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Tobacco Master Settlement Agreements - 15 years later

Old 10-14-13, 10:50 AM
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Tobacco Master Settlement Agreements - 15 years later

Article: http://www.npr.org/2013/10/13/233449...rette-money-go

Radio transcript: http://www.npr.org/templates/transcr...ryId=233449505

Interesting piece from NPR's "All Things Considered." Opens up talking about Orange County, where voters have mandated that 80 percent of their money from the settlement needs to be spent on smoking-related programs. But most jurisdictions are not like Orange County.

In many of the states and counties across the country, that settlement money was essentially just put into their general funds and have been used on everything and anything but smoking-related programs. Colorado used their money for literacy programs. Kentucky used it for agricultural programs.

Some places have securitized the future cash flows from settlement money and sold it to investors for a lump sum.



Also, there's no doubt that it costs money to treat smoking-related diseases, but I wonder if smoking places less of a financial burden on the health care system than non-smokers. What's more expensive, a smoker who dies in their 60/70s? Or a non-smoker who dies in their 80/90s?
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Old 10-14-13, 10:57 AM
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Re: Tobacco Master Settlement Agreements - 15 years later

I seriously needed a longer weekend, because that thread title took me 3-4 reads before I realized it didn't say "Taco Monster."
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Old 10-14-13, 11:01 AM
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Re: Tobacco Master Settlement Agreements - 15 years later

What costs more? A smoker with lung cancer or emphysema or a fat, non-smoking tub o'lard with diabetes, heart disease, and the rash of issues associated with being fat?
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Old 10-14-13, 11:10 AM
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Re: Tobacco Master Settlement Agreements - 15 years later

Originally Posted by uberjoe View Post
I seriously needed a longer weekend, because that thread title took me 3-4 reads before I realized it didn't say "Taco Monster."
Hmmmm, I read Tabasco Master.

<img src=http://media.nola.com/tpphotos/photo/2013/02/-333678a361d407ac.jpg>
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Old 10-14-13, 11:19 AM
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Re: Tobacco Master Settlement Agreements - 15 years later

Originally Posted by kvrdave View Post
Hmmmm, I read Tabasco Master.

<img src=http://media.nola.com/tpphotos/photo/2013/02/-333678a361d407ac.jpg>
Tabasco sauce is kind of spicy. Some poor schlub might burn his tongue. We should take billions of dollars from the manufacturers of spicy foods to fund transportation projects.
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Old 10-14-13, 11:51 AM
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Re: Tobacco Master Settlement Agreements - 15 years later

Originally Posted by kvrdave View Post
Hmmmm, I read Tabasco Master.

<img src=http://media.nola.com/tpphotos/photo/2013/02/-333678a361d407ac.jpg>
Wait, are you saying that there was TWO of this guy on the ark?!
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Old 10-14-13, 12:08 PM
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Re: Tobacco Master Settlement Agreements - 15 years later

Just one. They reproduce by masturbation.
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Old 10-14-13, 12:12 PM
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Re: Tobacco Master Settlement Agreements - 15 years later

Master masturbaters.
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Old 10-14-13, 12:40 PM
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Re: Tobacco Master Settlement Agreements - 15 years later

<a href="http://imgur.com/Frnt5lw"><img src="http://i.imgur.com/Frnt5lw.png" title="Hosted by imgur.com" /></a>
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Old 10-14-13, 12:50 PM
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Re: Tobacco Master Settlement Agreements - 15 years later

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Old 10-14-13, 02:29 PM
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Old 10-14-13, 02:30 PM
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Re: Tobacco Master Settlement Agreements - 15 years later

Okay, I'll stop now.
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Old 10-14-13, 02:42 PM
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Re: Tobacco Master Settlement Agreements - 15 years later

Back to the subject, did anyone actually think all that newly found money was just going to go to its intended uses? I'm good with the tobacco companies paying it because they lied in just ridiculous fashion, but obviously this was still just a money grab by the government entities.
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Old 10-14-13, 03:09 PM
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Re: Tobacco Master Settlement Agreements - 15 years later

Originally Posted by kvrdave View Post
Back to the subject, did anyone actually think all that newly found money was just going to go to its intended uses? I'm good with the tobacco companies paying it because they lied in just ridiculous fashion, but obviously this was still just a money grab by the government entities.
There is great irony in my beloved Commonwealth using tobacco company money to fund agricultural programs.
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Old 10-15-13, 09:14 PM
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Re: Tobacco Master Settlement Agreements - 15 years later

The bigger question is, should there have been a settlement.

One of the main attorneys that lead the charge for the settlement is in jail for trying to pay off a judge. The payoff involved the attorney trying to do to insurance companies what he did to the tobacco companies. He tried a very similar formula only didn't work the 2nd time around.

I don't smoke. Never have. Don't like being in places that allow smoking. But I'm fundamentally against the taxes and settlements imposed. If it that much of a health risk, just ban them. If its not or adults can make their own decisions, then leave them alone.
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Old 10-15-13, 09:16 PM
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Re: Tobacco Master Settlement Agreements - 15 years later

Originally Posted by kvrdave View Post
Back to the subject, did anyone actually think all that newly found money was just going to go to its intended uses? I'm good with the tobacco companies paying it because they lied in just ridiculous fashion, but obviously this was still just a money grab by the government entities.
Yup, just a money grab. If the government truly cared, they would ban them. Course then they would miss out on all that tax.
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Old 10-15-13, 10:14 PM
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Re: Tobacco Master Settlement Agreements - 15 years later

Originally Posted by Sdallnct View Post
The bigger question is, should there have been a settlement.

One of the main attorneys that lead the charge for the settlement is in jail for trying to pay off a judge. The payoff involved the attorney trying to do to insurance companies what he did to the tobacco companies. He tried a very similar formula only didn't work the 2nd time around.
There are some incredibly scummy lawyers out there, and probably more of them belong in jail. I think you're talking about Dickie Scruggs, and you're right -- that guy is a sleaze. That said ...

I don't smoke. Never have. Don't like being in places that allow smoking. But I'm fundamentally against the taxes and settlements imposed. If it that much of a health risk, just ban them. If its not or adults can make their own decisions, then leave them alone.
There was clear evidence that tobacco companies had manipulated their product to increase the addictiveness of cigarettes, hidden that fact, and generally lied to the public and health officials. It's not as clear cut as "people were given a straightforward choice and the tobacco companies are blameless."
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Old 10-16-13, 09:39 AM
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Re: Tobacco Master Settlement Agreements - 15 years later

JasonF finally admits there are some incredibly scummy lawyers out there.

Now if we will insert the change "some" to "nearly all" we can reach agreement on the forum.
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Old 10-16-13, 10:48 AM
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Re: Tobacco Master Settlement Agreements - 15 years later

Originally Posted by classicman2 View Post
JasonF finally admits there are some incredibly scummy lawyers out there.
JasonF has always admitted that. In fact, I'd guess you would be hard pressed to find a practicing attorney who hasn't encountered some scummy lawyers. Usually on the other side of a case or transaction.

Now if we will insert the change "some" to "nearly all" we can reach agreement on the forum.
But what about Fielding!?
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Old 10-16-13, 10:53 AM
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Re: Tobacco Master Settlement Agreements - 15 years later

I'm somewhat kidding about lawyers. My sister was a lawyer.

Now Fielding is as crooked as a barrel of snakes.

btw: He's not all that good of a bridge player.
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Old 10-16-13, 11:04 AM
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Re: Tobacco Master Settlement Agreements - 15 years later

Now Fielding is as crooked as a barrel of snakes.
Now THAT is classic classicman.
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Old 10-16-13, 11:43 AM
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Re: Tobacco Master Settlement Agreements - 15 years later

Originally Posted by JasonF View Post
There are some incredibly scummy lawyers out there, and probably more of them belong in jail. I think you're talking about Dickie Scruggs, and you're right -- that guy is a sleaze. That said ...



There was clear evidence that tobacco companies had manipulated their product to increase the addictiveness of cigarettes, hidden that fact, and generally lied to the public and health officials. It's not as clear cut as "people were given a straightforward choice and the tobacco companies are blameless."
Yes, but there is clear evidence that tobacco is in and of itself addictive. There is clear evidence that you can't make a tobacco product that is not addictive.

So, if being addictive is the issue, they should be banned. If its not the issue, then leave them alone.

I'm not saying tobacco companies are blameless. But they make a by design fundamentally dangerous, unhealthy, addictive product. I find it reprehensable that the goverment is ok with it so long as they get a cut of the profits. They should be distancing themselves from it.

And yes, talking about Dickie. And it clear now that the "clear" evidence he got on the tobacco companies, may not have been so clear, obtained properly, etc. Again, I'm not defending tobacco companies. I'd be fine with banning the product.
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Old 10-16-13, 11:50 AM
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Re: Tobacco Master Settlement Agreements - 15 years later

I wonder how high the price of a package of cigarettes has to go in order for it to make a serious reduction in the use?

Dipping is a terrible habit also. My dentist won't treat anyone who are hooked on that filthy habit.
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Old 10-16-13, 12:26 PM
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Re: Tobacco Master Settlement Agreements - 15 years later

Originally Posted by classicman2 View Post
I wonder how high the price of a package of cigarettes has to go in order for it to make a serious reduction in the use?

Dipping is a terrible habit also. My dentist won't treat anyone who are hooked on that filthy habit.
Or how high EVERYONE's health insurance has to go. I hate that I now have to pay more for insurance to help support that.
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Old 10-16-13, 01:20 PM
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Re: Tobacco Master Settlement Agreements - 15 years later

If the tobacco companies were truly guilty of fraud, shouldn't a prosecutor have extracted fines, and not a plaintiff extracting a settlement?
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