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Atheists are more intelligent than religious folks.

Old 08-12-13, 10:12 AM
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Atheists are more intelligent than religious folks.

I done told you:

http://news.yahoo.com/religious-peop...3.html#upCr476

Religious people are less intelligent than non-believers, according to a new review of 63 scientific studies stretching back over decades.

A team led by Miron Zuckerman of the University of Rochester found “a reliable negative relation between intelligence and religiosity” in 53 out of 63 studies

Even in extreme old age, intelligent people are less likely to believe, the researchers found - and the reasons why people with high IQs shun religion may not be as simple as previously thought.

Previous studies have tended to assume that intelligent people simply “know better”, the researchers write - but the reasons may be more complex.




For instance, intelligent people are more likely to be married, and more likely to be successful in life - and this may mean they “need” religion less.

The studies used in Zuckerman's paper included a life-long analysis of the beliefs of a group of 1,500 gifted children - those with IQs over 135 - in a study which began in 1921 and continues today.

Even at 75 to 91 years of age, the children from Lewis Terman’s study scored lower for religiosity than the general population - contrary to the widely held belief that people turn to God as they age. The researchers noted that data was lacking about religious attitudes in old age and say, “Additional research is needed to resolve this issue.”

As early as 1958, Michael Argyle concluded, “Although intelligent children grasp religious concepts earlier, they are also the first to doubt the truth of religion, and intelligent students are much less likely to accept orthodox beliefs, and rather less likely to have pro-religious attitudes.”

A 1916 study quoted in Zuckerman’s paper (Leuba) found that, “58% of randomly selected scientists in the United States expressed disbelief in, or doubt regarding the existence of God; this proportion rose to nearly 70% for the most eminent scientists.”

The paper, published in the academic journal Personality and Social Psychology Review, said “Most extant explanations (of a negative relation) share one central theme—the premise that religious beliefs are irrational, not anchored in science, not testable and, therefore, unappealing to intelligent people who “know better.”

The answer may, however, be more complex. Intelligent people may simply be able to provide themselves with the psychological benefits offered by religion - such as “self-regulation and self-enhancement”, because they are more likely to be successful, and have stable lives.

“Intelligent people typically spend more time in school—a form of self-regulation that may yield long-term benefits,” the researchers write. “More intelligent people get higher level jobs (and better employment (and higher salary) may lead to higher self-esteem, and encourage personal control beliefs.”

“Last, more intelligent people are more likely to get and stay married (greater attachment), though for intelligent people, that too comes later in life. We therefore suggest that as intelligent people move from young adulthood to adulthood and then to middle age, the benefits of intelligence may continue to accrue.”

The researchers suggest that further research on the “function” of religion may reveal more..

“People possessing the functions that religion provides are likely to adopt atheism, people lacking these very functions (e.g., the poor, the helpless) are likely to adopt theism,” the researchers wrote.
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Old 08-12-13, 10:37 AM
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Re: Atheists are more intelligent than religious folks.

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Old 08-12-13, 10:51 AM
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Re: Atheists are more intelligent than religious folks.

Yeah, I imagine Dr. Mengele was of above-average intelligence, too.

But seriously, if a religion truly offered spiritual salvation to all mankind, doesn't it make sense that it wouldn't appeal to people directly commensurate to one limited attribute of that person---like their IQ, or height, or sex, or skin color?
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Old 08-12-13, 10:55 AM
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Re: Atheists are more intelligent than religious folks.

There's highly intelligent people who are both faith-minded and otherwise; saying one group's inherently more so than the other is a complete lie.
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Old 08-12-13, 11:00 AM
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Re: Atheists are more intelligent than religious folks.

Well as we know correlation does not equal causation. I think the article does a decent job of telling us why these studies have yielded the results that they have that goes beyond them claiming that you're stupid if you believe in God.
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Old 08-12-13, 11:07 AM
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Re: Atheists are more intelligent than religious folks.

Originally Posted by moviefan2k4 View Post
There's highly intelligent people who are both faith-minded and otherwise; saying one group's inherently more so than the other is a complete lie.
Of course there are, doesn't mean that on average, higher intelligence correlates with less religiosity. The study doesn't say one group is "inherently" more intelligent, and in fact the section posted here describes numerous reasons why this correlation exists. The research results say what they say, how is that a lie?
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Old 08-12-13, 11:08 AM
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Re: Atheists are more intelligent than religious folks.

All those hatetheists with their sintelligence...

Completely anecdotal observation: I've known probably five or six people whom I would classify as being "totally utterly fucking brilliant" in every conceivable manner. Only one of them was an atheist. This means nothing on any scale whatsoever, but I always found that compelling on a personal level. One of them was an Ivy League-educated surgeon, at the utter top of this field, who had come from a completely non-religious family. Upon examining the intricacies of the human body in such full detail, he came to the conclusion that there had to be a creator who crafted such an intricately beautiful mechanism, even if that creator simply set off the evolutionary processes that formed us over billions of years.

This is a worldview I agree with.

Last edited by Hokeyboy; 08-12-13 at 11:14 AM.
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Old 08-12-13, 11:09 AM
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Re: Atheists are more intelligent than religious folks.

Not all atheist
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Old 08-12-13, 11:10 AM
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Re: Atheists are more intelligent than religious folks.

Many intelligent children really believe in Santa Claus. It's just at some point, they rationalize this point. Is the refusal to rationalize belief in a deity a lack of intelligence? I wouldn't think so. It's stubbornness.
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Old 08-12-13, 11:20 AM
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Re: Atheists are more intelligent than religious folks.

Originally Posted by Hokeyboy View Post
All those hatetheists with their sintelligence...

Completely anecdotal observation: I've known probably five or six people whom I would classify as being "totally utterly fucking brilliant" in every conceivable manner. Only one of them was an atheist. This means nothing on any scale whatsoever, but I always found that compelling on a personal level. One of them was an Ivy League-educated surgeon, at the utter top of this field, who had come from a completely non-religious family. Upon examining the intricacies of the human body in such full detail, he came to the conclusion that there had to be a creator who crafted such an intricately beautiful mechanism, even if that creator simply set off the evolutionary processes that formed us over billions of years.

This is a worldview I agree with.


As opposed to an organism that developed itself through millions upon millions of years of evolution? I'd rather believe in that than some wishful thinking deity.

That's my worldview.
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Old 08-12-13, 11:34 AM
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Re: Atheists are more intelligent than religious folks.

The problem with religious belief to me is how centered it is on human experience and our unique perspective of the universe. Science is at least mindful of the limitations of our experiences and the way we observe reality, and seeks to limit the influence of bias that may result. Religion seems to double down on that bias.

So in the case of your surgeon, who is so taken with wonder and awe over understanding the complexities of the human body that he believes it MUST be a deity - there is an assumption that those feelings of wonder and awe mean anything at all, that they are truth. To me, there is no reason to draw conclusions from such emotions. What the human mind regards as complex and inexplicable has no bearing on whether something is actually so complex as to warrant explanation beyond natural processes.

Last edited by Nausicaa; 08-12-13 at 11:40 AM.
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Old 08-12-13, 11:40 AM
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Re: Atheists are more intelligent than religious folks.

Originally Posted by Hokeyboy View Post
All those hatetheists with their sintelligence...

Completely anecdotal observation: I've known probably five or six people whom I would classify as being "totally utterly fucking brilliant" in every conceivable manner. Only one of them was an atheist. This means nothing on any scale whatsoever, but I always found that compelling on a personal level. One of them was an Ivy League-educated surgeon, at the utter top of this field, who had come from a completely non-religious family. Upon examining the intricacies of the human body in such full detail, he came to the conclusion that there had to be a creator who crafted such an intricately beautiful mechanism, even if that creator simply set off the evolutionary processes that formed us over billions of years.

This is a worldview I agree with.
One one hand, you say there had to be a creator of the intricate mechanism and on the other you say it could also be completely based on evolution (with a spark - which seems unnecessarily added to fit into societal norms).
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Old 08-12-13, 11:46 AM
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Re: Atheists are more intelligent than religious folks.

I can see there being the correlation with "needing religion less." What these studies generally are believed to imply by people who bring them up is "since one group is more intelligent in general than the other group, the more intelligent group must be correct." That is a mighty leap, and ironically shows a lack of intelligence on the part of those who believe it.

If a study showed that one race was more intelligent than another, in general, would that be justification for anything in how we should act?
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Old 08-12-13, 11:48 AM
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Re: Atheists are more intelligent than religious folks.

Originally Posted by kvrdave View Post
If a study showed that one race was more intelligent than another, in general, would that be justification for anything in how we should act?
<iframe width="420" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/N8QEIaATPis" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
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Old 08-12-13, 11:56 AM
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Re: Atheists are more intelligent than religious folks.

Nothing to see here, move along....
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Old 08-12-13, 12:01 PM
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Re: Atheists are more intelligent than religious folks.

Originally Posted by wishbone View Post
<iframe width="420" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/N8QEIaATPis" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
You racists always assume it is black people.


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Old 08-12-13, 12:02 PM
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Re: Atheists are more intelligent than religious folks.

Originally Posted by CRM114 View Post
One one hand, you say there had to be a creator of the intricate mechanism and on the other you say it could also be completely based on evolution (with a spark - which seems unnecessarily added to fit into societal norms).
I fail to see how the two must be mutually exclusive.
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Old 08-12-13, 12:06 PM
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Re: Atheists are more intelligent than religious folks.

I know when I want to see thoughtful, intelligent discussions, the first place I go is /r/atheism.
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Old 08-12-13, 12:19 PM
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Re: Atheists are more intelligent than religious folks.

Originally Posted by Groucho View Post
I know when I want to see thoughtful, intelligent discussions, the first place I go is /r/atheism.
I thought you were going to say the Religion, Politics and World Events forum.
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Old 08-12-13, 12:20 PM
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Re: Atheists are more intelligent than religious folks.

This place went to shit when we started putting "World Events" in here.
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Old 08-12-13, 12:25 PM
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Re: Atheists are more intelligent than religious folks.

Define "religious people" and how you assess "religiosity".








(I'm an atheist, see how smart I am? )
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Old 08-12-13, 12:37 PM
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Re: Atheists are more intelligent than religious folks.

Originally Posted by Groucho View Post
I know when I want to see thoughtful, intelligent discussions, the first place I go is /r/atheism.
Groucho left out, "...when I've had a snootful and am three sheets to the wind."
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Old 08-12-13, 12:47 PM
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Re: Atheists are more intelligent than religious folks.

The same "intelligent" people who placed their faith in Obama... good call!
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Old 08-12-13, 12:51 PM
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Re: Atheists are more intelligent than religious folks.

Originally Posted by Th0r S1mpson View Post
The same "intelligent" people who placed their faith in Obama... good call!
Yeah, we shoulda gone with Romney. Our bad.
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Old 08-12-13, 12:56 PM
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Re: Atheists are more intelligent than religious folks.

I believe it. But, you are still talking about millions and millions of "religious & intelligent" people out there. A certain amount of IQ is education based (nurture); I've noticed that very religious people are pretty darn ignorant and send their kids away to schools that just propagate more ignorance.

Also, don't forget that IQ did not really measure how intelligent you are, it was just a predictor on how well you would do in school. In recent years the test has shifted to more abstract problem solving and critical thinking skills, but early tests did not. The scores in the 1920s should not really be compared to the test scores today. I'm sure there is a strong correlation between the two, but it won't be perfect.
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