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New! Improved! The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: It's Never Over! Edition

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New! Improved! The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: It's Never Over! Edition

Old 11-17-16, 09:22 AM
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Re: New! Improved! The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: It's Never Over! Edition

Originally Posted by General Zod View Post
Plus I think she probably feels pretty let down by her voters.
The one's she never campaigned to or the one's she didn't think were owed a competitive primary?
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Old 11-17-16, 09:27 AM
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Re: New! Improved! The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: It's Never Over! Edition

Originally Posted by Shannon Nutt View Post
Do the Dems have anyone "on the bench" that is a home run?
Kanye West

Tom Hanks

Ivanka Trump

Denzel Washington

Patton Oswalt

Louie CK

Dave Chapelle

Ashley Judd
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Old 11-17-16, 09:34 AM
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Re: New! Improved! The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: It's Never Over! Edition

Originally Posted by Shannon Nutt View Post
Do the Dems have anyone "on the bench" that is a home run? Sanders, Warren, Booker...I think all those are losers (even if Trump has a horrible first four years, incumbents are tough to beat). Andrew Cuomo maybe? I don't know enough about him to say.
Sanders, like Biden, would be way too old. They need to find a Democrat that isn't over 50 and isn't beholden to Wall Street. I think that gets easier as the age goes down.

Putting up Andrew Cuomo would be the same as trying to trot out Hillary again. It would show that the Democrats have no fucking clue what their base is asking for. Actually, they know what their base is asking for, they have just assumed up until now they would have their votes anyway. We'll see what is more important to them, getting in a good corporate stooge, or getting elected.
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Old 11-17-16, 09:54 AM
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Re: New! Improved! The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: It's Never Over! Edition

Martin O’Malley
Tim Kaine
Julian Castro (better have his birth certificate handy)
Corey Booker (him too)
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Old 11-17-16, 10:06 AM
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Re: New! Improved! The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: It's Never Over! Edition

Originally Posted by inri222 View Post
Martin O’Malley
Tim Kaine
Julian Castro (better have his birth certificate handy)
Corey Booker (him too)
O'Malley- flopped hard in the debates he is done.

Julian Castro- Too creepy looking like Ted Cruz and John Edwards

Corey Booker-If he is the dem nom Jill Stein will get 2-3% of the vote. Don't think the Dems can win going with a Wall Street fave like him or Kaine
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Old 11-17-16, 10:09 AM
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Re: New! Improved! The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: It's Never Over! Edition

Originally Posted by Shannon Nutt View Post
Do the Dems have anyone "on the bench" that is a home run? Sanders, Warren, Booker...I think all those are losers (even if Trump has a horrible first four years, incumbents are tough to beat). Andrew Cuomo maybe? I don't know enough about him to say.
Mark Cuban is maybe an infield single.
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Old 11-17-16, 10:56 AM
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Re: New! Improved! The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: It's Never Over! Edition

Originally Posted by kvrdave View Post
Sanders, like Biden, would be way too old. They need to find a Democrat that isn't over 50 and isn't beholden to Wall Street. I think that gets easier as the age goes down.
As the age goes down, the SJW agendas go up. These agendas are innately short-term and fizzle out. That will have to be restrained and contained in order to appear viable.

Originally Posted by kvrdave View Post
Putting up Andrew Cuomo would be the same as trying to trot out Hillary again. It would show that the Democrats have no fucking clue what their base is asking for. Actually, they know what their base is asking for, they have just assumed up until now they would have their votes anyway. We'll see what is more important to them, getting in a good corporate stooge, or getting elected.
I agree. Democrat Elites know what their people want. Their people wanted Bernie. And they ripped his balls out, not even asking for them. They threatened him as well. Bernie may never talk about that.

Sanders might work, but he needs to exercise more and use a walker from now until mid-2019. And his wife might benefit from walking as well.

I have a few Democrat friends who are just irate, angry, and retaliatory at the moment and are amazed that a "Child Rapist" is in office. And they haven't even hear of Juanita Broderick, which I find typical. I guess nobody was paying attention the last 25 years with the Clintons or what Bill was doing.

In any case, these two Democrats (women, for those asking) don't want to talk. Don't want to negotiate or do anything but try to obstruct Republicans and hope their representatives do the same.

I said, this is exactly what will guarantee the 2020 election going to Republicans, and that 4 blue states went red because of the anger within the Democrat Party, and people need to get over this shit and use their brains, and attack Trump and whoever else...ON THEIR FUTURE POLICY DECISIONS. But they will have to wait until probably Spring 2017 to start this.

Why get all pissed off now? We have two months before he even gets sworn in.

Develop a plan, a plan that focuses on policy issues--not behaviors--and if Democrats can keep to this plan, they could be guaranteed a 2020 win.

I also heard that many Democrat women did not vote for Hillary in the Portland area and despised her.

So, my advice to Democrats. Cut the fucking lifeline to the Clintons. NOW. If you keep her on board...you will fucking lose, and you will lose a very important base: Women Democrats.
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Old 11-17-16, 11:34 AM
  #108  
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Re: New! Improved! The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: It's Never Over! Edition

Originally Posted by DVD Polizei View Post
I agree. Democrat Elites know what their people want. Their people wanted Bernie.
Then "their people" should have voted. Clinton won the popular vote. And it wasn't over some super double-secret struggle within the DNC or some campaign against Bernie. It was because people who actually showed up to vote, and actually put their pen to the paper, voted for Clinton.

Bernie's loss is a reflection of all of the non-voters who are protesting now. I think you posted an article that said 70% of protesters arrested in Portland didn't vote. If they actually voted, this wouldn't be a problem. And, really, the Democrats have enough registered voters that the electorate college wouldn't be an issue either.

Now the Republicans are using Bernie's loss to insult the Democrats.
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Old 11-17-16, 12:37 PM
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Re: New! Improved! The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: It's Never Over! Edition

Originally Posted by Shannon Nutt View Post
Do the Dems have anyone "on the bench" that is a home run? Sanders, Warren, Booker...I think all those are losers (even if Trump has a horrible first four years, incumbents are tough to beat). Andrew Cuomo maybe? I don't know enough about him to say.
Any one of those would have easily beaten Trump. Clinton was a horrible candidate and still won the popular vote
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Old 11-17-16, 12:44 PM
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Re: New! Improved! The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: It's Never Over! Edition

Originally Posted by DVD Polizei View Post
Obama divided this nation, along with his shill candidate.
Obama has time travel! The nation was sorely divided in 2000, when the election was decided by a handful of chads in one county in Florida.

Obama campaigned as a uniter in 2008. He wouldn't have been able to do that if politic weren't already divided. People wanted a change in Washington and they thought he could do it.

This year, Trump has promised to bring about change in Washington by knifing anyone who opposes him. We'll see how well that works. He isn't the only knife fighter in the city.
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Old 11-17-16, 06:06 PM
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Re: New! Improved! The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: It's Never Over! Edition

Clooney. That's the Dems only shot really.
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Old 11-17-16, 06:36 PM
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Re: New! Improved! The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: It's Never Over! Edition

Meet Jon Stewart, "ends-around Trump supporter":

Said Stewart: “We also have to caution ourselves to the complexity of [our] history. I thought Donald Trump disqualified himself at numerous points. But there’s now this idea that anyone who voted for him has to be defined by the worst of his rhetoric. There are guys in my neighborhood that I love and respect, that I think have incredible qualities, who are not afraid of Mexicans and are not afraid of Muslims and not afraid of blacks; they’re afraid of their insurance premiums. In the liberal community, you hate this idea of creating people as a monolith. Don’t look at Muslims as a monolith. They are individuals. It would be ignorance. But everybody who voted for Trump is a monolith, is a racist. That hypocrisy is also real.”

Add Stewart to the growing list of closet Trump supporters who have uttered very similar statements, including Joe Biden and Bernie Sanders.

High treason!!!


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Old 11-17-16, 06:52 PM
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Re: New! Improved! The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: It's Never Over! Edition

Originally Posted by creekdipper View Post
Meet Jon Stewart, "ends-around Trump supporter":

Said Stewart: “We also have to caution ourselves to the complexity of [our] history. I thought Donald Trump disqualified himself at numerous points. But there’s now this idea that anyone who voted for him has to be defined by the worst of his rhetoric. There are guys in my neighborhood that I love and respect, that I think have incredible qualities, who are not afraid of Mexicans and are not afraid of Muslims and not afraid of blacks; they’re afraid of their insurance premiums. In the liberal community, you hate this idea of creating people as a monolith. Don’t look at Muslims as a monolith. They are individuals. It would be ignorance. But everybody who voted for Trump is a monolith, is a racist. That hypocrisy is also real.”

Add Stewart to the growing list of closet Trump supporters who have uttered very similar statements, including Joe Biden and Bernie Sanders.

High treason!!!

How do you read that this way? He is railing against generalization. He is far from a Trump supporter.
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Old 11-17-16, 07:12 PM
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Re: New! Improved! The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: It's Never Over! Edition

Originally Posted by Bandoman View Post
How do you read that this way? He is railing against generalization. He is far from a Trump supporter.
Yeah, I am fairly certain Creek knows that, and that it wasn't his point.
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Old 11-17-16, 07:25 PM
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Re: New! Improved! The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: It's Never Over! Edition

To the extent Stewart is saying not all Trump supporters are racists, I agree with him. But I don't think that's what most on the left are saying.
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Old 11-17-16, 07:52 PM
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Re: New! Improved! The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: It's Never Over! Edition

Originally Posted by JasonF View Post
To the extent Stewart is saying not all Trump supporters are racists, I agree with him. But I don't think that's what most on the left are saying.
I didn't intend to imply that most were saying that. However, a sizeable enough portion were intimating as much, necessitating the need for folks like Stewart to rebut that viewpoint.
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Old 11-18-16, 05:21 AM
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Re: New! Improved! The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: It's Never Over! Edition

Originally Posted by JasonF View Post
To the extent Stewart is saying not all Trump supporters are racists, I agree with him. But I don't think that's what most on the left are saying.
There are several regular posters here who strongly imply, if not state with absolute certainty, that only someone with racist, xenophobic, homophobic, and every other type of "phobic" views would have voted for Trump. And they go further by implying that criticism of Clinton or "defending" Trump (i.e., pointing out inaccuracies or hyperbole) constitutes some type of covert "support" of him )...even though it has been repeatedly pointed out, just as Stewart did, that there are any number of reasons to repudiate Trump, just as some find reasons to choose him over Clinton that had nothing to do with embracing the worst that he represents. And I'd say the same for Clinton, since I accept the statements from those who don't like Clinton personally but still chose her over the alternative.

As Stewart said, I personally know some who say they voted for Trump, and they gave many reasons for doing so. And, as Stewart says, they give no evidence of those negative qualities attributed to them that have nothing to do with "hating" other people. And their resentment about being unfairly labeled as such was real & palpable, epecially since they denounced Trump's personal traits while preferring his stance on the issues that mattered most to them.

When Biden and Sanders say that only a very small minority of Trump supporters fit the descriptions above, perhaps their supporters should pay attention to those statements and consider them what politicians whom they profess to admire think on the subject. That is, if they actually believe what they're posting and not just polishing their personal axes.

I just read an interesting piece in Sports Illustrated which arrived yesterday written by Tim Layden. It was an introspective look at how divided America has become & how people don't take the time to get to know others from other regions who have different worldviews. Really fair & positive, two-page analysis that doesn't point fingers at anyone but recognizes the problems we face and how we might reduce those divisions.

A good start might be for all of us to stop assuming the worst about each other and start looking to understand why others think differently without just demonizing them and going no further. Just over the last day, we've seen opinions expressed that seem to suggest that it would be better to allow the country to crash & burn rather than try to help minimize any damage. That sort of scorched earth policy would seem to be self-defeating...a "cut off your nose to spite your face" approach that ends up with a lose-lose result.


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Last edited by creekdipper; 11-18-16 at 05:44 AM.
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Old 11-18-16, 06:55 AM
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Re: New! Improved! The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: It's Never Over! Edition

Originally Posted by Nick Danger View Post
Obama has time travel! The nation was sorely divided in 2000, when the election was decided by a handful of chads in one county in Florida.
Yea. I think people say "the country just-now divided in 2008" only say that because they're new to paying attention to politics. This election was no different than other elections. As I understand, it always feels like this for everyone who pays attention to politics. 2008 was just the Layman's introduction to politics. News changed from "informative" to "entertaining".

I think it also became more like sports or American Idol and tried to get 'the common man' involved. But the same amount of people (roughly half of eligible adults) showed up to vote. So everyone has a loud opinion, but the same people came out to vote. Doesn't it "feel" like everyone voted? It does to me. Yet there are 100M people out there who simply don't partake.

The internet also creates a platform for people to anonymously say all the awful stuff they've always kept to themselves (dating back to the beginning of time). Stupid Al Gore.

And then we (yes, we) elected a doofus. It might work out. But, you know, c'mon - the guy is a doofus.

I think that people (especially liberals) haven't woken up to the idea that there will never be a landslide. Because almost everyone will always vote for their party (regardless of the nominee), it's always going to split down the middle. And your vote does matter. This year could have been Noam Chomsky (running R) VS Ted Nugent (running D) - and people would still convince themselves to vote for their party.
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Old 11-18-16, 07:05 AM
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Re: New! Improved! The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: It's Never Over! Edition

Originally Posted by creekdipper View Post
There are several regular posters here...
Okay okay. We all know who we're talking about. It's "a few". There are also "a few" who are hyper-focused on religion. And "a few" who are big Trump supporters.

Maybe that's what's really wrong. "The Few" speak so loudly that we think they speak for everyone. 10,000 people show up to "protest" the election in Los Angeles. And that looks impressive. But there's, like, five million (or whatever) people living in Los Angeles.

So the words sting so bad, that we want to think it's everyone. But it's really just these little pockets of people who are involved and voicing their opinion.
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Old 11-18-16, 07:18 AM
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Re: New! Improved! The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: It's Never Over! Edition

Originally Posted by DVD Polizei View Post
So, my advice to Democrats. Cut the fucking lifeline to the Clintons. NOW. If you keep her on board...you will fucking lose, and you will lose a very important base: Women Democrats.
Many are disappointed they will not have the careers in a Hillary Clinton administration

The Women Left Behind in Hillary Clinton's Loss
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Old 11-18-16, 09:52 AM
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Re: New! Improved! The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: It's Never Over! Edition

Originally Posted by JasonF View Post
To the extent Stewart is saying not all Trump supporters are racists, I agree with him. But I don't think that's what most on the left are saying.
The key there of course is ALL. Maybe I missed some posts, but I've never seen anybody post ALL Trump supporters are anything... Good, bad, or otherwise. What I definitely have seen lately though is a lot of ignoring of where people like myself have posted, multiple times, how we understand that many people supported Trump for reasons that have nothing to do with racism, misogyny, etc. As many have demonstrated here it's possible to acknowledge it's not ALL supporters while also expressing the concern over the numbers that did obviously prefer Trump because of racism, misogyny, etc.

Last edited by hdnmickey; 11-18-16 at 10:52 AM.
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Old 11-18-16, 10:29 AM
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Re: New! Improved! The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: It's Never Over! Edition

Yes, the majority of Trump voters are not racists and did not vote for him because of that...but they did not mind voting for someone who promoted such behavior so sorry that I cannot fall in line with any positive view of them.
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Old 11-18-16, 10:35 AM
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Re: New! Improved! The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: It's Never Over! Edition

Originally Posted by hdnmickey View Post
The key there of course is ALL. Maybe I missed some posts, but I've never seen anybody post ALL Trump supporters are anything... Good, bad, or otherwise. What I definitely have seen lately though is a lot of ignoring of where people like myself have posted, multiple times, how we understand that many people supported Trump for reasons that have nothing to do with racism, misogyny, etc. As any have demonstrated here it's possible to acknowledge it's not ALL supporters while also expressing the concern over the numbers that do obviously preferred Trump because of racism, misogyny, etc.
Originally Posted by Jaymole View Post
Yes, the majority of Trump voters are not racists and did not vote for him because of that...but they did not mind voting for someone who promoted such behavior so sorry that I cannot fall in line with any positive view of them.
I agree with both of these points. And I think Stewart is trying to walk the line of condemning Trump's racism in a way that doesn't alienate people who voted for him because, for example, they think he will improve the economy, and to ultimately persuade those voters that improving the economy at the expense of oppressing minorities is not a good solution.
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Old 11-18-16, 10:42 AM
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Re: New! Improved! The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: It's Never Over! Edition

Originally Posted by Jaymole View Post
Yes, the majority of Trump voters are not racists and did not vote for him because of that...but they did not mind voting for someone who promoted such behavior so sorry that I cannot fall in line with any positive view of them.
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Old 11-18-16, 10:52 AM
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Re: New! Improved! The 2020 Presidential Election Thread: It's Never Over! Edition

Originally Posted by JasonF View Post
I agree with both of these points. And I think Stewart is trying to walk the line of condemning Trump's racism in a way that doesn't alienate people who voted for him because, for example, they think he will improve the economy, and to ultimately persuade those voters that improving the economy at the expense of oppressing minorities is not a good solution.
A good point that I should have included.
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