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Religion, Politics and World Events They make great dinner conversation, don't you think? plus Political Film

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Old 03-14-11, 03:43 PM   #26
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Re: One & Only Illegal Immigration Thread: Part IX

By all means, lets coddle illegal immigrants some more:

http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la...,7690525.story

Quote:
LAPD limits impounding of unlicensed drivers' cars
Previous policy for sobriety checkpoints had been criticized by immigration advocacy groups.

By Joel Rubin and Ari Bloomekatz, Los Angeles Times

March 12, 2011
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Under criticism that it was unfairly targeting undocumented immigrants, the Los Angeles Police Department on Friday announced changes to its rules for impounding cars of unlicensed drivers at sobriety checkpoints.


Previously, LAPD officers at such checkpoints followed stringent protocols that called for them to impound a car whenever the driver was found not to have a valid license, regardless of whether the driver had been drinking.

Those rules have drawn the ire of immigration advocacy groups that said they disproportionately targeted undocumented immigrants, who are not able to obtain licenses legally in nearly all U.S. states. Once a vehicle is impounded, law enforcement agencies often require it to remain locked up for at least a month and charge the owner hefty fees to release it.

The new LAPD guidelines soften the department's stance somewhat. Police will be required to make an attempt to contact the registered owner of the stopped vehicle. If the owner is a licensed driver and can respond to the checkpoint in "a reasonable period of time," the officers will release the car to him or her. If the owner is unlicensed, officers will permit another person who is a licensed driver to take the car.

If no one with a license is available, police will impound a vehicle. In any case, police will issue a citation to the unlicensed driver.

Police Chief Charlie Beck said that since he took over the department more than a year ago, the checkpoint policy had "stuck in my craw as one of the things we weren't doing the right way." Beck said he decided to make the change after immigration rights advocates raised the issue with him anew in meetings this week.

"I'm tired of casting the net so wide," he said. "This is the right thing to do. There is a fairness issue here … and we're trying to balance the needs of all segments of our community and keep the roads safe."

The new rules, Beck said, were an attempt to mitigate somewhat "the current reality, which is that for a vast number of people, who are a valuable asset to our community and who have very limited resources, their ability to live and work in L.A. is severely limited by their immigration status."


The change, which the department announced in a news release late Friday afternoon, is likely to anger groups that support strict enforcement of immigration laws. Efforts to contact representatives of several of those groups for comment were unsuccessful.

The issue of impounds has become a controversial topic in recent years. Police in the small cities of Bell and Maywood have been accused of systematically targeting undocumented immigrants when impounding cars in an effort to boost municipal revenues.

Ron Gochez, a member of the steering committee for the Southern California Immigration Coalition, expressed limited praise for the LAPD's change but questioned why the department needed to impound a car if the driver had not been drinking.

"It's a step in the right direction, but it still falls short of what we're asking for," he said. "We're not against checkpoints. We want checkpoints to happen, we want drunk drivers off our streets. We just don't want people to be losing their cars who aren't drunk."
Now I do think that in cases like the City of Bell, where corruption ran rampant, there was abuse of the towing policies and they did target illegal immigrants. But this is only "unfairly" targeting illegal immigrants because they're doing something else that's illegal, driving without a license. And if they're driving without a license, how many are driving without insurance? It's almost mandatory here now to get "unlicensed drivers insurance."
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Old 03-14-11, 03:52 PM   #27
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Re: One & Only Illegal Immigration Thread: Part IX

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Originally Posted by fujishig View Post
And if they're driving without a license, how many are driving without insurance?
Tell us! please please tell us! I can't stand this terrible, terrible suspense! spill it already!
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Old 03-14-11, 04:11 PM   #28
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Re: One & Only Illegal Immigration Thread: Part IX

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Originally Posted by Superboy View Post
Tell us! please please tell us! I can't stand this terrible, terrible suspense! spill it already!
So by your sarcasm, are you agreeing with this softening of the LAPD's policy? Here's another question: How many of these citations actually get paid, and how many of these unlicensed drivers will actually stop driving and not become repeat offenders?
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Old 03-14-11, 09:28 PM   #29
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Re: One & Only Illegal Immigration Thread: Part IX

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The new rules, Beck said, were an attempt to mitigate somewhat "the current reality, which is that for a vast number of people, who are a valuable asset to our community and who have very limited resources, their ability to live and work in L.A. is severely limited by their immigration status."


Public transportation to the rescue!
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Old 03-14-11, 09:46 PM   #30
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Re: One & Only Illegal Immigration Thread: Part IX

I wish! There would be thousands of less hit and run accidents each year....if public transportation was used.
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Old 03-14-11, 10:47 PM   #31
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Re: One & Only Illegal Immigration Thread: Part IX

Considering that driving is a privlege not a right, you'd think this wouldn't be an issue.
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Old 03-16-11, 12:34 AM   #32
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Re: One & Only Illegal Immigration Thread: Part IX

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20110315/...ecurity_delays

Quote:
New border technology slow to be deployed

– Tue Mar 15, 3:16 pm ET

WASHINGTON – Technology to replace a now defunct virtual fence project at the Mexican border likely won't be fully in place for at least another decade, maybe longer, according to the Government Accountability Office.

Richard Stana, director of homeland security and justice issues at the GAO, said Tuesday that the mix of cameras, radar and other sophisticated technology will first be deployed to the border in Arizona over the next two years. The technology mix is expected to be fully deployed in that state by 2015 or 2016.

Stana, who testified Tuesday before a House subcommittee on border and maritime security, said the security project would next expand to California, New Mexico and Texas but isn't likely to be fully in place until at least 2021, and possibly not until 2026.

The new technology plan replaces a virtual fence project that cost nearly $1 billion before the Obama administration scrapped it earlier this year after repeated delays and glitches. It will be added to stationary cameras, underground sensors and other security infrastructure already in place.

Rep. Mike McCaul, R-Texas, balked at the idea that the high tech gear, which he said is already available to the military, would take more than a decade to be deployed.

"You are talking 10 to 15 years. It took us a decade to put a man on the moon," McCaul said. "I don't understand why it takes so long. You have a crisis going on down there. Everyone knows it. We know how dangerous it is in Mexico, we know how dangerous it is on the border. Why can't we ramp up this process?"

Mark Borkowski, Customs and Border Protection assistant commissioner for technology innovation and acquisition, said the new equipment could be bought more quickly if Congress allocated the money — the Arizona project is expected to have a price tag of about $755 million — but where to put what equipment has not been determined.

"The question is where do we put the first ones and why do we put them there," Borkowski said.

He said Homeland Security officials are putting the new equipment in Arizona first because it is busiest Border Patrol sector in the country.

After the morning hearing, Borkowski said he had not previously heard the GAO time line, but conceded that the technology deployment is a multi-year plan. And future budgets will have a big influence on how much gear is bought and when it is deployed.

The virtual fence, which was officially abandoned in January, was initiated in 2005 and was originally expected to be fully in place by this year. Instead, only about 53 miles of operational "virtual fence" was put in place in Arizona at a cost of about $15 million a mile.
No surprise. I was figuring that I wouldn't see a secure border between Mexico and the United States in my lifetime anyway.
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Old 03-16-11, 12:52 AM   #33
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Re: One & Only Illegal Immigration Thread: Part IX

Quote:
Rep. Mike McCaul, R-Texas, balked at the idea that the high tech gear, which he said is already available to the military, would take more than a decade to be deployed.

"You are talking 10 to 15 years. It took us a decade to put a man on the moon," McCaul said. "I don't understand why it takes so long. You have a crisis going on down there. Everyone knows it. We know how dangerous it is in Mexico, we know how dangerous it is on the border. Why can't we ramp up this process?"
Gotta love Republicans. "Cut taxes! Cut spending! Cut taxes! Cut spending! Wait, why will it take 15 years for my pet boondoggle to get done?"
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Old 03-16-11, 06:30 AM   #34
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Re: One & Only Illegal Immigration Thread: Part IX

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Originally Posted by Sean O'Hara View Post
Gotta love Republicans. "Cut taxes! Cut spending! Cut taxes! Cut spending! Wait, why will it take 15 years for my pet boondoggle to get done?"
Yeah, after they had already dropped a billion dollars to Boeing for a pretty much useless virtual fence project. I mean, how hard can it be to create an effective electronic security monitoring system for 2000 miles of U.S.-Mexico border? We should just use "military technology!"
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Old 03-21-11, 05:25 PM   #35
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Re: One & Only Illegal Immigration Thread: Part IX

Regarding the impounding of cars at DUI checkpoints article:

Quote:
The change, which the department announced in a news release late Friday afternoon, is likely to anger groups that support strict enforcement of immigration laws
I'm actuall a person who supports strict enforcement of driving laws. Drivers who do not have a drivers license should have their cars impounded. It's that fucking simple. You need three things to drive a car: License, registration, insurance. If you haven't paid for all three, fuck you and the car you rode in on.

I'm a fully employed, fully licensed, tax paying, hard working citizen. They'd impound my car in a heartbeat.
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Old 03-21-11, 06:07 PM   #36
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Re: One & Only Illegal Immigration Thread: Part IX

Mormons to Illegal Immigrants: Come over to Utah!
(and before people accuse me of stereotyping all of Utah as being Mormon, the article mentions the Mormon church multiple times as pushing for this. And Utah is a Red state...):

http://www.latimes.com/news/nationwo...,5307414.story

Excerpts:

Quote:
Utah has long had softer laws on illegal immigration than even states such as California. It allows illegal-immigrant students to pay in-state tuition at public universities and gives "driving privilege cards" to undocumented migrants to allow them to obtain insurance.

The dynamic is partly explained by the number of people in Utah who have performed missions in other countries for the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints and are sympathetic to the plight of outsiders.

But in recent years, anger against illegal immigration has spread to Utah as well. Two veteran GOP members of Congress — Rep. Chris Cannon and Sen. Robert F. Bennett — were ousted in primaries partly because of their defense of illegal immigrants. After Arizona passed a tough measure targeting illegal immigrants, polls in Utah showed a wide majority favoring a similar law.

The Salt Lake City Chamber of Commerce was alarmed. It had noted a sharp uptick in convention business after Arizona passed its law and conventions there were canceled as the state became the target of boycotts. It didn't want Utah's image to go the way of its southern neighbor.

"There's a core of decency and goodness and friendliness here," Jason Mathis, the chamber's executive director, said of Utah. "We wanted something that was short and sweet and would remind people of the better angels of their nature."

The chamber and other business and civic groups wrote a document they called the "Utah Compact." It called for a focus on families and empathy in immigration policy, and using police to fight crime rather than enforce immigration laws. The Mormon Church endorsed the document.
Quote:
Arizona requires police to check the immigration status of people stopped for any violation — including infractions such as jaywalking — if police suspect they are illegal immigrants. Utah's law applies only to people arrested for felonies and serious misdemeanors.

Under the guest-worker law, anyone who worked in Utah before May of this year — and their immediate family — can receive documents if they pass a background check and pay a fine of up to $2,500 if they entered the country illegally. They will, however, still be subject to possible deportation by federal immigration agents. A statewide poll last month found 71% support for the law's provisions.

Sandstrom said church lobbyists spent the final week of the legislative session at the Capitol pushing for the law. H. David Burton, the church's presiding bishop, stood by Herbert as the governor signed the measure last week, along with Sandstrom's bill.

"If the church had been silent, the [guest-worker] bill wouldn't have passed," Sandstrom said. "It's an absolute tragedy for the state of Utah."
So this is violating federal law, but the exact opposite way that the Arizona law did. Let's see what happens.
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Old 03-22-11, 02:20 AM   #37
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Re: One & Only Illegal Immigration Thread: Part IX

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Originally Posted by fujishig View Post
So by your sarcasm, are you agreeing with this softening of the LAPD's policy? Here's another question: How many of these citations actually get paid, and how many of these unlicensed drivers will actually stop driving and not become repeat offenders?
I don't know! please tell us! please please please tell us!
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Old 03-22-11, 02:22 AM   #38
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Re: One & Only Illegal Immigration Thread: Part IX

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Originally Posted by fujishig View Post
Mormons to Illegal Immigrants: Come over to Utah!
(and before people accuse me of stereotyping all of Utah as being Mormon, the article mentions the Mormon church multiple times as pushing for this. And Utah is a Red state...):

http://www.latimes.com/news/nationwo...,5307414.story

Excerpts:





So this is violating federal law, but the exact opposite way that the Arizona law did. Let's see what happens.
Well, if everything you assume about illegals is true... then a dramatic increase in crime, the state will go bankrupt because its social services will be overwhelmed, schools will get overcrowded, and unemployment will skyrocket.
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Old 03-22-11, 10:09 AM   #39
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Re: One & Only Illegal Immigration Thread: Part IX

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Originally Posted by Superboy View Post
I don't know! please tell us! please please please tell us!
Thanks for contributing as always!
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Old 03-22-11, 11:31 AM   #40
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Re: One & Only Illegal Immigration Thread: Part IX

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Originally Posted by Superboy View Post
Well, if everything you assume about illegals is true... then a dramatic increase in crime, the state will go bankrupt because its social services will be overwhelmed, schools will get overcrowded, and unemployment will skyrocket.
Don't be silly, even illegals don't want to live in Utah.
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Old 03-22-11, 07:43 PM   #41
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Re: One & Only Illegal Immigration Thread: Part IX

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Originally Posted by Superboy View Post
Well, if everything you assume about illegals is true... then a dramatic increase in crime, the state will go bankrupt because its social services will be overwhelmed, schools will get overcrowded, and unemployment will skyrocket.
Are there that many illegal immigrants in Utah?
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Old 03-22-11, 07:46 PM   #42
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Re: One & Only Illegal Immigration Thread: Part IX

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Originally Posted by brayzie View Post
Are there that many illegal immigrants in Utah?
There will be. Those bastards will create anchor babies with like nine wives at once!
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Old 03-22-11, 08:03 PM   #43
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Re: One & Only Illegal Immigration Thread: Part IX

I needed that laugh, thanks.
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Old 03-23-11, 12:21 AM   #44
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Re: One & Only Illegal Immigration Thread: Part IX

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Originally Posted by fujishig View Post
Thanks for contributing as always!
You're welcome. Now are you going to answer your own question? Unless it was a rhetorical question.
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Old 03-23-11, 12:39 AM   #45
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Re: One & Only Illegal Immigration Thread: Part IX

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Originally Posted by Mabuse View Post
Regarding the impounding of cars at DUI checkpoints article:

I'm actuall a person who supports strict enforcement of driving laws. Drivers who do not have a drivers license should have their cars impounded. It's that fucking simple. You need three things to drive a car: License, registration, insurance. If you haven't paid for all three, fuck you and the car you rode in on.

I'm a fully employed, fully licensed, tax paying, hard working citizen. They'd impound my car in a heartbeat.
This is really what confounds me about illegal immigrant laws. I know where you're coming from because i'm in the same boat and I agree with you. I'm all for amnesty, but this is just STUPID. If there were a way to hold them financially accountable, I would be all for allowing them to drive. But putting the safety of other drivers on the road at personal and financial risk is unacceptable. A friend of mine went through this when her car was totalled by an illegal immigrant. She had to pay $16,000 out of pocket to cover the accident.
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Old 03-23-11, 08:00 AM   #46
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Re: One & Only Illegal Immigration Thread: Part IX

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Originally Posted by brayzie View Post
Are there that many illegal immigrants in Utah?
Yes
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Old 04-12-11, 08:50 AM   #47
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Re: One & Only Illegal Immigration Thread: Part IX

Looks like the Arizona law was struck down by the Ninth Circuit Court:

Arizona immigration law loses in court
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Old 04-12-11, 09:28 AM   #48
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Re: One & Only Illegal Immigration Thread: Part IX

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Looks like the Arizona law was struck down by the Ninth Circuit Court:

Arizona immigration law loses in court
Sort of. It affirmed the TRO issued by the district court that barred AZ from enforcing 4 provisions of SB1070. Exactly what I expected.
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Old 04-12-11, 09:58 AM   #49
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Re: One & Only Illegal Immigration Thread: Part IX

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Sort of. It affirmed the TRO issued by the district court that barred AZ from enforcing 4 provisions of SB1070. Exactly what I expected.
Yeah, I wasn't all that precise. I ran across the article when I was looking for the Liverpool-Manchester City minute-by-minute commentary...
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Old 05-09-11, 03:28 PM   #50
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Re: One & Only Illegal Immigration Thread: Part IX

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Sort of. It affirmed the TRO issued by the district court that barred AZ from enforcing 4 provisions of SB1070. Exactly what I expected.
AZ/Gov. Brewer going for SCt review instead of an appeal before the whole Circuit. Not a surprise. No way they'd get a reversal en banc. I'm very skeptical of them finding 4 votes to grant cert for SCt review.
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