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Volkswagen workers reject United Auto Workers

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Volkswagen workers reject United Auto Workers

Old 02-14-14, 10:22 PM
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Volkswagen workers reject United Auto Workers

This would seem to be a pretty big blow to the UAW. VW was neutral on this and they still lost the vote. I'll wait for the "the people who voted against this are clearly deluded idiots comments from the lefties here"

UAW blamed it on politicians and special interests ... not mentioning of course the politicians and special interests they enlisted ... including Obama who made a statement supporting the effort


http://www.politico.com/story/2014/0...aw-103556.html

Volkswagen workers in Chattanooga, Tenn., have rejected the United Auto Workers, shooting down the union’s hopes of securing a foothold at a foreign-owned auto plant in the South.

The vote was 712 to 626, said the UAW, which blamed the loss on “politicians and outside special interest groups.”

The vote, announced late Friday night after three days of balloting, is a devastating loss for the UAW, whose membership has plummeted from a high of 1.5 million in 1979 to around 400,000 today. Outgoing UAW President Bob King had staked his legacy on organizing a Southern auto plant for the first time.

But the decision is a triumph for Tennessee Republicans like Sen. Bob Corker, who lured Volkswagen to Chattanooga as mayor in the early 2000s. Corker and other Republicans warned workers that the UAW’s presence would irreparably harm the plant, and in recent days he claimed — with little evidence — that Volkswagen would choose not to expand the plant if workers unionized.

“Needless to say, I am thrilled for the employees at Volkswagen and for our community and its future,” Corker said in a brief statement Friday night.

The D.C.-based Center for Worker Freedom, a division of conservative activist Grover Norquist’s Americans for Tax Reform, also campaigned against the union drive by blaming unions for Detroit’s economic woes and saying the UAW supports liberal politicians who favor gun control.

In a statement, the UAW blamed the conservative groups and Tennessee Republicans for their stinging defeat, with UAW Region 8 Director Gary Casteel saying that “politically motivated third parties threatened the economic future of this facility and the opportunity for workers to create a successful operating model that would grow jobs in Tennessee.”
Old 02-14-14, 10:41 PM
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Re: Volkswagen workers reject United Auto Workers

Volkswagen actually supported the UAW in this matter. The rest of their plants are unionized.
Old 02-14-14, 10:53 PM
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Re: Volkswagen workers reject United Auto Workers

Originally Posted by Neil M. View Post
Volkswagen actually supported the UAW in this matter. The rest of their plants are unionized.
Yep, only way Volks could have their "works council" here is if they got the Union involved. AND then, the union would have to agree to secede certain powers to the works council. Yeah fucking right. The union wouldn't secede shit. There has been a TON of outside interference from the pro-union side here. To use that as an excuse against the anti-union side is hilarious.
Old 02-14-14, 10:56 PM
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Re: Volkswagen workers reject United Auto Workers

Originally Posted by Neil M. View Post
Volkswagen actually supported the UAW in this matter. The rest of their plants are unionized.
That's the amazing thing about this. Management wanted the union and the Republican Party in Tennessee put on a full-court press to convince the workers to vote against the union.

http://www.usnews.com/opinion/blogs/...ors_picks=true

So, whether you support unions or oppose them, here's my question: in what way can you say Republicans support free markets and not meddling in business?
Old 02-14-14, 11:08 PM
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Re: Volkswagen workers reject United Auto Workers

Originally Posted by JasonF View Post
That's the amazing thing about this. Management wanted the union and the Republican Party in Tennessee put on a full-court press to convince the workers to vote against the union.

http://www.usnews.com/opinion/blogs/...ors_picks=true

So, whether you support unions or oppose them, here's my question: in what way can you say Republicans support free markets and not meddling in business?
Well to be fair, not that republicans deserve it, Volkswagon could have chosen to locate their plant in a pro-union state to begin with. I would find it hilarious if VW really felt strongly about this and decided to move the plant. I would love to see Corker's reaction. But I would feel bad for those workers so I hope it doesn't happen.
Old 02-14-14, 11:11 PM
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Re: Volkswagen workers reject United Auto Workers

Originally Posted by JasonF View Post
That's the amazing thing about this. Management wanted the union and the Republican Party in Tennessee put on a full-court press to convince the workers to vote against the union.
You can believe your blogs all you want. There are a ton of former GM transplants down here that are saying fuck the UAW. Do you think most of the Volks workers down here were local? HA HA HA HA! I'm not a republican either. Do lib blogs make mention of how the UAW was brought in to the plant with all their propaganda shoved in all the workers faces for weeks?

Same old political crybaby bullshit from both major parties. The loser cries foul even though their side was just as aggressive leading up to the event.

Last edited by Lt Ripley; 02-14-14 at 11:34 PM.
Old 02-14-14, 11:39 PM
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Re: Volkswagen workers reject United Auto Workers

Originally Posted by Lt Ripley View Post
You can believe your blogs all you want.
Ah, yes. That famous blog "U.S. News and World Report."

If you read my post carefully, you will see that nowhere did I cry foul about the outcome. I think the workers voted against their own interest, but that's their business and they are entitled to do so. I just find it hilarious that the Republicans fought so hard to interpose themselves into an internal decision between a private business and their employees.
Old 02-14-14, 11:50 PM
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Re: Volkswagen workers reject United Auto Workers

What I find a bit humorous is that Corker was saying that VW wouldn't expand if they unionized, yet it was the state legislators that were threatening to withhold any incentives for that expansion should they unionize. So who exactly would be to blame if unionization happened, the state withheld incentives, and VW decides to expand elsewhere?
Old 02-15-14, 12:28 AM
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Re: Volkswagen workers reject United Auto Workers

Originally Posted by JasonF View Post
Ah, yes. That famous blog "U.S. News and World Report."

If you read my post carefully, you will see that nowhere did I cry foul about the outcome. I think the workers voted against their own interest, but that's their business and they are entitled to do so. I just find it hilarious that the Republicans fought so hard to interpose themselves into an internal decision between a private business and their employees.
I misread your intentions and I apologize, good sir. The link you posted had "blog" in it, so I went in guns a blazin'. When it comes to Unions, I can understand why all political parties get involved.
Old 02-15-14, 12:30 AM
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Re: Volkswagen workers reject United Auto Workers

Originally Posted by Neil M. View Post
What I find a bit humorous is that Corker was saying that VW wouldn't expand if they unionized, yet it was the state legislators that were threatening to withhold any incentives for that expansion should they unionize. So who exactly would be to blame if unionization happened, the state withheld incentives, and VW decides to expand elsewhere?
Guess we won't know for at least another year.
Old 02-15-14, 05:27 AM
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Re: Volkswagen workers reject United Auto Workers

Originally Posted by JasonF View Post
I think the workers voted against their own interest, but that's their business and they are entitled to do so.
This is an argument I've never understood... who are you to decide what their interests are?
Old 02-15-14, 06:13 AM
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Re: Volkswagen workers reject United Auto Workers

Originally Posted by nemein View Post
This is an argument I've never understood... who are you to decide what their interests are?
He is a liberal, they know what is in everyone's best interest.

... and I am not seeing how the claim of the GOP getting involved in the free market makes any sense. They stated and opinion and ran a campaign ... free speech activity. Not passing a regulation or law that anyone has to do anything.
Old 02-15-14, 07:35 AM
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Re: Volkswagen workers reject United Auto Workers

Originally Posted by JasonF View Post
I think the workers voted against their own interest, but that's their business and they are entitled to do so.
Well, 53.2% of them voted against their best interest and 46.8% voted for their best interest so only a little over half of them were stupid.

Where's Norma Rae when you need her?

Last edited by movielib; 02-15-14 at 08:34 AM.
Old 02-15-14, 08:04 AM
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Re: Volkswagen workers reject United Auto Workers

Yay! Fuck the worker!
Old 02-15-14, 09:49 AM
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Re: Volkswagen workers reject United Auto Workers

There are volumes of data demonstrating that workers do better (better pay, better working conditions, more benefits) in unionized shops. That's what I mean when I say they voted against their own interests. Of course they are free to decide otherwise and I never said otherwise, but thanks for the sanctimony!
Old 02-15-14, 10:03 AM
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Re: Volkswagen workers reject United Auto Workers

Originally Posted by JasonF View Post
There are volumes of data demonstrating that workers do better (better pay, better working conditions, more benefits) in unionized shops. That's what I mean when I say they voted against their own interests. Of course they are free to decide otherwise and I never said otherwise, but thanks for the sanctimony!
Curious, does the data also show the employer does better?
Old 02-15-14, 10:47 AM
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Re: Volkswagen workers reject United Auto Workers

Originally Posted by Sdallnct View Post
Curious, does the data also show the employer does better?
Those data are more mixed, and more dependent on how you define "better." So it's certainly not irrational for an employer to oppose unionization. Only, in this case, the employer chose to support unionization (which is also not irrational).
Old 02-15-14, 10:55 AM
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Re: Volkswagen workers reject United Auto Workers

Originally Posted by Jason View Post
Yay! Fuck the worker!
Indeedy.
Four workers this week (Oct 18, 2013) filed a charge against the automaker with the National Labor Relations Board over the alleged coercion, after a senior member of Volkswagen’s German management team suggested that the plant would not get a new vehicle to build — along with hundreds of new jobs — unless the workers agreed to union representation.

The workers who filed the charge say that the threat to withhold the new vehicle unless they accept the union interferes with their right “to choose whether or not to engage in self-organization to form, join, or assist labor organizations,” a violation of federal law.

The UAW last month said it had obtained signatures of more than half of the plant’s 2,500 hourly workers calling for union representation and asked Volkswagen to recognize the union without a formal vote, under the so-called “card check” process.
http://www.tennessean.com/article/20...-joining-union
Haslam said there's lots of confusion by workers who may have signed cards related to UAW organizing at the plant. He said that some believe they signed a card to be in a union, while others did so because they wanted a vote.

"There's one way to clear that up -- have a vote," Haslam said. "I think it's really simple."

The UAW has said that a majority of the plants production and skilled maintenance workers have signed cards authorizing union representation and the set up of a works council. The UAW wants VW to recognize the union based on the cards rather than have a secret-ballot vote.
http://www.timesfreepress.com/news/2...works-council/
Old 02-15-14, 11:13 AM
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Re: Volkswagen workers reject United Auto Workers

Originally Posted by BearFan View Post
He is a liberal, they know what is in everyone's best interest.

... and I am not seeing how the claim of the GOP getting involved in the free market makes any sense. They stated and opinion and ran a campaign ... free speech activity. Not passing a regulation or law that anyone has to do anything.
They did threaten to drop incentives for expansion. That's sort of using the legislative process to get the result they wanted.
Old 02-15-14, 01:01 PM
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Re: Volkswagen workers reject United Auto Workers

I guess the "W" in VW doesn't stand for Worker.
Old 02-15-14, 02:01 PM
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Re: Volkswagen workers reject United Auto Workers

What bothers me is that VW can't establish a "workers council" (whatever that is) without a union due to labor laws. WTF?
Old 02-15-14, 03:00 PM
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Re: Volkswagen workers reject United Auto Workers

The UAW and most unions need to do a much better job of promoting themselves. Their image seems to have gone done over the years, even with blue collar workers. I think you can eventually get to where the union is no more good for the worker than the corporation they work for. Often, the union seems to do what is best for the union at large rather than the individuals that support it. Union leaders are often not different from the CEOs, etc.

Anyway, I would agree with JasonF that they seem to have voted against their own interests (assuming everything we know in this thread is accurate), but I think a lot of that comes from the union needing to get its shit together.
Old 02-15-14, 03:16 PM
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Re: Volkswagen workers reject United Auto Workers

Originally Posted by JasonF View Post
Those data are more mixed, and more dependent on how you define "better." So it's certainly not irrational for an employer to oppose unionization. Only, in this case, the employer chose to support unionization (which is also not irrational).
I know there are industries that require you belong (film/movie industry), but I don't think I could be part of a union.

Well, my company recently hired a third party company to manage our benefits. Health, savings, sick leave, etc. the advantage is the company doesn't have to be in the "benefits management" business.

I could see some companies preferring the union deal with all employee issues. Then the company doesn't have to deal with any of that. Just point the employee to their union rep.

I'd prefer to deal with my issues myself.
Old 02-15-14, 09:24 PM
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Re: Volkswagen workers reject United Auto Workers

Originally Posted by JasonF View Post
That's the amazing thing about this. Management wanted the union and the Republican Party in Tennessee put on a full-court press to convince the workers to vote against the union.

http://www.usnews.com/opinion/blogs/...ors_picks=true

So, whether you support unions or oppose them, here's my question: in what way can you say Republicans support free markets and not meddling in business?
I would say they were trying to prevent a future political opponent in the UAW in Tenn. Do you really not see why they fought it?
Old 02-15-14, 11:08 PM
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Re: Volkswagen workers reject United Auto Workers

Originally Posted by Sdallnct View Post
Curious, does the data also show the employer does better?
Who gives a shit? That's not the point of a union.

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