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Neurosurgeon Lectures Obama on Obamacare

Old 02-09-13, 08:41 AM
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Neurosurgeon Lectures Obama on Obamacare

Neurosurgeon at National Prayer Breakfast Lectures Obama on Obamacare

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/vid...obamacare.html

With Video....and Obama right there.


DR. CARSON: What we need to do is come up with something simple. And when I pick up my Bible, you know what I see? I see the fairest individual in the universe, God, and he's given us a system. It's called a tithe.

We don't necessarily have to do 10% but it's the principle. He didn't say if your crops fail, don't give me any tithe or if you have a bumper crop, give me triple tithe. So there must be something inherently fair about proportionality. You make $10 billion, you put in a billion. You make $10 you put in one. Of course you've got to get rid of the loopholes. Some people say, 'Well that's not fair because it doesn't hurt the guy who made $10 billion as much as the guy who made 10.' Where does it say you've got to hurt the guy? He just put a billion dollars in the pot. We don't need to hurt him. It's that kind of thinking that has resulted in 602 banks in the Cayman Islands. That money needs to be back here building our infrastructure and creating jobs.

###

DR. CARSON: Here's my solution: When a person is born, give him a birth certificate, an electronic medical record, and a health savings account to which money can be contributed -- pretax -- from the time you're born 'til the time you die. When you die, you can pass it on to your family members, so that when you're 85 years old and you got six diseases, you're not trying to spend up everything. You're happy to pass it on and there's nobody talking about death panels.

Number one. And also, for the people who were indigent who don't have any money we can make contributions to their HSA each month because we already have this huge pot of money. Instead of sending it to some bureaucracy, let's put it in their HSAs. Now they have some control over their own health care.
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Old 02-09-13, 08:44 AM
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Re: Neurosurgeon Lectures Obama on Obamacare

Meh, he believe in God so we should dismiss everything he says.
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Old 02-09-13, 09:03 AM
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Re: Neurosurgeon Lectures Obama on Obamacare

I don't dismiss him because he believes in God. I dismiss him because his proposal is idiotic. Since he's a neurosurgeon, I assume that he's no longer using the medical prescribed in the Bible (such as the plague cure in Leviticus 14 that involves doing laundry and sprinkling bird's blood on the victim). Yet he thinks the economic and governmental models used for a bronze-age agrarian tribe is appropriate for our society?
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Old 02-09-13, 09:12 AM
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Re: Neurosurgeon Lectures Obama on Obamacare

Oh good, another health care thread.
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Old 02-09-13, 09:21 AM
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Re: Neurosurgeon Lectures Obama on Obamacare

Originally Posted by wendersfan View Post
Oh good, another health care thread.
Well, I'm trying to make it a religion thread.
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Old 02-09-13, 09:22 AM
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Re: Neurosurgeon Lectures Obama on Obamacare

Being a brain surgeon and an armchair theologian does not equal being an economist.
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Old 02-09-13, 09:25 AM
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Re: Neurosurgeon Lectures Obama on Obamacare

He is right about the need to push HSA's. The Health Care industry needs to be forced to compete.
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Old 02-09-13, 09:28 AM
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Re: Neurosurgeon Lectures Obama on Obamacare

Originally Posted by wendersfan View Post
Oh good, another health care thread.
...only now with more religious cowbell!
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Old 02-09-13, 09:30 AM
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Re: Neurosurgeon Lectures Obama on Obamacare

Originally Posted by Jason View Post
Being a brain surgeon and an armchair theologian does not equal being an economist.
But maybe he also posts on message boards.
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Old 02-09-13, 09:41 AM
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Re: Neurosurgeon Lectures Obama on Obamacare

Ah, the good ol' HSA talk. Because it's easier to just make people pay, instead of actually trying to lower healthcare costs.
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Old 02-09-13, 10:26 AM
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Re: Neurosurgeon Lectures Obama on Obamacare

Originally Posted by wendersfan View Post
Oh good, another health care thread.
Shouldn't it be merged with the main thread?
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Old 02-09-13, 10:33 AM
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Re: Neurosurgeon Lectures Obama on Obamacare

Originally Posted by Jason View Post
Being a brain surgeon and an armchair theologian does not equal being an economist.
After reading only the title, that's what I have to say.

You know, *I* could be a better president than Bush or Obama. I just don't feel like it.

La de da da.
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Old 02-09-13, 10:45 AM
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Re: Neurosurgeon Lectures Obama on Obamacare

Ah, the brain surgeon is a Jesus freak. I stopped reading.
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Old 02-09-13, 11:28 AM
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Re: Neurosurgeon Lectures Obama on Obamacare

Originally Posted by PopcornTreeCt View Post
Ah, the good ol' HSA talk. Because it's easier to just make people pay, instead of actually trying to lower healthcare costs.
Gee last time I looked thats what consumerism (free of Cronyism) does. Check out the facts. Where HSA are used the pricing and lowered health care cost.

There is no magic pill to lower health care cost. It has to be done by market forces.

I suspect you have never dealt with an HSA.
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Old 02-09-13, 11:36 AM
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Re: Neurosurgeon Lectures Obama on Obamacare

Originally Posted by Thor Simpson View Post
But maybe he also posts on message boards.
And gets interviewed on blogs too!

I wonder if I could get an autograph?
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Old 02-09-13, 01:57 PM
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Re: Neurosurgeon Lectures Obama on Obamacare

Originally Posted by Jason View Post

I wonder if I could get an autograph?
You could ask him to autograph your brain!
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Old 02-09-13, 01:57 PM
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Re: Neurosurgeon Lectures Obama on Obamacare

Originally Posted by BKenn01 View Post
Gee last time I looked thats what consumerism (free of Cronyism) does. Check out the facts. Where HSA are used the pricing and lowered health care cost.

There is no magic pill to lower health care cost. It has to be done by market forces.

I suspect you have never dealt with an HSA.
Your idea of lowering health costs is dependent on people refusing medical care because of a limited amount of funds. This isn't sustainable and completely ignores the larger issues of rising higher healthcare costs.
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Old 02-09-13, 02:32 PM
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Re: Neurosurgeon Lectures Obama on Obamacare

Originally Posted by eXcentris View Post
You could ask him to autograph your brain!
Well, there's plenty of blank space up there
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Old 02-09-13, 08:03 PM
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Re: Neurosurgeon Lectures Obama on Obamacare

Originally Posted by wendersfan View Post
Oh good, another health care thread.
Originally Posted by CRM114 View Post
fucking suck it up.
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Old 02-09-13, 08:21 PM
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Re: Neurosurgeon Lectures Obama on Obamacare

Originally Posted by wendersfan View Post
Oh good, another health care thread.
That sounds like a threadcrap. Who do you think you are, a moderator or something? Oh, wait...
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Old 02-09-13, 10:18 PM
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Re: Neurosurgeon Lectures Obama on Obamacare

Before addressing the POUSA and company, I would think a person would want to do a bit of research. This guy is wrong in every conceivable way.

Originally Posted by K&AJones View Post
[I]DR. CARSON: What we need to do is come up with something simple. And when I pick up my Bible, you know what I see? I see the fairest individual in the universe, God, and he's given us a system. It's called a tithe.
God commanded the Jews to tithe, not the Gentiles. Non-Jewish Christians aren't required to follow most ancient Jewish laws.

We don't necessarily have to do 10% but it's the principle. He didn't say if your crops fail, don't give me any tithe or if you have a bumper crop, give me triple tithe. So there must be something inherently fair about proportionality...
Let's see what Paul has to say about this matter:

2 Corinthians 8

10 And here is my judgment about what is best for you in this matter. Last year you were the first not only to give but also to have the desire to do so. 11 Now finish the work, so that your eager willingness to do it may be matched by your completion of it, according to your means. 12 For if the willingness is there, the gift is acceptable according to what one has, not according to what one does not have.

13 Our desire is not that others might be relieved while you are hard pressed, but that there might be equality. 14 At the present time your plenty will supply what they need, so that in turn their plenty will supply what you need. The goal is equality, 15 as it is written: “The one who gathered much did not have too much, and the one who gathered little did not have too little.”
2 Corinthians 9

6 Remember this: Whoever sows sparingly will also reap sparingly, and whoever sows generously will also reap generously. 7 Each of you should give what you have decided in your heart to give, not reluctantly or under compulsion, for God loves a cheerful giver.
Paul does NOT speak of proportionality. He says to give "according to your means" and "your heart."

One thing that I admire about Christianity is that many of its principles are NOT simplistic and clear-cut. Christians must think critically in order to apply the principles.

Ironically, many of the same people who whine about "dumbing down" education want to "dumb down" Christian principles. The concept of a 10% tithe has tremendous appeal for two groups of people: 1) people who don't like to trouble themselves with thinking and 2) rich people.

It's understandable why rich Americans would ignore Paul's words. First, they smack of socialism. And second, they imply that rich Christians should feel impelled (i.e. forced from within, guided by the Holy Spirit) to give much more than 10% of their income.
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Old 02-09-13, 10:44 PM
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Re: Neurosurgeon Lectures Obama on Obamacare

Beyond being wrong from a biblical perspective, this guy is also wrong about the purpose of a progressive tax system.

Some people say, 'Well that's not fair because it doesn't hurt the guy who made $10 billion as much as the guy who made 10.' Where does it say you've got to hurt the guy? He just put a billion dollars in the pot. We don't need to hurt him...
The goal of a progressive tax system isn't to hurt anyone. In fact, it's the opposite. The goal is to fund vital services that benefit EVERYONE, although not necessarily in proportion to what they have contributed.

Do some people use the words in the quote? Yes. But their main point is that a flat tax hurts poor people. They want to provide relief to poor people, NOT hurt rich people.

A person who is smart enough to become a surgeon knows this. So this guy is, in essence, a sophist and a demagogue.
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Old 02-10-13, 04:48 AM
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Re: Neurosurgeon Lectures Obama on Obamacare

Originally Posted by BKenn01 View Post
Gee last time I looked thats what consumerism (free of Cronyism) does. Check out the facts. Where HSA are used the pricing and lowered health care cost.

There is no magic pill to lower health care cost. It has to be done by market forces.

I suspect you have never dealt with an HSA.
That worked brilliantly over here in the UK! Oh, wait..
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Old 02-10-13, 08:03 AM
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Re: Neurosurgeon Lectures Obama on Obamacare

Originally Posted by JasonF View Post
I don't dismiss him because he believes in God. I dismiss him because his proposal is idiotic. Since he's a neurosurgeon, I assume that he's no longer using the medical prescribed in the Bible (such as the plague cure in Leviticus 14 that involves doing laundry and sprinkling bird's blood on the victim). Yet he thinks the economic and governmental models used for a bronze-age agrarian tribe is appropriate for our society?
So you think that the Bible is actually advocating striking rocks with a rod as the "prescribed method" for producing water during a drought?
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Old 02-10-13, 08:12 AM
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Re: Neurosurgeon Lectures Obama on Obamacare

Originally Posted by Ghostbuster View Post
Before addressing the POUSA and company, I would think a person would want to do a bit of research. This guy is wrong in every conceivable way.

God commanded the Jews to tithe, not the Gentiles. Non-Jewish Christians aren't required to follow most ancient Jewish laws.

Let's see what Paul has to say about this matter:

Paul does NOT speak of proportionality. He says to give "according to your means" and "your heart."

One thing that I admire about Christianity is that many of its principles are NOT simplistic and clear-cut. Christians must think critically in order to apply the principles.

Ironically, many of the same people who whine about "dumbing down" education want to "dumb down" Christian principles. The concept of a 10% tithe has tremendous appeal for two groups of people: 1) people who don't like to trouble themselves with thinking and 2) rich people.

It's understandable why rich Americans would ignore Paul's words. First, they smack of socialism. And second, they imply that rich Christians should feel impelled (i.e. forced from within, guided by the Holy Spirit) to give much more than 10% of their income.

Tithing is mentioned several times in the New Testament, including a command from Christ to tithe.

As Paul implies, one is not limited to a proportionate tithe. That is a bare minimum. As you state, one would assume that grateful believers who have been financially blessed with far more than what is needed for the essentials of life would desire to give back far more than 10%.
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