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SEALs charged in alleged assault of detainee

Old 12-01-09, 02:20 PM
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SEALs charged in alleged assault of detainee

http://www.navytimes.com/news/2009/1...arged_112409w/
SEALs charged in alleged assault of detainee

By Gidget Fuentes - Staff writer
Posted : Tuesday Nov 24, 2009 17:41:46 EST

SAN DIEGO — Three Navy SEALs are facing court-martial for allegedly assaulting and mishandling a detainee they captured in Iraq in September, military officials said.

The three SEALs — Special Warfare Operators 2nd Class Matthew McCabe and Jonathan Keefe, and SO1 Julio Huertas — will be arraigned Dec. 7 in a military court in Norfolk, Va., said Army Lt. Col. Holly Silkman, a spokeswoman with U.S. Special Operations Command Central.

McCabe is charged with one count each of assault of the detainee, dereliction of duty and making a false official statement, Silkman said. Officials accuse McCabe of “willfully failing to safeguard a detainee,” Silkman said.

Keefe is charge with one count each of dereliction of duty and false official statement; Huertas is accused of dereliction of duty, false official statement and impeding an investigation, she said.

Army Maj. Gen. Charles Cleveland, SOCCent commander, preferred the charges against the SEALs and will serve as the convening authority as the cases proceed to court-martial, tentatively scheduled for mid-January, Silkman said.

None of the SEALs is confined, she added.

The alleged incident happened in Iraq on or about Sept. 1, Silkman said. “The one thing I can’t talk about is this alleged victim,” she said.

No other details about the alleged incident were immediately available.

The SEALs have been assigned military attorneys to defend them in the cases, which will be tried separately as special courts-martial.

One defense attorney said they had refused to accept nonjudicial punishment, administrative actions that some in the military may consider as a admission of guilt.

Neal Puckett, a defense attorney who is representing McCabe, said the SEALs are being essentially charged for allegedly giving the detainee “a punch in the gut.”

They are expected to plead not guilty when they appear at their arraignment. “They are all together and they all maintain that they are innocent of these charges,” said Puckett, a retired Marine Corps lieutenant colonel and judge advocate.

The SEALs were on the tail-end of their deployment to Iraq when the alleged incident happened, he said.

Puckett offered no details about the alleged incident, but said that “in a combat environment, the handling of a detainee … these things happen all the time and can easily be justified as maintaining [control of] a detainee.”

McCabe’s special court-martial is slated to begin Jan. 19, he said.

Huertas, 28, is originally from Blue Island, Ill., and enlisted in 1999. He has served in special warfare units since 2002. He has an Iraq Campaign Medal and was advanced in June 2006, Navy records show.

McCabe, 24 is originally from Perrysburg, Ohio, and enlisted in 2003. He served on the Amphibious Assault Ship Belleau Wood before training in special warfare. He was advanced in September 2007, Navy records show.

Keefe, 25, is originally from Yorktown, Va., and enlisted in 2006. He began SEAL training the same year, Navy records show. He was last advanced in June 2008.

Cmdr. Greg Geisen, a Naval Special Warfare Command spokesman in Coronado, Calif., referred all questions about the charges to SOCCent.

The charges were first reported by Fox News, which posted a story on its Web site Tuesday, saying the charges surround the SEALs’ handling of Ahmed Hashim Abed, who is believed to be connected to the 2004 slaying of four U.S. security contractors in Fallujah.
Anyone heard about this? The only reason I caught it was a congressman mentioned it in their morning 1 min. speeches. All I can say is WTF??? Maybe there is more to it than this, but seriously WTF... are we trying to win these wars or what
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Old 12-01-09, 02:27 PM
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Re: SEALs charged in alleged assault of detainee

Originally Posted by nemein View Post
http://www.navytimes.com/news/2009/1...arged_112409w/


Anyone heard about this? The only reason I caught it was a congressman mentioned it in their morning 1 min. speeches. All I can say is WTF??? Maybe there is more to it than this, but seriously WTF... are we trying to win these wars or what
There's not really enough info in the article to know what happened, or even what allegedly happened. Certainly, we are trying to win the war, but that does not mean that anything a Navy SEAL does to an Iraqi detainee is fair game.
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Old 12-01-09, 02:31 PM
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Re: SEALs charged in alleged assault of detainee

Here's what "essentially" "allegedly" happened (whatever that means)

Neal Puckett, a defense attorney who is representing McCabe, said the SEALs are being essentially charged for allegedly giving the detainee “a punch in the gut.”
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Old 12-01-09, 02:45 PM
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Re: SEALs charged in alleged assault of detainee

Originally Posted by JasonF View Post
There's not really enough info in the article to know what happened, or even what allegedly happened. Certainly, we are trying to win the war, but that does not mean that anything a Navy SEAL does to an Iraqi detainee is fair game.
Ditto for the CIA and FBI.

Some day we do plan to get tough on detainees, though. Just as soon as we make sure no one wants to work in our military or intelligence.
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Old 12-01-09, 02:48 PM
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Re: SEALs charged in alleged assault of detainee

It's difficult for a person who has never been in combat to understand why some people who are in combat act in the way they do.

I'm not condoning what they did.
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Old 12-01-09, 05:59 PM
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Re: SEALs charged in alleged assault of detainee

I suspect in the future more detainees will not be taken alive. Oops, he didn't make it.

Works better when there's only one side of the story.

Bad for intelligence, good for the men.

This PC shit is fucking ridiculous, we're a nation that has essentially turned into a bunch of pussies.

This has been a hot story on many forums for a few days.
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Old 12-01-09, 07:02 PM
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Re: SEALs charged in alleged assault of detainee

Originally Posted by Dr Mabuse View Post
This PC shit is fucking ridiculous, we're a nation that has essentially turned into a bunch of pussies.
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Old 12-01-09, 07:47 PM
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Re: SEALs charged in alleged assault of detainee

Originally Posted by Dr Mabuse View Post
This PC shit is fucking ridiculous, we're a nation that has essentially turned into a bunch of pussies.
That is the truth.
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Old 12-01-09, 10:03 PM
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Re: SEALs charged in alleged assault of detainee

Originally Posted by Dr Mabuse View Post
This PC shit is fucking ridiculous, we're a nation that has essentially turned into a bunch of pussies.

I wish I could get people like you to defend the police. We need more advocates for bringing back tactics that work to deter crime.
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Old 12-01-09, 10:43 PM
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Re: SEALs charged in alleged assault of detainee

Originally Posted by DeputyDave View Post
I wish I could get people like you to defend the police. We need more advocates for bringing back tactics that work to deter crime.
Jon Burge: American Hero!
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Old 12-01-09, 10:46 PM
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Re: SEALs charged in alleged assault of detainee

Being a pussy only works if everyone agrees to be one. That's the tough part.
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Old 12-01-09, 10:54 PM
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Re: SEALs charged in alleged assault of detainee

France has got a serious headstart on that one. We need to catch up!
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Old 12-02-09, 12:01 AM
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Re: SEALs charged in alleged assault of detainee

This is when having a history of abusing and torturing detainees comes back to bite you in the ass...
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Old 12-02-09, 01:06 AM
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Re: SEALs charged in alleged assault of detainee

Originally Posted by DeputyDave View Post
I wish I could get people like you to defend the police. We need more advocates for bringing back tactics that work to deter crime.
Sprint is doing plenty to help you guys already with their easy to use portal to track people with virtually no oversight, you don't need any more help..

This case here though is such a waste of time & resources.
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Old 12-02-09, 02:10 AM
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Re: SEALs charged in alleged assault of detainee

Originally Posted by eXcentris View Post
This is when having a history of abusing and torturing detainees comes back to bite you in the ass...
Unfortunately, I think going back to the Clinton era style where we refused to deal with "unsavory" types in gathering intel also back to bite you in the ass. Don't get me wrong, as I don't blame Clinton. I believe we were collectively naive to what types of things we were in for. But now that we know, I am generally okay with what we consider to be torture...even if that is a punch to the gut. The horror.
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Old 12-02-09, 03:29 AM
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Re: SEALs charged in alleged assault of detainee

Originally Posted by Dr Mabuse View Post
This PC shit is fucking ridiculous, we're a nation that has essentially turned into a bunch of pussies.
Agreed. We're waging wars over men with box cutters. It doesn't get more pussy than that.
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Old 12-02-09, 07:26 AM
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Re: SEALs charged in alleged assault of detainee

Well- our enemy(ies) do have a few more sophisticated weapons other than box cutters.
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Old 12-02-09, 09:33 AM
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Re: SEALs charged in alleged assault of detainee

Originally Posted by Brack View Post
Agreed. We're waging wars over men with box cutters. It doesn't get more pussy than that.
You should've said 'waging wars over amateur pilots'. Men with box cutters still gives the impression that some of these "terrorists" might actually be able to hurt someone.
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Old 12-02-09, 11:34 AM
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Re: SEALs charged in alleged assault of detainee

Originally Posted by Brack View Post
Agreed. We're waging wars over men with box cutters. It doesn't get more pussy than that.
Symbolism over substance. It isn't what they have done, it is how they can be portrayed. Shocking.
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Old 12-02-09, 01:00 PM
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Re: SEALs charged in alleged assault of detainee

If the bad guys get a hold of Pakistani nuclear weapons they most likely could hurt a few someones.

Not only that - they would be in a hell of a good bargaining position.
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Old 12-02-09, 02:20 PM
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Re: SEALs charged in alleged assault of detainee

Originally Posted by maxfisher View Post
You should've said 'waging wars over amateur pilots'. Men with box cutters still gives the impression that some of these "terrorists" might actually be able to hurt someone.
Spending billions, perhaps trillions now, over the fear of either is pussy behavior.
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Old 12-02-09, 02:24 PM
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Re: SEALs charged in alleged assault of detainee

Originally Posted by classicman2 View Post
If the bad guys get a hold of Pakistani nuclear weapons they most likely could hurt a few someones.

Not only that - they would be in a hell of a good bargaining position.
So this requires a large number of troops to prevent something like this from happening? It justifies a war?
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Old 12-02-09, 02:33 PM
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Re: SEALs charged in alleged assault of detainee

Originally Posted by Brack View Post
So this requires a large number of troops to prevent something like this from happening? It justifies a war?
I think it justifies war to stop someoen from using a nuclear weapon.

although, i'm not sure that will happen
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Old 12-02-09, 02:46 PM
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Re: SEALs charged in alleged assault of detainee

Originally Posted by Venusian View Post
I think it justifies war to stop someoen from using a nuclear weapon.

although, i'm not sure that will happen
I agree with you.

I think we're getting close to a hostile nuclear detonation, and everyone is more worried about 'being/playing nice and PC' than they are about addressing it. A global problem that's been growing, and getting more poisonous and dangerous for decades is getting close to having nuclear capabilities.
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Old 12-02-09, 03:33 PM
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Re: SEALs charged in alleged assault of detainee

Originally Posted by Dr Mabuse View Post
I agree with you.

I think we're getting close to a hostile nuclear detonation, and everyone is more worried about 'being/playing nice and PC' than they are about addressing it. A global problem that's been growing, and getting more poisonous and dangerous for decades is getting close to having nuclear capabilities.
And yet the only country that has actually used such weapons has been...
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