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Iran test fires short range nuclear missiles

Old 09-27-09, 08:30 AM
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Iran test fires short range nuclear missiles

By NASSER KARIMI, Associated Press Writer – 7 mins ago
TEHRAN – Iran said it successfully test-fired short-range missiles during military drills Sunday by the elite Revolutionary Guard, a show of force days after the U.S. warned Tehran over a newly revealed underground nuclear facility it was secretly constructing.
Gen. Hossein Salami, head of the Revolutionary Guard Air Force, said Iran also tested a multiple missile launcher for the first time. The official English-language Press TV showed pictures of at least two missiles being fired simultaneously and said they were from Sunday's drill in a central Iran desert. In the clip, men could be heard shouting "Allahu Akbar" as the missiles were launched.
"The message of the war game for some arrogant countries which intend to intimidate is that we are able to give a proper, strong answer to their hostility quickly," state television quoted Salami as saying. He said the missiles successfully hit their targets.
The powerful Revolutionary Guard controls Iran's missile program.
The tests came two days after the U.S. and its allies disclosed that Iran had been secretly developing a previously unknown underground uranium enrichment facility and warned the country it must open the nuclear site to international inspection or face harsher international sanctions. The drill was planned in advance of that disclosure.
The newly revealed nuclear site in the arid mountains near the holy city of Qom is believed to be inside a heavily guarded, underground facility belonging to the Revolutionary Guard, according to a document sent by President Barack Obama's administration to lawmakers.
After the strong condemnations from the U.S. and its allies, Iran said Saturday it will allow U.N. nuclear inspectors to examine the site.
Nuclear experts said the details that have emerged about the site and the fact it was being developed secretly are strong indications that Iran's nuclear program is not only for peaceful purposes, as the country has long maintained.
By U.S. estimates, Iran is one to five years away from having a nuclear weapons capability, although U.S. intelligence also believes that Iranian leaders have not yet made the decision to build a weapon.
Iran also is developing a long-range ballistic missile that could carry a nuclear warhead, but the administration said last week that it believes that effort has been slowed. That assessment paved the way for Obama's decision to shelve the Bush administration's plan for a missile shield in Europe, which was aimed at defending against Iranian ballistic missiles.
Salami said Iran would test medium-range Shahab-1 and Shahab-2 missiles on Sunday night and long-range Shahab-3 missiles on Monday, during the military drill set to last several days.
Salami said Fateh, Tondar and Zelzal missiles were test fired on Sunday, but did not give specifics on range or other details. All are short-range, surface-to-surface missiles.
He told reporters Iran had reduced the missiles and their ranges and enhanced their speed and precision so they could be used in quick, short-range engagements. He also said they are now able to be launched from positions that are not as easy to hit.
He said the current missile tests and military drills are indications of Iran's resolve to defend its national values and part of a strategy of deterrence and containment of missile threats.
Iran has had the solid-fuel Fateh missile, with a range of 120 miles (193 kilometers), for several years. Fateh means conqueror in Farsi and Arabic. It also has the solid-fueled, Chinese-made CSS 8, also called the Tondar 69, according to the Wisconsin Project on Nuclear Arms Control, a private group that seeks to stop the spread of weapons of mass destruction. The Tondar, which means thunder, has a range of about 93 miles (150 kilometers.)
Iran has previously tested the Zelzal missile, versions of which have ranges of 130-185 miles (210-200 kilometers. In July 2006, Israeli military officials said their jets had destroyed a missile in Lebanon named Zelzal, which they said Hezbollah had received from Iran and could reach Tel Aviv. Zelzal means earthquake.
Iran's last known missile tests were in May when it fired its longest-range solid-fuel missile, Sajjil-2. Tehran said the two-stage surface-to-surface missile has a range of about 1,200 miles (1,900 kilometers) — capable of striking Israel, U.S. Mideast bases and Europe.
The revelation of Iran's secret site has given greater urgency to a key meeting on Thursday in Geneva between Iran and six major powers trying to stop its suspected nuclear weapons program.
The U.S. and its partners plan to tell Tehran at the meeting that it must provide "unfettered access" for the International Atomic Energy Agency, the U.N. nuclear watchdog, within weeks.
The facility is Iran's second uranium-enrichment site working to produce the fuel that could eventually be used in a nuclear weapon.
A close aide to Supreme Leader Ayatollah Ali Khamenei said Saturday the site will be operational soon and would pose a threat to those who oppose Iran.
"This new facility, God willing, will become operational soon and will blind the eyes of the enemies," Mohammad Mohammadi Golpayegani told the semi-official Fars news agency.
Evidence of the clandestine facility was presented Friday by Obama, British Prime Minister Gordon Brown and French President Nicolas Sarkozy at the G-20 economic summit in Pittsburgh. On Saturday, Obama offered Iran "a serious, meaningful dialogue" over its disputed nuclear program, while warning Tehran of grave consequences from a united global front.
Israeli Foreign Minister Avigdor Lieberman said Saturday the revelation was firm proof Iran was seeking nuclear weapons.
Israel considers Iran a strategic threat with its nuclear program, missile development and repeated calls by President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad for Israel's destruction. It has not ruled out a pre-emptive strike on Iran's nuclear sites.
In 1981, Israeli warplanes bombed Iraq's Osirak nuclear reaction and in 2007, Israel bombed a site in Syria that the U.S. said was a nearly finished nuclear reactor built with North Korean help that was configured to produce plutonium — one of the substances used in nuclear warheads.
Israel's Foreign Ministry had no immediate comment on the missile tests.
Vice President Ali Akbar Salehi, who heads Iran's nuclear program, said Saturday that U.N. nuclear inspectors could visit the nuclear site but did not provide a timeframe. On Sunday, he told Press TV Iran and the IAEA would work out the timing of the inspection.
The small-scale site is meant to house no more than 3,000 centrifuges — much less than the 8,000 machines at Natanz, Iran's known industrial-scale enrichment facility, but they could still potentially help create bomb-making material.
Experts have estimated that Iran's current number of centrifuges could enrich enough uranium for a bomb in as little as a year. Washington has been pushing for heavier sanctions if Iran does not agree to end enrichment.
Saw this as breaking news on the Today Show, as i'm shocked there isn't a thread yet
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Old 09-27-09, 09:16 AM
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Re: Iran test fires short range nuclear missiles

Are you really shocked, or just a little bit surprised?

In reality - it means very little. Now when they test fire short range missiles with a nuclear warhead, that will mean something.
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Old 09-27-09, 09:21 AM
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Re: Iran test fires short range nuclear missiles

Bush 2.0 needs to invade Iran before it's too late.

Last edited by mhg83; 09-27-09 at 10:22 AM.
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Old 09-27-09, 09:39 AM
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Re: Iran test fires short range nuclear missiles

That's exactly what we don't need.

I hope we learned our lesson in Iraq about intervention.

If you think Iraq was a quagmire - try Iran.
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Old 09-27-09, 10:17 AM
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Re: Iran test fires short range nuclear missiles

"If an injury has to be done to a man it should be so severe that his vengeance need not be feared." - Niccolo Machiavelli

"He must walk warily and fearlessly, and while he should never brawl if he can avoid it, he must be ready to hit hard if the need arises. Let him remember ... that the unforgivable crime is soft hitting. Do not hit at all if it can be avoided; but never hit softly." - Theodore Roosevelt

We have forgotten this.

We have tried hitting soft two times recently and have not learned our lesson.
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Old 09-27-09, 10:21 AM
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Re: Iran test fires short range nuclear missiles

Originally Posted by Dr Mabuse View Post
We have forgotten this.

We have tried hitting soft two times recently and have not learned our lesson.
So the answer is to turn Iran into a sheet of glass?
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Old 09-27-09, 10:28 AM
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Re: Iran test fires short range nuclear missiles

There is a question whether we have 40,000 troops to 'spare' in Afghanistan.

How in the hell are we going to come up with 500,000+ in Iran?
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Old 09-27-09, 10:31 AM
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Re: Iran test fires short range nuclear missiles

Originally Posted by VinVega View Post
So the answer is to turn Iran into a sheet of glass?
That would not be necessary.

The US can hit so much harder than... I think many in this country realize, much less the world.

If we decided to hit hard in Afghanistan we could clear that up in rather quick work too.

The consequences of hitting soft are difficult for many people to understand I think. Not you personally maybe, I mean that generally.
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Old 09-27-09, 10:34 AM
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Re: Iran test fires short range nuclear missiles

Originally Posted by classicman2 View Post
There is a question whether we have 40,000 troops to 'spare' in Afghanistan.

How in the hell are we going to come up with 500,000+ in Iran?
What will happen with a nuclear attack in the middle east do you think?

Will 500,000 troops even be in the top ten concerns at that point?

The perspective on things like this in the US has become so skewed, ideological, and disconnected from the painfully clear lesson of history that are repeated over and over again for millenia... it's really troubling to see it so soon after WW2, but it's here.
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Old 09-27-09, 10:40 AM
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Re: Iran test fires short range nuclear missiles

Do you seriously believe that he leaders in Iran are going to use nuclear weapons?

Again - much of what they say is for home consumption. And, they want to be a nuclear power for the same reason that other countries want to be a nuclear power - become a larger player in the region.

WWII or any previous war is a bad example. Nuclear weapons were in one country's hands - ours. That's not so today.
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Old 09-27-09, 10:47 AM
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Re: Iran test fires short range nuclear missiles

I understand why you didn't want to answer/address the question.

WW2 is directly applicable and comparable. Your choosing to try to artificially narrow down the lesson there doesn't change that.
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Old 09-27-09, 10:52 AM
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Re: Iran test fires short range nuclear missiles

There is currently no country brave enough to stop Iran except Israel. And when Israel feels it is time to act - they will.

The UN can write them more strongly worded letters though - I'm sure that will help about as well as it has so far.

As far as the US getting involved. Our current president doesn't have the belly for it IMO.
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Old 09-27-09, 10:56 AM
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Re: Iran test fires short range nuclear missiles

You fail to realize it's a different world we live in now than it was in WWII.

Hiroshima changed the world - militarily and politically.

What do you want to do - nuke Iran? Or are you under the illusion that we can accomplish the 'goal' (whatever that is) by using 'surgical air strikes?'

There is considerable unrest and opposition to he government in Iran. A U.S. air strike, or worse, an invasion, would tend to unite the people of Iran. That I don't believe would be the smart thing to do.

I'm afraid we're going to have to accept the reality -the nuclear club is going to grow.
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Old 09-27-09, 10:57 AM
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Re: Iran test fires short range nuclear missiles

Originally Posted by General Zod View Post
There is currently no country brave enough to stop Iran except Israel. And when Israel feels it is time to act - they will.

The UN can write them more strongly worded letters though - I'm sure that will help about as well as it has so far.

As far as the US getting involved. Our current president doesn't have the belly for it IMO.
How in the hell is Israel going to stop Iran?
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Old 09-27-09, 11:03 AM
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Re: Iran test fires short range nuclear missiles

Originally Posted by classicman2 View Post
How in the hell is Israel going to stop Iran?
They can take out Qom like they did Osirak. It was all over in 100 seconds.
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Old 09-27-09, 11:10 AM
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Re: Iran test fires short range nuclear missiles

Ah - if it was only that easy.

What we are probably going to have to do is develop a new cold war type strategy. Tell Iran, NK, etc. just how the cow ate the cabbage - as we did with the USSR in the cold war.
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Old 09-27-09, 11:16 AM
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Re: Iran test fires short range nuclear missiles

Originally Posted by classicman2 View Post
You fail to realize it's a different world we live in now than it was in WWII.
It's the same world as it was 2000 years ago. Man is the same, and so is war. Thinking it's not? Well that's one of the most common ways 'modern'(from any era) men delude themselves about things.

Originally Posted by classicman2 View Post
What do you want to do - nuke Iran? Or are you under the illusion that we can accomplish the 'goal' (whatever that is) by using 'surgical air strikes?'
I see you didn't read my posts above?

Obviously you didn't get my point about not being a pansy and half-assing it when it comes time for war. That or you didn't read that post either.

Originally Posted by classicman2 View Post
There is considerable unrest and opposition to he government in Iran. A U.S. air strike, or worse, an invasion, would tend to unite the people of Iran. That I don't believe would be the smart thing to do.

I'm afraid we're going to have to accept the reality -the nuclear club is going to grow.
This is the folly of the 'modern' mind. Forget history and pretend there is something new under the sun.

There isn't.

Sitting back and letting a hostile theocracy(that is actively attacking and killing US troops already and destabilizing the region also) obtain a nuclear weapon is the height of foolishness.
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Old 09-27-09, 11:23 AM
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Re: Iran test fires short range nuclear missiles

You didn't answer the question. Do you want to nuke Iran? Or do you want to invade Iran?

We allowed the Soviet Union to obtain a nuclear weapon without nuking or invading.

As I said in #16 we made it quite clear to the soviets what we would do if they did certain things. It worked. We can make it quite clear to Iran & North Korea what we will do if they do certain things.

It's called 'deterrent.'

We don't have the manpower to launch an invasion against Iran. That is the only way to insure that you destroy their nuclear facilities. And, even then, you may not get them all. Should we follow that course - you talk about destabilzation - you'll really distabilize one of the most vital areas in the world with that type of action.
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Old 09-27-09, 11:24 AM
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Re: Iran test fires short range nuclear missiles

Originally Posted by Dr Mabuse View Post
It's the same world as it was 2000 years ago. Man is the same, and so is war. Thinking it's not? Well that's one of the most common ways 'modern'(from any era) men delude themselves about things.
Human nature is the same. Tactics and strategy are not. If you disagree, try invading Rome by bringing a pack of elephants across the Alps and see how far you get. Hell, try replicating Omaha Beach -- a tactic that worked a mere 65 years ago -- against an opponent with access to satellite imaging technology and see haw far you get.
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Old 09-27-09, 11:26 AM
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Re: Iran test fires short range nuclear missiles

Originally Posted by classicman2 View Post
We allowed the Soviet Union to obtain a nuclear weapon without nuking or invading.
I don't think we were watching them develop them like we are watching Iran.
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Old 09-27-09, 11:36 AM
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Re: Iran test fires short range nuclear missiles

Originally Posted by classicman2 View Post
That's exactly what we don't need.

I hope we learned our lesson in Iraq about intervention.

If you think Iraq was a quagmire - try Iran.
Agreed. We should just nuke them instead.
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Old 09-27-09, 11:36 AM
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Re: Iran test fires short range nuclear missiles

Originally Posted by classicman2 View Post
You didn't answer the question. Do you want to nuke Iran? Or do you want to invade Iran?
Again, you didn't read my posts above.
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Old 09-27-09, 11:39 AM
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Re: Iran test fires short range nuclear missiles

Again - what does 'hitting harder' mean?

Does that mean a nuclear attack?

What?
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Old 09-27-09, 11:40 AM
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Re: Iran test fires short range nuclear missiles

Originally Posted by Bandoman View Post
Agreed. We should just nuke them instead.
With their own nuke!
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Old 09-27-09, 11:42 AM
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Re: Iran test fires short range nuclear missiles

The last thing we want to do is unite the Iranian people.

What some have proposed would go a long way in doing that.
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