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Obama wants minimum wage increase

Old 02-23-13, 05:59 PM
  #176  
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Re: Obama wants minimum wage increase

Originally Posted by BKenn01 View Post
Isnt it the Shareholders that decide CEO pay?
Ostensibly yes, but as a practical matter, very rarely. Do you give a lot of thought to your proxy cards (assuming you own stock)?
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Old 02-23-13, 06:38 PM
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Re: Obama wants minimum wage increase

Originally Posted by JasonF View Post
Ostensibly yes, but as a practical matter, very rarely. Do you give a lot of thought to your proxy cards (assuming you own stock)?
No but I assume its the Board that does. I dont buy stock as I use mutual funds so I dont pay attention to particular stocks.

I do think though that its to easy to blame the CEO. The real problem I think is Wall Street in general. I can only name one company (Costco) that for the most part says stick it we run our business not Wall Street. Wall Street is who demands higher and higher returns to the point of unreasonable expectations. Costco takes care of its employees and seems to be one of if not the most responsible company out there.
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Old 02-23-13, 09:33 PM
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Re: Obama wants minimum wage increase

You can say that stock holders pick the CEO and the pay, but really that is a small number of fund managers who are engaged in a very incestuous relationship in which they give and receive favors. Additionally, many of the fund managers may control a large amount of stock but only be in the stock for less than a year, and are looking for quick gains, and sometimes overpaying a CEO you know, and know how he works, can get that done for you.

There are a lot of changes that need to be made in the system. And thus, I stick to real estate and only buying when numbers are good.
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Old 02-23-13, 10:09 PM
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Re: Obama wants minimum wage increase

Originally Posted by BKenn01 View Post
No but I assume its the Board that does.
Typically, the Board decides executive compensation. Some boards are relatively independent of their CEO. Many are not, and will not treat the decision as to how to compensate their CEO as an arms-length transaction.

I do think though that its to easy to blame the CEO. The real problem I think is Wall Street in general. I can only name one company (Costco) that for the most part says stick it we run our business not Wall Street. Wall Street is who demands higher and higher returns to the point of unreasonable expectations. Costco takes care of its employees and seems to be one of if not the most responsible company out there.
I agree. Shareholders reward -- and therefore Boards and CEOs manage toward -- the next quarter's numbers. This can be particularly dangerous if you've got a CEO who isn't looking to manage a company long-term, and so doesn't really mind if he's setting up a company with problems that won't manifest for years down the road (this is what led to many of the issues with unfunded pensions).
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Old 02-23-13, 10:18 PM
  #180  
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Re: Obama wants minimum wage increase

Originally Posted by PopcornTreeCt View Post
Who didn't let Disney come to town? I'm genuinely curious. There would be no Orlando if it weren't for Disney so I think that's kinda silly.
Originally Posted by Supermallet View Post
I heard that Disney was planning a big park in Virginia, and it got shot down.
I can't remember, but do think it was along the East Coast, so it might have been Va.

They showed pic after pic of the Motel 6 hotels and strips of fast food and cheap outlet malls. And they got shot down...

Agree or disagree isn't the point. The point is the city/state was able to do what they felt was best for the community.
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Old 02-23-13, 10:25 PM
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Re: Obama wants minimum wage increase

Originally Posted by Dr Mabuse View Post
In several states now, they have 'paid' the state government to give them the right of imminent domain. They can take the land they want. The 'town b' can not stop them.



Well, though it's not germain to this topic that is one theory. But I'm not talking about theory, I'm saying how it's happening, like actually going down. They are getting rights and powers from the states by buying them, and ruining people's lives and taking their property to frack on, and leaving the rest of the property worthless and toxic, for obvious reasons, and sometimes paying a pittance to the property owners.
Just so I'm clear, as obviously you have the inside knowledge....

Acme Gas go in and brides ALL the local officials to not only allow them to come in, but keep their mouths shut.

Then they come in, hire away ALL employees of ALL local businesses by paying outrageous salaries.

Then they mess up ALL the water, take ALL the natural resources and after a couple years they leave, firing all the people, who can't get jobs anywhere else at close to the pay that ACME was giving them. And they need that money as they all bought McMansions and didn't actually save any of the money in case it didn't last.

Then ACME goes to the next state/community as no one knows this is actually going on, and does it again. And again. And again.

Is that about it???
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Old 02-23-13, 10:52 PM
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Re: Obama wants minimum wage increase

Originally Posted by Sdallnct View Post
I can't remember, but do think it was along the East Coast, so it might have been Va.

They showed pic after pic of the Motel 6 hotels and strips of fast food and cheap outlet malls. And they got shot down...

Agree or disagree isn't the point. The point is the city/state was able to do what they felt was best for the community.
Ah, never heard about it. That's true about cheap strip malls and fast food joints. We've got plenty of those.

I'm sure towns always have the ability to say no, it's just if a company pushes hard enough they can eventually convince nearly everyone in the town to go along with the plan. But even then Daniel Plainview didn't need everyone on board... DRAINAGE! (another TWBB reference)
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Old 02-23-13, 11:51 PM
  #183  
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Re: Obama wants minimum wage increase

Originally Posted by Sdallnct View Post
Just so I'm clear, as obviously you have the inside knowledge....

Acme Gas go in and brides ALL the local officials to not only allow them to come in, but keep their mouths shut.
The amount of weddings they perform is mind-boggling.
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Old 02-24-13, 03:14 AM
  #184  
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Re: Obama wants minimum wage increase

Originally Posted by BKenn01 View Post
No but I assume its the Board that does. I dont buy stock as I use mutual funds so I dont pay attention to particular stocks.

I do think though that its to easy to blame the CEO. The real problem I think is Wall Street in general. I can only name one company (Costco) that for the most part says stick it we run our business not Wall Street. Wall Street is who demands higher and higher returns to the point of unreasonable expectations. Costco takes care of its employees and seems to be one of if not the most responsible company out there.
Originally Posted by JasonF View Post
Typically, the Board decides executive compensation. Some boards are relatively independent of their CEO. Many are not, and will not treat the decision as to how to compensate their CEO as an arms-length transaction.



I agree. Shareholders reward -- and therefore Boards and CEOs manage toward -- the next quarter's numbers. This can be particularly dangerous if you've got a CEO who isn't looking to manage a company long-term, and so doesn't really mind if he's setting up a company with problems that won't manifest for years down the road (this is what led to many of the issues with unfunded pensions).
Meh...there are "good" stock companies and bad. Just as there are "good" private companies and bad. Just as there are "good" employee owned companies and bad. Just as there are "good" customer owned companies and bad.

There are positives and negatives to every type of company. The same negative you state for a stock company can be a strength. If a company for example wants to expand but has little capital to do so, being a stock company has its advantages as it is much easier to quickly raise that capital.

Again, I can make a pretty good arguement that the small business, even mom and pop establishments are "worse" than big business even though they don't have an evil CEO.

Can I ask what factual things you have for your love of Costco? I occasionally see them mentioned as a top employer but I don't remember ever seeing them in the top 10 if even close to that. Companies like Google, Southwest Airlines, Apple, American Express, Sarbucks, Whole Foods (which I think some dont like the CEO), Fed Ex, ect are companies I'm use to hearing as being good places to work.

Sure I've heard Costco pays good wages and good benefits. But lots of companies do that.
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Old 02-24-13, 05:44 PM
  #185  
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Re: Obama wants minimum wage increase

Originally Posted by Sdallnct View Post
Meh...there are "good" stock companies and bad. Just as there are "good" private companies and bad. Just as there are "good" employee owned companies and bad. Just as there are "good" customer owned companies and bad.

There are positives and negatives to every type of company. The same negative you state for a stock company can be a strength. If a company for example wants to expand but has little capital to do so, being a stock company has its advantages as it is much easier to quickly raise that capital.

Again, I can make a pretty good arguement that the small business, even mom and pop establishments are "worse" than big business even though they don't have an evil CEO.

Can I ask what factual things you have for your love of Costco? I occasionally see them mentioned as a top employer but I don't remember ever seeing them in the top 10 if even close to that. Companies like Google, Southwest Airlines, Apple, American Express, Sarbucks, Whole Foods (which I think some dont like the CEO), Fed Ex, ect are companies I'm use to hearing as being good places to work.



Sure I've heard Costco pays good wages and good benefits. But lots of companies do that.
Well I for one have actually talked to several workers there. They all speak highly of Costco. They say they pay them well. There must be something to it the place has been open for 5 years or so now and i havent seen much turnover. I also prefer shopping there to Sam's. I have a membership at both and Costco carries higher quality stuff at lower prices. I probably wont renew the Sam's this time around. Its just not paying me to have both.

Costco is also famous for thumbing its nose at Wall Street. WS hates their margin caps and wants them to increase their prices for more profit. The basic model is the profit is made on the memberships and the products are marked up just enough to cover overhead. And where else can you get a 1/4 lb Hot Dog and Coke for $1.50

Last edited by BKenn01; 02-24-13 at 07:03 PM.
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Old 02-24-13, 07:41 PM
  #186  
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Re: Obama wants minimum wage increase

Costco also has some bombass churros!
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Old 02-24-13, 09:00 PM
  #187  
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Re: Obama wants minimum wage increase

Originally Posted by BKenn01 View Post
Well I for one have actually talked to several workers there. They all speak highly of Costco. They say they pay them well. There must be something to it the place has been open for 5 years or so now and i havent seen much turnover. I also prefer shopping there to Sam's. I have a membership at both and Costco carries higher quality stuff at lower prices. I probably wont renew the Sam's this time around. Its just not paying me to have both.

Costco is also famous for thumbing its nose at Wall Street. WS hates their margin caps and wants them to increase their prices for more profit. The basic model is the profit is made on the memberships and the products are marked up just enough to cover overhead. And where else can you get a 1/4 lb Hot Dog and Coke for $1.50
Well when Wall Street told them their employees should pay more of their health care Costco did that. Not as much as stockholders wanted or even as much as the industry average, but they did raise it. So that is hardly "thumbing their nose at stockholders".

So basically you like them as they do what a lot of other companies do. Fair enough.

Btw, I love Costco and dropped my membership to SAMs. Love their steaks.

But as an employer, I've really never seen, heard or read anything all that awesome, or that I haven't heard from other companies. And while they show up on some "best places to work" lists, they certainly aren't listed as a top 10, 20 company...
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Old 02-24-13, 09:29 PM
  #188  
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Re: Obama wants minimum wage increase

Originally Posted by Sdallnct View Post
Well when Wall Street told them their employees should pay more of their health care Costco did that. Not as much as stockholders wanted or even as much as the industry average, but they did raise it. So that is hardly "thumbing their nose at stockholders".

So basically you like them as they do what a lot of other companies do. Fair enough.

Btw, I love Costco and dropped my membership to SAMs. Love their steaks.

But as an employer, I've really never seen, heard or read anything all that awesome, or that I haven't heard from other companies. And while they show up on some "best places to work" lists, they certainly aren't listed as a top 10, 20 company...
Making employees pay more for their health care wouldnt make them a bad employer in my book. I think every company should make their employees pay something and structure it in a way that they help hold down costs.

You have to understand I appreciate Costco for not changing a lot for Wal Street because as someone who has sold part time on ebay for almost ten years I have seen ebay fuck sellers every way they can to please wall street.
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Old 02-24-13, 11:38 PM
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Re: Obama wants minimum wage increase

Indeed. +1
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Old 02-25-13, 03:13 AM
  #190  
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Re: Obama wants minimum wage increase

Originally Posted by BKenn01 View Post
Making employees pay more for their health care wouldnt make them a bad employer in my book. I think every company should make their employees pay something and structure it in a way that they help hold down costs.

You have to understand I appreciate Costco for not changing a lot for Wal Street because as someone who has sold part time on ebay for almost ten years I have seen ebay fuck sellers every way they can to please wall street.
Oh I agree with you. It just now we have gone from "Costco thumbs its nose at Wall Street" to they didn't change "a lot" for Wall Street.

As mentioned, I also think Costco is a good place to work. My entire point is certainly they are not the only good place to work. And I haven't heard them do anything that many other companies do. And there are many other companies (that I've previously mentioned) that have a better reputation than Costco (not that Costco is bad).

And I certainly agree there are companies that try it "game the system" I don't think it super common, or that those companies last. I don't sell on ebay. Only bought a handful of times. So I have no experience with them. Nor have i really read a lot about their business mode. But I can only assume they offer you something for you to keep dealing with them.

And to be clear, I think no company is perfect. Nor is any employee perfect.
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Old 02-25-13, 10:58 AM
  #191  
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Re: Obama wants minimum wage increase

Originally Posted by Sdallnct View Post
Just so I'm clear, as obviously you have the inside knowledge....

Acme Gas go in and brides ALL the local officials to not only allow them to come in, but keep their mouths shut.

Then they come in, hire away ALL employees of ALL local businesses by paying outrageous salaries.

Then they mess up ALL the water, take ALL the natural resources and after a couple years they leave, firing all the people, who can't get jobs anywhere else at close to the pay that ACME was giving them. And they need that money as they all bought McMansions and didn't actually save any of the money in case it didn't last.

Then ACME goes to the next state/community as no one knows this is actually going on, and does it again. And again. And again.

Is that about it???
Actually, in this instance, they buy the oil/gas rights (they actually lease them). It is a pretty slick deal. You really only need to buy a few, and because of the way the government allows you to drill under other people's land for stuff like that, the other people essentially have to sign up as well, or get screwed out of anything.

But with eminent domain, they have a lot of power in most all the states. The SCOTUS decision made life pretty easy for companies that want to take other people's land. My state, fortunately, went in and changed the laws to toughen them up after that decision. But in most states, it is pretty damn easy.
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Old 02-25-13, 11:07 AM
  #192  
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Re: Obama wants minimum wage increase

Sdall doesn't understand what has been happening for years now, so all that 'let me get this straight' stuff is blind guessing. I do understand why what has been occurring, in the real world mind you, for years, would be hard to believe if someone were ignorant of the subject matter. That's a natural reaction to how bad the situation is actually - disbelief. But that is how it's going down, and has been going down, for years now.

There's nothing to 'get straight'.
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Old 02-25-13, 05:32 PM
  #193  
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Re: Obama wants minimum wage increase

Originally Posted by Sdallnct View Post
Oh I agree with you. It just now we have gone from "Costco thumbs its nose at Wall Street" to they didn't change "a lot" for Wall Street.

As mentioned, I also think Costco is a good place to work. My entire point is certainly they are not the only good place to work. And I haven't heard them do anything that many other companies do. And there are many other companies (that I've previously mentioned) that have a better reputation than Costco (not that Costco is bad).

And I certainly agree there are companies that try it "game the system" I don't think it super common, or that those companies last. I don't sell on ebay. Only bought a handful of times. So I have no experience with them. Nor have i really read a lot about their business mode. But I can only assume they offer you something for you to keep dealing with them.

And to be clear, I think no company is perfect. Nor is any employee perfect.
Well it could be that those companies are better at marketing that they are great employers. I would say that is definitley the case with Starbucks and Southwest Airlines.

Costco is a very social responsible company and its not really as in your face as some lead you to believe. I have had family members make comments about them being "Liberals". May be some truth to it but their magazine is very fair and balanced they provide opposing points of view when they make a political argument.

I appreciate a company that wants to change by leading by example as opposed to others who want to impose change on the world.
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Old 02-25-13, 05:52 PM
  #194  
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Re: Obama wants minimum wage increase

Originally Posted by Dr Mabuse View Post
Sdall doesn't understand what has been happening for years now, so all that 'let me get this straight' stuff is blind guessing. I do understand why what has been occurring, in the real world mind you, for years, would be hard to believe if someone were ignorant of the subject matter. That's a natural reaction to how bad the situation is actually - disbelief. But that is how it's going down, and has been going down, for years now.

There's nothing to 'get straight'.
And there is nothing that can be done to stop it? I honestly don't know if your slamming the companies that do this or the "idiot" townspeople that let it happen.

My disbelief is just in your assertion that "this is just the way it is". That no one can do anything about it. That no one has power over these mighty companies.
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Old 02-25-13, 06:22 PM
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Re: Obama wants minimum wage increase

Originally Posted by Sdallnct View Post
My disbelief is just in your assertion that "this is just the way it is". That no one can do anything about it. That no one has power over these mighty companies.
If we had elected Obama instead of McCain, this would have been solved by now.
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Old 02-25-13, 06:42 PM
  #196  
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Re: Obama wants minimum wage increase

Originally Posted by Sdallnct View Post
My disbelief is just in your assertion that "this is just the way it is". That no one can do anything about it. That no one has power over these mighty companies.
Welcome to America. Take your shoes off...

No one does, except voters, and thus no one does or will have power over them.
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Old 02-25-13, 09:08 PM
  #197  
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Re: Obama wants minimum wage increase

The difference between Republicans and Democrats is one chooses the government to rule them and the other chooses corporations.
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Old 02-25-13, 09:11 PM
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Re: Obama wants minimum wage increase

Originally Posted by PopcornTreeCt View Post
The difference between Republicans and Democrats is one chooses the government to rule them and the other chooses corporations.
They both mismanage the former, and are owned by the latter.
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Old 02-26-13, 06:25 AM
  #199  
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Re: Obama wants minimum wage increase

Originally Posted by Dr Mabuse View Post
Welcome to America. Take your shoes off...

No one does, except voters, and thus no one does or will have power over them.
Ha! We agree. The people that choose to bring this on themselves have no one to blame but themselves.
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Old 02-26-13, 09:24 AM
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Re: Obama wants minimum wage increase

Originally Posted by Rockmjd23 View Post
They both mismanage the former, and are owned by the latter.
Yup. Our government has been sold out. But that's because the people have been manipulated into believing regulations are bad, labor laws are unnessary and taxes are worse than Ebola. It's no wonder government, the only thing defending the people, has given in when everyone around them believe business has our best interest.
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