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JFK is the single most overrated political figure in American History?

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JFK is the single most overrated political figure in American History?

Old 10-06-17, 01:29 AM
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JFK is the single most overrated political figure in American History?

The Bay of Pigs has to be in at least the top 5 worst political mistakes by a President. What did he accomplish outside of shagging Marilyn Monroe. His contribution to the civil rights movement was minimal. He and the wife were also quite uggo
Fifty years after the death of John F. Kennedy, there's no mystery about why his brief presidency remains an object of fascination: It was glamorous, photogenic, and cut short by an assassination that still seems an insoluble puzzle. Compared to the full-color images of Kennedy and his wife on our television screens this month, other figures of his era seem gray.

Still, it's remarkable that Kennedy's iconic stature in the eyes of most Americans has weathered half a century of assaults, some of them from his own archives, as the less savory side of Camelot has slowly come to light.

We've learned the details of his relentless womanizing, which extended to plying a 19-year-old White House intern with daiquiris and then having sex with her.

We've learned more about the perilous health of a man who in 1960 declared himself "the healthiest candidate for president," including that he had Addison's disease, a serious disorder of the adrenal gland, and that he relied on cocktails of painkillers injected by his physicians.

And we've learned that historians don't think Kennedy was such a great president. As early as 1973, Harvard's Richard Neustadt, who was not only a Kennedy fan but an occasional advisor, concluded sadly that JFK's tenure had been undistinguished.

"I don't think history will leave much space for John Kennedy," Neustadt said then. "History is unkind to transition figures.... He will be just a flicker."

A 1988 survey of historians named Kennedy the most overrated figure in American history. Since then, the verdict hasn't improved much.

"Most historians think of him as an average or even below-average president," said Robert Dallek, author of a widely praised (and largely admiring) JFK biography, "An Unfinished Life," and a subsequent book on Kennedy's Cabinet, "Camelot's Court."

"He never got any of his legislative initiatives passed. He was the architect of a failed policy in Cuba. It's possible to look at his record and see it as a real misery."

But that's not how most Americans see it.

In a succession of Gallup polls, Kennedy is regularly ranked alongside Abraham Lincoln and George Washington in the pantheon of great presidents joined in recent years by Ronald Reagan and Bill Clinton.

Part of Kennedy's outsized stature can be attributed to his having been photogenic and witty, undeniable virtues in a chief executive.

But the public also seems to give JFK credit for accomplishments that weren't actually his, such as the civil rights laws that Lyndon B. Johnson got passed. At the same time, he is not held responsible for the failures of his successor in Vietnam, even though he laid the foundation for an increased U.S. role in Southeast Asia. "[Kennedy] himself didn't know what he would do" in Vietnam, Dallek told me. "He might have tried bombing."
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Old 10-06-17, 01:57 AM
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Re: JFK is the single most overrated political figure in American History?



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Old 10-06-17, 04:39 AM
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Re: JFK is the single most overrated political figure in American History?

Another Russian IP?
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Old 10-06-17, 04:59 AM
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Re: JFK is the single most overrated political figure in American History?

I'll bet JFK would have fucked Whitney Houston if he had the chance.
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Old 10-06-17, 05:51 AM
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Re: JFK is the single most overrated political figure in American History?

No, Ronald Reagan is.
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Old 10-06-17, 06:04 AM
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Re: JFK is the single most overrated political figure in American History?

Being a great orator helps. Certainly Obama had that talent. He could say some pretty rough things about people who disagreed with him but he did it with such eloquence it never came off as insulting. Getting assassinated in such a spectacular fashion certainly raised the level of reverence for him.



His personal weaknesses were at a time before 24 hour news and social media. Today he would have been skewered. Likewise had Clinton conducted his affairs in the 60's it never would have been noticed.

He was a champion of equal rights and did initiate the space program in his short tenure.
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Old 10-06-17, 06:08 AM
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Re: JFK is the single most overrated political figure in American History?

Originally Posted by Dudebro31454 View Post


Whitney looks much better as a white.
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Old 10-06-17, 06:25 AM
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Re: JFK is the single most overrated political figure in American History?

The Bay of Pigs is blown out of proportion just like the presidency of Kennedy is made extra glorious in the retelling. The US backed a coup, it failed, no big deal. The president after Kennedy got us into a full-scale war in Vietnam for no good reason, and lied about it. The president after him had to resign in disgrace.

And nobody ever said that Jackie was ugly.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/TyqDnYBQsKw" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
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Old 10-06-17, 06:41 AM
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Re: JFK is the single most overrated political figure in American History?

Zombie Whitney Houston for President!!!
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Old 10-06-17, 06:44 AM
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Re: JFK is the single most overrated political figure in American History?

Most people who get killed or die early are overrated. It's their greatest claim to fame.
The minute they die they become "Legends", "the best of their generation", "a loss to the world", etc. The day before nobody was praising them like this.

They come in three categories:

The up and comers - what might have been, that's a big maybe
The down and outers - they're not doing anything worth a shit now, what's the great loss to the world?
Those at their peak - established greatness
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Old 10-06-17, 08:00 AM
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Re: JFK is the single most overrated political figure in American History?

Originally Posted by rw2516 View Post
Most people who get killed or die early are overrated. It's their greatest claim to fame.
The minute they die they become "Legends", "the best of their generation", "a loss to the world", etc. The day before nobody was praising them like this.
This is my thoughts on him as well. He is remembered more for his early demise than anything else. The first thing most people think of when they hear JFK"s name is his assassination. Everything else is secondary. He was barely president for 2 years and made no real impact.

Heath Leger is an example of an actor that became overrated after his death. Before his death he really wasn't that well known. After his death everyone talked about how great an actor he was. His performance as the Joker became overrated due to his death as did the movie. Hardly anyone would be talking about what a 'great" film that was if not for Heath's death and the movie would not have made anywhere near the same amount of money. The trilogy got a huge bump in popularity it would not have had otherwise.
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Old 10-06-17, 08:03 AM
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Re: JFK is the single most overrated political figure in American History?

Hm. I see a potential career as a Publicity Assassin.
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Old 10-06-17, 08:13 AM
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Re: JFK is the single most overrated political figure in American History?

If anything, JFK was underrated. He was very smart, from both a political and historical standpoint. He sought common sense solutions. He wanted to pull out of Vietnam. He wanted to break up the CIA. He was shattered by the assassination of Lumumba. He was anti-Imperialist. He was in favor of civil rights legislation, but delayed action due to politics. He wanted to get rid of J. Edgar Hoover. He took Johnson on as VP candidate only after being strong-armed or blackmailed in some fashion. He wanted to get rid of Johnson before running for reelection in '64. Who knows what he could have accomplished with a second term?

Do I romanticize him? Yes. I was ten years old when he died and I've had no use for any president since. I believe JFK was killed by a conspiracy led by the CIA, with help from other entities, and a cover-up engineered by LBJ and the Warren Commission. I don't believe Lee Harvey Oswald fired a shot that day. I also believe the other three major assassinations of that period were all done by conspiracies, probably the same one that killed JFK. Can I prove any of this? No.

I'm either right about all of this or I'm completely delusional. Or I could be right about some things and delusional on others. Or I could be right about some things and still be completely delusional. Not sure I'll ever get this straightened out.

Last edited by Ash Ketchum; 10-06-17 at 08:21 AM.
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Old 10-06-17, 08:17 AM
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Re: JFK is the single most overrated political figure in American History?

What is this now, three brand new members who all happen to be interested in political talk? Hmmmmmmmm....
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Old 10-06-17, 08:25 AM
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Re: JFK is the single most overrated political figure in American History?

So ... is he still dead?
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Old 10-06-17, 08:42 AM
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Re: JFK is the single most overrated political figure in American History?

Originally Posted by Talkin2Phil View Post
No, Ronald Reagan is.
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Old 10-06-17, 08:50 AM
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Re: JFK is the single most overrated political figure in American History?

Originally Posted by rw2516 View Post
Most people who get killed or die early are overrated. It's their greatest claim to fame.
The minute they die they become "Legends", "the best of their generation", "a loss to the world", etc. The day before nobody was praising them like this.

They come in three categories:

The up and comers - what might have been, that's a big maybe
The down and outers - they're not doing anything worth a shit now, what's the great loss to the world?
Those at their peak - established greatness
yeah it always happens. I'm of the idea that if Lennon wouldn't have died, he would have turned into a weird old man (see Jim Carrey thread). He would have been hated by many for his political views. He was very polarizing at times when i see him in old interviews.
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Old 10-06-17, 09:02 AM
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Re: JFK is the single most overrated political figure in American History?

Originally Posted by Nick Danger View Post

And nobody ever said that Jackie was ugly.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/TyqDnYBQsKw" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
Well somebody certainly should say it, she resembles a pterodactyl.
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Old 10-06-17, 09:09 AM
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Re: JFK is the single most overrated political figure in American History?

Originally Posted by Talkin2Phil View Post
No, Ronald Reagan is.
He's only beloved by grandma and granddaddy conservative. It really should come as no surprise that Donald Trump is president considering people saw fit to vote in a failed Hollywood actor.
Originally Posted by Ash Ketchum View Post
If anything, JFK was underrated. He was very smart, from both a political and historical standpoint. He sought common sense solutions. He wanted to pull out of Vietnam. He wanted to break up the CIA. He was shattered by the assassination of Lumumba. He was anti-Imperialist. He was in favor of civil rights legislation, but delayed action due to politics. He wanted to get rid of J. Edgar Hoover. He took Johnson on as VP candidate only after being strong-armed or blackmailed in some fashion. He wanted to get rid of Johnson before running for reelection in '64. Who knows what he could have accomplished with a second term?

Do I romanticize him? Yes. I was ten years old when he died and I've had no use for any president since. I believe JFK was killed by a conspiracy led by the CIA, with help from other entities, and a cover-up engineered by LBJ and the Warren Commission. I don't believe Lee Harvey Oswald fired a shot that day. I also believe the other three major assassinations of that period were all done by conspiracies, probably the same one that killed JFK. Can I prove any of this? No.

I'm either right about all of this or I'm completely delusional. Or I could be right about some things and delusional on others. Or I could be right about some things and still be completely delusional. Not sure I'll ever get this straightened out.
He had nice ideals but he didn't accomplish anything of merit.Yet the general public would see fit to rank him along with the likes of men like George fucking Washington, Thomas slave fucking Jefferson, and Abraham Lincoln?
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Old 10-06-17, 09:11 AM
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Re: JFK is the single most overrated political figure in American History?

If you take away the tragedy he's basically a better looking Jimmy Carter. Except Carter actually got a considerable amount of legislation done.
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Old 10-06-17, 09:18 AM
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Re: JFK is the single most overrated political figure in American History?

In before the lock or move to Politics.

Last edited by Mabuse; 10-06-17 at 09:33 AM.
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Old 10-06-17, 09:31 AM
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Re: JFK is the single most overrated political figure in American History?

Originally Posted by JTH182 View Post
Another Russian IP?
I'm just waiting for him to start selling Blacktavist t-shirts.



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Old 10-06-17, 09:58 AM
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Re: JFK is the single most overrated political figure in American History?

Fun fact: Whitney Houston wrote "I Will Always Love You" about JFK.
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Old 10-06-17, 10:38 AM
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Re: JFK is the single most overrated political figure in American History?

Originally Posted by Dudebro31454 View Post
He had nice ideals but he didn't accomplish anything of merit.Yet the general public would see fit to rank him along with the likes of men like George fucking Washington, Thomas slave fucking Jefferson, and Abraham Lincoln?
Those guys are on the quarter, nickel, and penny. At least Kennedy's on the 50 cent piece, which nobody uses.
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Old 10-06-17, 11:12 AM
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Re: JFK is the single most overrated political figure in American History?

Originally Posted by Dudebro31454 View Post
He's only beloved by grandma and granddaddy conservative. It really should come as no surprise that Donald Trump is president considering people saw fit to vote in a failed Hollywood actor.

He had nice ideals but he didn't accomplish anything of merit.Yet the general public would see fit to rank him along with the likes of men like George fucking Washington, Thomas slave fucking Jefferson, and Abraham Lincoln?
That's Abraham fucking Lincoln.
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