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If you disagree with Obama - you are racist.

Old 09-03-09, 11:35 AM
  #251  
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Re: If you disagree with Obama - you are racist.

Originally Posted by Brack View Post
Millionaires? $2k of $20k a year? How long is life expectancy now?
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Old 09-03-09, 11:50 AM
  #252  
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Re: If you disagree with Obama - you are racist.

Originally Posted by Brack View Post
Millionaires? $2k of $20k a year? How long is life expectancy now?
http://www.moneychimp.com/calculator...calculator.htm

$2k initially, $2k annually for 45 years (20 - 65) only needs 8 - 9% annually to hit $1M. Granted we aren't talking about saving accounts here, we're talking real investments. Also note, this is obviously a very simplistic calculation that doesn't take into account inflation, the person getting raises and putting more money in or losing a job, etc etc etc... So while it is not guaranteed it is also not unrealistic that even someone not making that much could come out on top. Most of them probably wouldn't but if some want to try why not let them?

Last edited by nemein; 09-03-09 at 12:08 PM.
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Old 09-03-09, 11:58 AM
  #253  
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Re: If you disagree with Obama - you are racist.

Originally Posted by orangecrush View Post
It would have hardly been much worse with what was purposed at the time.
Additionally there's no way to tell if the extra influx of money could have helped stave off (or maybe even prevent) the down fall (or cushion it a bit more than what happened). Also now is probably a good time to be thinking about privatizing it... lots of good bargains/cut rate deal out there currently
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Old 09-03-09, 12:42 PM
  #254  
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Re: If you disagree with Obama - you are racist.

Originally Posted by orangecrush View Post
Personally, I favor giving people the option of completely opting out of SS and Medicare and allowing them to invest the money. If someone making $20K a year were allowed (though you would probably have to have mandatory savings to appease the nanny staters) to invest 10% of their income, they would be millionaires by the time they retire. A sight better than the max SS payment they will receive when they retire.

Hell, I'd be willing to opt out of SS and still let them have 50% of what they use to take as part of the "social insurance" aspect so that people that don't pay much are still covered.

I am quite sure I could do better with the 50% I could keep than I would end up with at whatever age they raise it to by the time I am eligable.
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Old 09-03-09, 12:58 PM
  #255  
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Re: If you disagree with Obama - you are racist.

I'd love for Social Security / Medicare to actually be a safety net. Lower the FICA tax rate, remove the cap on taxable earnings, eliminate FICA taxes for people <$50k, employ means testing for SS and Medicare benefits.
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Old 09-03-09, 01:26 PM
  #256  
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Re: If you disagree with Obama - you are racist.

Originally Posted by Brack View Post
Millionaires? $2k of $20k a year? How long is life expectancy now?
If you start working at age 21 and earn $20,000 a year and put aside 10%, at age 65, you'll have over $750,000 assuming 8% interest rates. If you assume that the $20,000 salary will rise by 3% annually (even if someone doesn't get a promotion, the thought of someone's salary staying at $20,000 without even raising with inflation is ridiculous), 8% interest would give that person $1,125,000 when they retire.
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Old 09-03-09, 02:38 PM
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Re: If you disagree with Obama - you are racist.

Originally Posted by RoyalTea View Post
If you start working at age 21 and earn $20,000 a year and put aside 10%, at age 65, you'll have over $750,000 assuming 8% interest rates. If you assume that the $20,000 salary will rise by 3% annually (even if someone doesn't get a promotion, the thought of someone's salary staying at $20,000 without even raising with inflation is ridiculous), 8% interest would give that person $1,125,000 when they retire.
I think a 3% annual increase in salary is pretty optimistic, especially if it's a $20k/year job. I think you're giving "rise with inflation" too much credit as well. You can still save away a good bit of money, I think you have to have a better starting point really, because life happens, with unexpected and unavoidable costs, and this scenario doesn't take that into consideration much.
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Old 09-03-09, 02:41 PM
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Re: If you disagree with Obama - you are racist.

Originally Posted by Brack View Post
I think a 3% annual increase in salary is pretty optimistic, especially if it's a $20k/year job. I think you're giving "rise with inflation" too much credit as well. You can still save away a good bit of money, I think you have to have a better starting point really, because life happens, with unexpected and unavoidable costs, and this scenario doesn't take that into consideration much.
do you think somebody making $20,000 (nominal) will be making $20,000 (nominal) in 45 years?
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Old 09-03-09, 02:47 PM
  #259  
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Re: If you disagree with Obama - you are racist.

Originally Posted by RoyalTea View Post
do you think somebody making $20,000 (nominal) will be making $20,000 (nominal) in 45 years?
No, where did I make such a suggestion? I'm just suggesting 3% annual increase in salary is way optimistic. Like I just said.
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Old 09-03-09, 02:49 PM
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Re: If you disagree with Obama - you are racist.

2% annual salary increase over 45 years and 8% interest will be slightly less than $1 million.
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Old 09-03-09, 02:53 PM
  #261  
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Re: If you disagree with Obama - you are racist.

Originally Posted by Brack View Post
No, where did I make such a suggestion? I'm just suggesting 3% annual increase in salary is way optimistic. Like I just said.
I agree unless you are talking over a very long period evened out. You have promotions thrown in there, etc. assuming aperson does get promoted. And aside from regular increases, there are many many jobs that have increases also based on years of service.

But hell, I don't get increases, so what the hell do I know.
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Old 09-03-09, 02:56 PM
  #262  
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Re: If you disagree with Obama - you are racist.

Originally Posted by Brack View Post
I think a 3% annual increase in salary is pretty optimistic, especially if it's a $20k/year job. I think you're giving "rise with inflation" too much credit as well. You can still save away a good bit of money, I think you have to have a better starting point really, because life happens, with unexpected and unavoidable costs, and this scenario doesn't take that into consideration much.
That is why I said you would probably have to make the savings compulsory. Heck, even if you only alowed 50% of the investments to be in stock, the poor person opting out would still be far better off than the guy w/ SS. The problem (in my view) is that SS isn't the invidual's (as many people think it is). I am not putting money into my account. I am paying for others with the hope that others will pay for my benifits down the road.
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Old 09-03-09, 03:06 PM
  #263  
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Re: If you disagree with Obama - you are racist.

Hell, I'd get better return with a savings account than SS.
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Old 09-03-09, 03:51 PM
  #264  
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Re: If you disagree with Obama - you are racist.

Originally Posted by kvrdave View Post
Hell, I'd be willing to opt out of SS and still let them have 50% of what they use to take as part of the "social insurance" aspect so that people that don't pay much are still covered.

I am quite sure I could do better with the 50% I could keep than I would end up with at whatever age they raise it to by the time I am eligable.
Under that scenario, what would happen if you WEREN'T able to do better and didn't have enough left to support yourself?
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Old 09-03-09, 03:56 PM
  #265  
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Re: If you disagree with Obama - you are racist.

Originally Posted by CRM114 View Post
Funny.

"The simple truth is that I am and always have been opposed to the Obama Administration's plans to nationalize health care. Period." - Senator Grassley
However, Sen. Grassley has proposed a health care reform plan.
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Old 09-03-09, 03:58 PM
  #266  
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Re: If you disagree with Obama - you are racist.

Originally Posted by Birrman54 View Post
I'd love for Social Security / Medicare to actually be a safety net. Lower the FICA tax rate, remove the cap on taxable earnings, eliminate FICA taxes for people <$50k, employ means testing for SS and Medicare benefits.
Employ means testing and you have another welfare program. That will definitely end Social Security.
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Old 09-03-09, 04:00 PM
  #267  
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Re: If you disagree with Obama - you are racist.

Originally Posted by sracer View Post
Under that scenario, what would happen if you WEREN'T able to do better and didn't have enough left to support yourself?
Who cares, as I absolve society of my burden. Seriously, so what if I become homeless? Are there not homeless people now?
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Old 09-03-09, 04:18 PM
  #268  
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Re: If you disagree with Obama - you are racist.

I am not putting money into my account. I am paying for others with the hope that others will pay for my benifits down the road.
Isn't that essentially what Madoff was put into jail for
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Old 09-03-09, 04:47 PM
  #269  
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Re: If you disagree with Obama - you are racist.

Originally Posted by kvrdave View Post
Who cares, as I absolve society of my burden. Seriously, so what if I become homeless? Are there not homeless people now?
Who cares? I do. Because there are many free-wheeling, free-market capitalists who claimed to not want any part of government-provided money....until they need it.

Who cares? I do. Because this country is not going to hold you to your word.
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Old 09-03-09, 04:52 PM
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Re: If you disagree with Obama - you are racist.

Originally Posted by nemein View Post
Isn't that essentially what Madoff was put into jail for
Don't worry. It is social insurance.
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Old 09-03-09, 04:55 PM
  #271  
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Re: If you disagree with Obama - you are racist.

Originally Posted by sracer View Post
Who cares? I do. Because there are many free-wheeling, free-market capitalists who claimed to not want any part of government-provided money....until they need it.

Who cares? I do. Because this country is not going to hold you to your word.
I'm sure it will be like it is today where even those that are homeless and without insurance can waltz into any public hospital (and in many cases even private hospitals) and get medical care whether they can afford it or not.
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Old 09-03-09, 05:09 PM
  #272  
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Re: If you disagree with Obama - you are racist.

Originally Posted by sracer View Post
Who cares? I do. Because there are many free-wheeling, free-market capitalists who claimed to not want any part of government-provided money....until they need it.

Who cares? I do. Because this country is not going to hold you to your word.
Then I will sign something telling them that I am genocide in Africa. Then you can rest easily knowing they won't do anything.
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Old 09-03-09, 06:02 PM
  #273  
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Re: If you disagree with Obama - you are racist.

^
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Old 09-03-09, 06:52 PM
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Re: If you disagree with Obama - you are racist.

A bit more on topic..

Rangel Plays Race Card, Says Obamacare The Victim

NEW YORK (CBS) ―

Here we go again for Congressman Charles Rangel.

A major newspaper is calling for his resignation as chairman of the committee that writes tax laws.

And then there's this: The 79-year-old is under fire for comments he made about race and President Barack Obama.

First, Gov. David Paterson did it. Now, Rep. Rangel is doing it as an ethics probe heats up.

The "it" is playing the race card. Rangel said "bias" and "prejudice" are fueling opposition to health care reform.

Already under fire for a wide range of ethical questions, Rangel played the race card in a health care forum the other night, saying racial bias against President Obama is behind opposition to health care reform.

"Some Americans have not gotten over the fact that Obama is President of the United States. They go to sleep wondering, 'how did this happen?'"

Rangel also likened the fight to provide health care for the uninsured to the fight for civil rights.

"Why do black people have to bargain for what is theirs? Why do we have to wait for the right to vote? Why can't we get what God has given us? And that is the right to live as human beings and not negotiate with white southerners and not court the votes. Just do the right thing," Rangel said.


Rangel's incendiary remarks come as the congressman filed amended financial reports to the House Ethics Committee admitting that he forgot to report millions of dollars in assets and income.

Financial forgetfulness is apparently a disease that is spreading to his staff. Two top aides -- chief of staff Jim Capel and Rangel legal counsel George Dalley -- are among about a dozen staffers on Rangel's tax-writing House Ways and Means Committee that have filed amended financial reports recently. Capel did not file any financial disclosure statements for six years.

Rangel's own forgetfulness prompted the political important Washington Post to demand Thursday that Rangel step down as chair of Ways and Means.

Said The Washington Post: "Much is expected of elected officials. Much more is expected and demanded of those entrusted with chairmanships and the power that comes with them, especially when it involves the nation's purse strings. From all that we've seen thus far, Mr. Rangel has violated that trust continually and seemingly without care."

Even some in Rangel's neighborhood think stepping aside might be a good idea.

"He's not the only one. They're all stealing. It's just that they want to get him out because he has too much influence. He's been there too long. Every last one of them is stealing," Harlem resident Jacob Israel said.

"He should step aside because who knows what else he's doing that we don't know about," resident Jerry Watson added.

Rangel clammed up about the ethics probe on Thursday. He refused a request for an interview, saying through a spokesman he didn't think it was fair to comment until the Ethics Committee completes its investigation.

As Congressman Rangel faces calls to step down, New York politicians are weighing in.

Mayor Michael Bloomberg said he'd like to know all the facts before joining the chorus.

"Charlie has been very helpful to this city in terms of doing things that we've asked him to do, bringing home the bacon if you will and I hope that he's done nothing wrong," Bloomberg said.

Councilman and mayoral candidate Tony Avella released a statement saying, "It was also mar his effectiveness in representing Harlem in Congress. He should not stand for re-election."

Mayoral candidate Bill Thompson did not return CBS 2 HD's calls.
More of the same.. If you don't like what concocted plan Obama has drawn up then it only must be because of race.. right?

And I'm surprised he didn't say "Why do blacks have to pay taxes? Why can't we lie on our tax returns? Why must be have to pay into the White Man's game?". I guess since your crying the victim you can say anything...
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Old 09-03-09, 10:03 PM
  #275  
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Re: If you disagree with Obama - you are racist.

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