, who cares about what's best for the Bolivian people. Bring on the right wing death squads and make the ghosts of Ronald Reagan and George HW Bush happy.
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Old 11-22-19, 11:24 AM
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Re: Socialism defeated in Bolivia!

Oh, thank god the world is now safe from the scourge of socialism.
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Old 11-22-19, 01:15 PM
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Re: Socialism defeated in Bolivia!

Originally Posted by JasonF View Post
Morales was an extremely effective and successful leader. But his consolidation of power over the last few years was straight out of the dictator playbook and he needed to go.
Aside from getting rid of term limits what else has there been? And has any of it been done illegally? Because from what I'm reading he was a successful president and everything has been done legally, including the highest court of Bolivia ruling against term limits.
If he needed to go, shouldn't that have been determined by the people and not by the military?
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Old 11-22-19, 01:51 PM
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Re: Socialism defeated in Bolivia!

Originally Posted by brayzie View Post
Aside from getting rid of term limits what else has there been? And has any of it been done illegally? Because from what I'm reading he was a successful president and everything has been done legally, including the highest court of Bolivia ruling against term limits.
If he needed to go, shouldn't that have been determined by the people and not by the military?
Even amid all this progress, early warning signs indicated trouble on the political front. Bolivia’s social and economic successes did not translate into strengthened democratic institutions. From early in his tenure, Morales showed autocratic tendencies that over time led to abuses of power. The MASmanipulated the courts to rule in its favorby appointing loyalists, intimidated political opponents, and betrayed a lack of respect for institutional checks and balances. The trend intensified after 2009, when the party won an absolute majority in both houses of parliament, allowing it to consolidate its power.

Morales’s personalistic and authoritarian proclivities gradually insulated the MAS from the base of organizers and social movements that had propelled the party to power and had, at times, served as a partial check on presidential authority. The more centralized the party became, the less likely new leaders were to emerge and carry the mantle forward. In 2014, the MAS declared Morales to be “indispensable” and announced that it would not groom a new party leader. Rather, Morales would serve, seemingly, in perpetuity: in 2016, the government held a referendum to remove presidential term limits. The referendum failed, leading Morales to complain that he had a “human right” to run for office indefinitely. The country’s highest court, dominated by Morales’s allies, supported his reasoning in a controversial ruling the following year. In essence, Morales had succumbed to what might be termed the “autocratic temptation”—the illusion that he not only spoke and acted on behalf of the entire people but could do so forever. The result was a leadership untethered from any mechanisms of accountability and insulated from feedback that could provide a counterweight to its power.

The referendum debacle severely undermined Morales’s democratic legitimacy, sharply polarized Bolivian politics, and revitalized a conservative opposition that for years had been too fractious to pose a serious electoral threat. Strong opposition movements emerged in some former bastions of support, such as Potosí, and some formerly staunch MAS allies, including the country’s biggest trade union confederation and smaller indigenous groups, even switched to the opposition. The episode also revitalized opposition to Morales among economic elites in the city of Santa Cruz, Bolivia’s economic powerhouse, which helps explain the MAS’s electoral underperformance in that crucial region in the October 20 election. The city has since become a crucial base of support for the right-wing interim government.
https://www.foreignaffairs.com/artic...-after-morales
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Old 11-22-19, 01:55 PM
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Re: Socialism defeated in Bolivia!

Thanks for the follow up. I'm reading the full article right now.
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Old 11-23-19, 06:18 PM
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Re: Socialism defeated in Bolivia!

All of that sounds like what Trump pines uncontrollably for here. He would love to have absolute say in everything.
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