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Official Trump Presidency Thread, Part 3

Old 04-23-19, 02:35 PM
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Re: Official Trump Presidency Thread, Part 3

Originally Posted by joeblow69 View Post
There is literally NO ONE of any consequence that thinks impeachment will pass the senate at this point. The question people are debating now is if it is worth doing it just to pass it in the house, knowing full well it will fail in the senate.
Unless prolonged, public hearings cause Trump's approval rating to plummet within the Republican party, putting pressure on at least some Senate Republicans to cut ties. It has to get to the point where there is more downside to supporting than Trump, such that his endorsements or attacks no longer have the power they now have.
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Old 04-23-19, 02:37 PM
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Re: Official Trump Presidency Thread, Part 3

Originally Posted by Bandoman View Post
Unless prolonged, public hearings cause Trump's approval rating to plummet within the Republican party, putting pressure on at least some Senate Republicans to cut ties. It has to get to the point where there is more downside to supporting than Trump, such that his endorsements or attacks no longer have the power they now have.
Yeah, I think public hearings re-affirming all that nasty stuff in the report is probably the way to go. Maybe invite the president to appear in front of them as well, so he can tell his side?
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Old 04-23-19, 02:41 PM
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Re: Official Trump Presidency Thread, Part 3

Originally Posted by GoVegan View Post
I think rather than smirking at you, most here would be curious to know what you thought of the Mueller report. I don't know anyone who's found as little to dislike about Trump or his behavior as you have, so I'd be very interested to know if you find the acts detailed in the report to be acceptable.
I've said it here before but I have a real high standard for impeaching a President. I thought it was wrong when the Republicans did it to Clinton in 1999, and think it will be wrong if the Democrats impeach Trump. I don't think Clinton and Trump's actions rise to the level of Impeachment, and that is as honest as an answer that I can give you. I do think it is a coincidence (and embodies what I hate about partisan politics) that the majority of Republicans thought Clinton should have been impeached in 1999, and the majority of Democrats thought he shouldn't be impeached. And the same goes for Trump, as the Democrats are the ones who want him impeached, and the Republicans are the ones who don't think he should be impeached.

Wow, what a coincidence??? The other party thinks the President should be impeached, his own party thinks he shouldn't!!! Wow, it's almost like nobody can literally think for themselves as it's typical partisan bullshit politics. I stand by that Clinton shouldn't have been impeached, and I stand by that Trump shouldn't be impeached. The irony is EVERY politican in Washington doesn't think that way.
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Old 04-23-19, 02:43 PM
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Re: Official Trump Presidency Thread, Part 3

Originally Posted by coli View Post
I've said it here before but I have a real high standard for impeaching a President. I thought it was wrong when the Republicans did it to Clinton in 1999, and think it will be wrong if the Democrats impeach Trump. I don't think Clinton and Trump's actions rise to the level of Impeachment, and that is as honest as an answer that I can give you. I do think it is a coincidence (and embodies what I hate about partisan politics) that the majority of Republicans thought Clinton should have been impeached in 1999, and the majority of Democrats thought he shouldn't be impeached. And the same goes for Trump, as the Democrats are the ones who want him impeached, and the Republicans are the ones who don't think he should be impeached.

Wow, what a coincidence??? The other party thinks the President should be impeached, his own party thinks he shouldn't!!! Wow, it's almost like nobody can literally think for themselves as it's typical partisan bullshit politics. I stand by that Clinton shouldn't have been impeached, and I stand by that Trump shouldn't be impeached. The irony is EVERY politican in Washington doesn't think that way.
So what you're saying is, you haven't read/looked at the report at all. That being the case, how can you say you don't think his actions rise to the level of impeachment?
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Old 04-23-19, 02:47 PM
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Re: Official Trump Presidency Thread, Part 3

Originally Posted by coli View Post
I've said it here before but I have a real high standard for impeaching a President. I thought it was wrong when the Republicans did it to Clinton in 1999, and think it will be wrong if the Democrats impeach Trump. I don't think Clinton and Trump's actions rise to the level of Impeachment, and that is as honest as an answer that I can give you. I do think it is a coincidence (and embodies what I hate about partisan politics) that the majority of Republicans thought Clinton should have been impeached in 1999, and the majority of Democrats thought he shouldn't be impeached. And the same goes for Trump, as the Democrats are the ones who want him impeached, and the Republicans are the ones who don't think he should be impeached.

Wow, what a coincidence??? The other party thinks the President should be impeached, his own party thinks he shouldn't!!! Wow, it's almost like nobody can literally think for themselves as it's typical partisan bullshit politics. I stand by that Clinton shouldn't have been impeached, and I stand by that Trump shouldn't be impeached. The irony is EVERY politican in Washington doesn't think that way.
If you think what Clinton did and what Trump did are in any way equal (thus justifying your position), then the discussion is hopeless.
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Old 04-23-19, 02:48 PM
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Re: Official Trump Presidency Thread, Part 3

Originally Posted by coli View Post
I've said it here before but I have a real high standard for impeaching a President. I thought it was wrong when the Republicans did it to Clinton in 1999, and think it will be wrong if the Democrats impeach Trump. I don't think Clinton and Trump's actions rise to the level of Impeachment
Looking back, I can honestly say that Clinton probably deserved what he got. He lied under oath. We can't have that in our leaders. We HAVE to hold the president to a higher standard than that. Now actually removing him from office would have probably been a step to far, but permanently besmirching his presidential legacy with a house passed impeachment? I'm totally fine with that. And I think at least that much is necessary in Trump's case.
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Old 04-23-19, 02:53 PM
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Re: Official Trump Presidency Thread, Part 3

Remember what I said earlier today about ret-conning of the Clinton years? We've just seen it...
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Old 04-23-19, 02:55 PM
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Re: Official Trump Presidency Thread, Part 3

What was the straw that broke Nixon? Was it clear that his own party Senators would have voted to impeach if he didn't resign?
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Old 04-23-19, 02:57 PM
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Re: Official Trump Presidency Thread, Part 3

Originally Posted by joeblow69 View Post
Looking back, I can honestly say that Clinton probably deserved what he got. He lied under oath. We can't have that in our leaders. We HAVE to hold the president to a higher standard than that. Now actually removing him from office would have probably been a step to far, but permanently besmirching his presidential legacy with a house passed impeachment? I'm totally fine with that. And I think at least that much is necessary in Trump's case.
Yeah, my thinking on that has evolved over time. At the time I was angry at what I saw as a hit job over a private matter of consensual sex (my thinking on that has also evolved - the power dynamic greatly affects the issue of consent). Now I realize that, no matter how ridiculous the investigation into Bill's relationship with Monica was, the President cannot lie under oath. That undermines our justice system, and he is in charge of that system. Impeachment was justified, even though I'm not sure that removal from office would have been (and it didn't happen).
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Old 04-23-19, 02:58 PM
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Re: Official Trump Presidency Thread, Part 3

Originally Posted by Noonan View Post
What was the straw that broke Nixon? Was it clear that his own party Senators would have voted to impeach if he didn't resign?
Yep. Goldwater and others went to Nixon and said they would vote to remove him from office if the House impeached him. Once he saw that he was losing sup[port among Republicans he took the easy way out.
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Old 04-23-19, 02:59 PM
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Re: Official Trump Presidency Thread, Part 3

Originally Posted by Noonan View Post
What was the straw that broke Nixon? Was it clear that his own party Senators would have voted to impeach if he didn't resign?

https://www.pbs.org/newshour/politic...longer-realize

Nixon enjoyed strong support up until he became a liability before the election.
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Old 04-23-19, 02:59 PM
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Re: Official Trump Presidency Thread, Part 3

Originally Posted by Bandoman View Post
Yep. Goldwater and others went to Nixon and said they would vote to remove him from office if the House impeached him. Once he saw that he was losing sup[port among Republicans he took the easy way out.
What a magical time that must have been. When politicians cared more about doing what was right for the country rather than themselves....
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Old 04-23-19, 03:01 PM
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Re: Official Trump Presidency Thread, Part 3

Originally Posted by Noonan View Post
What a magical time that must have been. When politicians cared more about doing what was right for the country rather than themselves....
There was no internet, Rush Limbaugh or FOX News back then. Today it doesn't matter what facts are uncovered, there is a substantial group of people who will simply not accept any criticism of Trump.
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Old 04-23-19, 03:05 PM
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Re: Official Trump Presidency Thread, Part 3

He look, more shady shit that would've drowned any previous administration for months, is only going to be a blip on the radar for our current one...


Again, an impeachment investigation/proceeding/trial will bring all this and more to light and make it officially part of the public reocrd, putting a huge, deserved asterisks on his presidency, regardless of Senate inaction.
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Old 04-23-19, 03:17 PM
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Re: Official Trump Presidency Thread, Part 3

Originally Posted by Paff View Post
Remember what I said earlier today about ret-conning of the Clinton years? We've just seen it...

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Old 04-23-19, 03:23 PM
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Re: Official Trump Presidency Thread, Part 3

Originally Posted by coli View Post
I've said it here before but I have a real high standard for impeaching a President. I thought it was wrong when the Republicans did it to Clinton in 1999, and think it will be wrong if the Democrats impeach Trump. I don't think Clinton and Trump's actions rise to the level of Impeachment, and that is as honest as an answer that I can give you. I do think it is a coincidence (and embodies what I hate about partisan politics) that the majority of Republicans thought Clinton should have been impeached in 1999, and the majority of Democrats thought he shouldn't be impeached. And the same goes for Trump, as the Democrats are the ones who want him impeached, and the Republicans are the ones who don't think he should be impeached.

Wow, what a coincidence??? The other party thinks the President should be impeached, his own party thinks he shouldn't!!! Wow, it's almost like nobody can literally think for themselves as it's typical partisan bullshit politics. I stand by that Clinton shouldn't have been impeached, and I stand by that Trump shouldn't be impeached. The irony is EVERY politican in Washington doesn't think that way.
That wasn't quite my question, and I don't think those situations are close enough to compare.

I'm guessing you must not have read any of the Mueller report? I'm just curious what supporters think. I only know one person in the real world who will admit to having voted for Trump and they're already looking forward to voting for Buttigieg, so they're no help.
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Old 04-23-19, 03:28 PM
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Re: Official Trump Presidency Thread, Part 3

Sounds like he read the Fox interpretation of the report. Saying what Trump did doesn't warrant impeachment? What would, then?
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Old 04-23-19, 03:29 PM
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Re: Official Trump Presidency Thread, Part 3

Originally Posted by spainlinx0 View Post
What would, then?
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Old 04-23-19, 03:30 PM
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Re: Official Trump Presidency Thread, Part 3

Originally Posted by Paff View Post
I'd also add that similar to Clinton, everything is already known.
The Mueller report has new info. Here are two examples:

Trump apparently dangled a pardon in front of Manafort, the key player in the Trump campaign with connections to Russia. Now we know why Manafort didn't fully cooperate with prosecutors. What does Manafort know? We may never find out. That act of obstruction probably damaged the investigation more than any other one.

Trump also tried to limit the scope of the investigation to future elections. In other words, he wanted Mueller to stop investigating the 2016 election. This idea -- investigating future crime -- is so stupid that only Trump could have come up with it. Mueller would have needed a few precogs as in Minority Report.
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Old 04-23-19, 03:31 PM
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Re: Official Trump Presidency Thread, Part 3

Originally Posted by Noonan View Post
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Shooting TWO people in the middle of 5th avenue. That's just taking things too far.
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Old 04-23-19, 03:36 PM
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Re: Official Trump Presidency Thread, Part 3

Originally Posted by GoVegan View Post
I only know one person in the real world who will admit to having voted for Trump and they're already looking forward to voting for Buttigieg, so they're no help.
Actually, that person is a BIG help, but I think you meant something different.
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Old 04-23-19, 03:57 PM
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Re: Official Trump Presidency Thread, Part 3

Dangling a pardon should also be obstruction of justice.
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Old 04-23-19, 04:00 PM
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Re: Official Trump Presidency Thread, Part 3

Originally Posted by cultshock View Post
He's like a fucking child, he's never matured mentally because he never had to. I'd remember when I would catch one of my kids in lie, and they would deny up and down that they did something wrong even though I fucking saw them do it. That's normal behavior for a seven year old, they're still trying to figure out how lying works, but for an adult, for the fucking President of the United States, it's just a total embarrassment.


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Old 04-23-19, 04:15 PM
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Re: Official Trump Presidency Thread, Part 3

Originally Posted by dsa_shea View Post
Dangling a pardon should also be obstruction of justice.
Lot of "should be"s with Trump that just...aren't.
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Old 04-23-19, 04:23 PM
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Re: Official Trump Presidency Thread, Part 3

Originally Posted by Draven View Post
Lot of "should be"s with Trump that just...aren't.
It's like we (they) elected a little kid to be President and he gets away with everything because you can't pick on a poor little kid.
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