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Serious - Do you think George W Bush ever ordered any Off the Grid Torture/Assasinati

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Serious - Do you think George W Bush ever ordered any Off the Grid Torture/Assasinati

Old 04-27-10, 01:31 PM
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Serious - Do you think George W Bush ever ordered any Off the Grid Torture/Assasinati

Serious question after watching this last episode of 24

Obama hasn't been in power long enough but feel free to answer the question relating to him

But with George W Bush, do you think during his time in office, he ever ordered any off the grid torture or assassinations

Honest, serious question
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Old 04-27-10, 01:37 PM
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Re: Serious - Do you think George W Bush ever ordered any Off the Grid Torture/Assasi

No.
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Old 04-27-10, 01:46 PM
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Re: Serious - Do you think George W Bush ever ordered any Off the Grid Torture/Assasi

I know he ordered NSA agents to break into my house every night and conduct experiments on my brain. Does that count?
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Old 04-27-10, 01:47 PM
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Re: Serious - Do you think George W Bush ever ordered any Off the Grid Torture/Assasi

What's "off the grid"?

I know the current president is targeting an American currently in Pakistan for assassination by predator missiles. Is that considered "off the grid"?

http://www.salon.com/news/opinion/gl...ons/index.html

I guess holding him in Gitmo would be considered unconscionable and/or illegal.
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Old 04-27-10, 01:54 PM
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Re: Serious - Do you think George W Bush ever ordered any Off the Grid Torture/Assasi

No but maybe while Bush was sucking his thumb, Cheney did.
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Old 04-27-10, 01:59 PM
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Re: Serious - Do you think George W Bush ever ordered any Off the Grid Torture/Assasi

Depends how you define "off the grid". Dan Carlin talks about this in his podcast, Episode 174 (the current one): http://www.dancarlin.com/disp.php/cs

Basically the CIA called the US citizen a terrorist and he is targeted for assassination. Maybe he really is a bad guy, but who is double checking the CIA's decision to call him a terrorist?

Last edited by Heat; 04-27-10 at 02:07 PM.
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Old 04-27-10, 02:03 PM
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Re: Serious - Do you think George W Bush ever ordered any Off the Grid Torture/Assasi

the president can't just order anyone to do this stuff. it all has to go through legal review. even putting all the Narus servers at the internet routing centers had to be approved
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Old 04-27-10, 02:06 PM
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Re: Serious - Do you think George W Bush ever ordered any Off the Grid Torture/Assasi

Originally Posted by Heat View Post
Depends how you define "off the grid". If Obama can target a US Citizen for assassination overseas because somebody in the CIA called him a terrorist, what makes you think that George W. Bush didn't do the same thing?
Maybe because we would have heard if a U.S. citizen were assassinated that way? Maybe not. Was there any suspicion of a U.S. citizen being killed by our government during Bush's term?

But I suppose Bush and Cheney were so machiavellian they could get terrorists to kill U.S. citizens, such as Daniel Pearl, for them instead.
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Old 04-27-10, 02:57 PM
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Re: Serious - Do you think George W Bush ever ordered any Off the Grid Torture/Assasi

Based on my knowledge gained from watching movies, I would have to say it is highly likely.
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Old 04-27-10, 03:21 PM
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Re: Serious - Do you think George W Bush ever ordered any Off the Grid Torture/Assasi

Originally Posted by X View Post
What's "off the grid"?

I know the current president is targeting an American currently in Pakistan for assassination by predator missiles. Is that considered "off the grid"?

http://www.salon.com/news/opinion/gl...ons/index.html

I guess holding him in Gitmo would be considered unconscionable and/or illegal.
Just to be technical, Predator is the plane, the missiles are Hellfires.

Bush and Obama have approved Predator hunts for quite a few terrorists.
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Old 04-27-10, 03:35 PM
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Re: Serious - Do you think George W Bush ever ordered any Off the Grid Torture/Assasi

Originally Posted by Lemmy View Post
Good. Fuck the traitor. With a missile right up his ass...
The problem is... who decides that he is a traitor? Are we talking about one guy at the CIA, a committee, a field operative, etc? Who double checks to make sure that the guy really is a traitor and the CIA isn't twisting the definition for whatever reason?
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Old 04-27-10, 03:44 PM
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Re: Serious - Do you think George W Bush ever ordered any Off the Grid Torture/Assasi

Originally Posted by OldDude View Post
Just to be technical, Predator is the plane, the missiles are Hellfires.

Bush and Obama have approved Predator hunts for quite a few terrorists.
Call of Duty lied to me.
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Old 04-27-10, 03:45 PM
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Re: Serious - Do you think George W Bush ever ordered any Off the Grid Torture/Assasi

Originally Posted by OldDude View Post
Just to be technical, Predator is the plane, the missiles are Hellfires.
Obviously. As opposed to cruise, ballistic, etc., that succinctly described what kind of platform and missile it is that we're using to target people in Pakistan.
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Old 04-27-10, 07:25 PM
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Re: Serious - Do you think George W Bush ever ordered any Off the Grid Torture/Assasi

Does torture by proxy count? It's well documented that people captured by US forces were turned over to nasty governments who regularly use torture.
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Old 04-28-10, 12:10 AM
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Re: Serious - Do you think George W Bush ever ordered any Off the Grid Torture/Assasi

Would you consider extraordinary rendition to be evidence of off the grid torture?

I guess it depends on your definition of torture or if you like, "enhanced interrogation"
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Old 04-28-10, 09:38 AM
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Re: Serious - Do you think George W Bush ever ordered any Off the Grid Torture/Assasi

Originally Posted by Lemmy View Post
If he's a U.S. citizen in an enemy country, and he's allowed to walk around freely, and is not a double agent of some kind, he needs to go. Harshly. As harshly as can be "arranged".
You may've noticed that we're at war with an NGO, not a country. Pakistan, Yemen, and Saudi Arabia are all nominally on good terms with us, and American citizens can gain entry to them.

...and that's enough for me. I say kill him ASAP.
Because the government is infallible.
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Old 04-28-10, 09:41 AM
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Re: Serious - Do you think George W Bush ever ordered any Off the Grid Torture/Assasi

Originally Posted by Sean O'Hara View Post
Because the government is infallible.
Please. Name one major war our infallible government has gotten us into in the past 10 years, other than Iraq and Afghanistan.
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Old 04-28-10, 10:16 AM
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Re: Serious - Do you think George W Bush ever ordered any Off the Grid Torture/Assasi

As mentioned by others, I'm not sure what this "off the grid" comment means. Can you expand on that? We hit some baddies with UAVs and think we shipped some folks off to countries that don't have a lot of rules against torture. Does that count for your definition? I really don't know.
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