Religion, Politics and World Events They make great dinner conversation, don't you think? plus Political Film

Same Sex Marriage Thread Part 2

Old 11-13-08, 11:15 AM
  #1  
DVD Talk Hero
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Nov 1999
Posts: 36,983
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Same Sex Marriage Thread Part 2

Continued from http://forum.dvdtalk.com/politics-wo...ge-so-bad.html
Venusian is offline  
Old 11-13-08, 11:16 AM
  #2  
DVD Talk Hero
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Nov 1999
Posts: 36,983
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Originally Posted by spainlinx0 View Post
I understand the sin of premarital sex.
what is your understanding of why premarital sex is a sin?
Venusian is offline  
Old 11-13-08, 11:19 AM
  #3  
DVD Talk Hero
 
Th0r S1mpson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 36,438
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Posted this at the end of the last one, but...
Spainlinx0's question actually outlines this very well.

"I understand the sin of premarital sex. I understand adultery. So why not apply the same rules to gay sex. A sin only outside of marriage."

Because we do not make the rules when it comes to God's law. And attempting to "sanctify" homosexual sex under the title of legal marriage does not cover the sin. It only makes it more acceptable by society.

Incidentally, I think premarital sex is much more open to debate than homosexual sex from a biblical perspective. The latter is described more along the lines of adultery.
Th0r S1mpson is offline  
Old 11-13-08, 11:21 AM
  #4  
DVD Talk God
 
kvrdave's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 1999
Location: Pacific NW
Posts: 86,189
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
Originally Posted by Thor Simpson
Spainlinx0's question actually outlines this very well.

"I understand the sin of premarital sex. I understand adultery. So why not apply the same rules to gay sex. A sin only outside of marriage."

Because we do not make the rules when it comes to God's law. And attempting to "sanctify" homosexual sex under the title of legal marriage does not cover the sin. It only makes it more acceptable by society.
Lot of "sins" have been made legal and more acceptable by society without the downfall of Christianity or society. I think the goal would not be in thinking it would be acceptable to all, but that it wouldn't be discriminated against.

But I do agree to not understanding how one can understand a sin of premarital sex but then truly question the reasoning of homosexual sex.

Perhaps one should ask why Spainlinx0 believes premarital sex is a sin.
kvrdave is offline  
Old 11-13-08, 11:23 AM
  #5  
DVD Talk God
 
kvrdave's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 1999
Location: Pacific NW
Posts: 86,189
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
Thread continuation/time continuation problems

Please delete the thread I started. And quit asking my questions.
kvrdave is offline  
Old 11-13-08, 11:27 AM
  #6  
DVD Talk Hall of Fame
 
LiquidSky's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 1999
Location: Pokey Dot Lounge, Nashville, TN
Posts: 9,184
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
I still want to know why these so-called "Christians" continue to cling to homosexuality as being the biggest "sin" above any other. Again, they need to take a long hard look at their own lives, how they treat people, etc. before casting the first stone and making gay folks their scapegoats. I have zero regard for these type of people.
LiquidSky is offline  
Old 11-13-08, 11:30 AM
  #7  
DVD Talk Legend
 
Dr Mabuse's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: 75 clicks above the Do Lung bridge...
Posts: 18,946
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
Originally Posted by kvrdave View Post
Perhaps one should ask why Spainlinx0 believes premarital sex is a sin.
A good question, many would be surprised at what the bible has to say on that topic.
Dr Mabuse is offline  
Old 11-13-08, 11:30 AM
  #8  
Moderator
 
Groucho's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Salt Lake City, Utah
Posts: 71,334
Received 98 Likes on 66 Posts
Originally Posted by LiquidSky View Post
I still want to know why these so-called "Christians" continue to cling to homosexuality as being the biggest "sin" above any other.
I hit on this in the last thread, but it's an easy sin to condemn if you're heterosexual since there's no chance that you yourself will stray. Whereas adultery, divorce, cheating on taxes are the kinds of things that can and do happen to anybody.
Groucho is online now  
Old 11-13-08, 11:30 AM
  #9  
DVD Talk God
 
kvrdave's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 1999
Location: Pacific NW
Posts: 86,189
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
I agree.

edit....with Liquidsky. I can't agree with Groucho no matter what he wrote.
kvrdave is offline  
Old 11-13-08, 11:34 AM
  #10  
DVD Talk Hero
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Nov 1999
Posts: 36,983
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
C.S. Lewis briefly touches on this in Surprised by Joy. He says he will not comment on the sin (he's actually talking about pederasty) because he has never been tempted by it.
Venusian is offline  
Old 11-13-08, 11:39 AM
  #11  
DVD Talk Hero
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Nov 1999
Posts: 36,983
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
His quote:

"...the sin in question is one of the two (gambling is the other) which I have never been tempted to commit. I will not indulge in futile philippics against enemies I never met in battle."
Venusian is offline  
Old 11-13-08, 11:39 AM
  #12  
Moderator
 
Groucho's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Salt Lake City, Utah
Posts: 71,334
Received 98 Likes on 66 Posts
It's like the "Virginity Club" at high school. Those guys would leave the club in a New York minute if some hotty showed up ready and willing.
Groucho is online now  
Old 11-13-08, 11:42 AM
  #13  
DVD Talk Legend
 
joeblow69's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: Palm Springs
Posts: 10,620
Received 79 Likes on 40 Posts
Originally Posted by LiquidSky View Post
I still want to know why these so-called "Christians" continue to cling to homosexuality as being the biggest "sin" above any other. Again, they need to take a long hard look at their own lives, how they treat people, etc. before casting the first stone and making gay folks their scapegoats. I have zero regard for these type of people.
My guess is this sin hits close to home to them, as they see it as having a direct effect on their family. The more accepted homosexuality becomes, they think that will just increase the chance that one of their spawn will become homosexual.
joeblow69 is offline  
Old 11-13-08, 11:47 AM
  #14  
DVD Talk God
 
kvrdave's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 1999
Location: Pacific NW
Posts: 86,189
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
Originally Posted by joeblow69 View Post
My guess is this sin hits close to home to them, as they see it as having a direct effect on their family. The more accepted homosexuality becomes, they think that will just increase the chance that one of their spawn will become homosexual.
HA! I knew it was contagious. I change my vote!
kvrdave is offline  
Old 11-13-08, 11:56 AM
  #15  
DVD Talk Legend
 
joeblow69's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: Palm Springs
Posts: 10,620
Received 79 Likes on 40 Posts
Originally Posted by kvrdave View Post
HA! I knew it was contagious. I change my vote!
Yep, we are an outbreak to them. A child corrupting, aids spreading outbreak.
joeblow69 is offline  
Old 11-13-08, 12:04 PM
  #16  
DVD Talk Hero
 
Th0r S1mpson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 36,438
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
I agree that there is far too much of an emphasis on homosexuality without an equal regard for adultery within the Christian community. I would also contend that many homosexuals are placing far too much emphasis on their sexuality in their lives, but that's for them to determine, I suppose.

Naturally, I am only talking about the vocal ones that we actually hear about, as I assume you are with Christians.

I think that in day to day life the average Christian gives far more attention and admonishing to adultery than homosexuality. Probably because it is much more common. I'm sure this varies in different circles, however. I can only speak from my personal experience.

Last edited by Th0r S1mpson; 11-13-08 at 12:09 PM.
Th0r S1mpson is offline  
Old 11-13-08, 12:23 PM
  #17  
DVD Talk Godfather
 
The Bus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: New York
Posts: 54,909
Received 12 Likes on 10 Posts
It still bewilders me how many people think homosexuality is infectious. Some people see more "open" homosexuality as a force that will lead their children to grow up being homosexuals, when in reality it will just make their children more accepting of people who are different from them.
The Bus is offline  
Old 11-13-08, 12:27 PM
  #18  
DVD Talk Hero
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Nov 1999
Posts: 36,983
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Originally Posted by The Bus View Post
It still bewilders me how many people think homosexuality is infectious. Some people see more "open" homosexuality as a force that will lead their children to grow up being homosexuals, when in reality it will just make their children more accepting of people who are different from them.
makes sense if you see sexuality as a choice. if you have that view, than homosexuality being accepted by society in general would probably lead to more people choosing it, including possibly one's children
Venusian is offline  
Old 11-13-08, 12:31 PM
  #19  
DVD Talk Hero
 
Th0r S1mpson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 36,438
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
It all comes down to the difference between being homosexual in nature and homosexuality as an action. I don't think there are many people who (I could be wrong) think that it is "infectious" to people who do not have homosexual leanings to begin with. The idea would be that sin itself is infectious and begets more sin due to our very nature. This is true of all kinds of sexual impurity. Since homosexual actions are considered sinful by these people, they feel that acceptance would indeed increase its abundance in the population that is most affected by it. Of course there are people who engage in these actions no matter what, but the concern would be over those who might not succumb to the temptations without societal acceptance. Measuring this is impossible and the likely number of people affected in this manner is possibly quite small at this time. Perhaps not.

It's unfortunate that this matter is a huge stumbling block with regards to faith and action. It's a difficult issue to discuss in this context because in a personal relationship there are 100 things I would talk to someone about first before ever addressing sexuality. We all experience impure desires and lust of different kinds and I don't judge people according to such things. Establishing a relationship with God is far more important and essential before addressing temptations. Indeed, I think the concern is not so much about accepting homosexuals as confronting homosexuality within the Christian community itself and how that might be impacted by wider societal acceptance of the relationship. That clearly is not the case with regards to "hateful" people who target homosexuals in a broad manner, but I would take issue with their hatred to begin with.

Last edited by Th0r S1mpson; 11-13-08 at 12:49 PM.
Th0r S1mpson is offline  
Old 11-13-08, 01:12 PM
  #20  
DVD Talk Hero
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 25,058
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Originally Posted by Thor Simpson
Because we do not make the rules when it comes to God's law. And attempting to "sanctify" homosexual sex under the title of legal marriage does not cover the sin. It only makes it more acceptable by society.
People have kept saying homosexuals are also being intolerant. Can someone explain to me how I'm supposed to have any respect for an intellectual position which at its basis calls one of the most fundamental parts of my nature to be a sin?

This shit is fucking insane. It's like we're back in the 15th Century calling left-handers tools of Satan.
Tracer Bullet is offline  
Old 11-13-08, 01:13 PM
  #21  
DVD Talk Legend
 
spainlinx0's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: NJ
Posts: 16,972
Received 167 Likes on 97 Posts
Originally Posted by Venusian View Post
what is your understanding of why premarital sex is a sin?
You know what, I don't know. Growing up as a Catholic, in after-school CCD for 8 years, then on to 4 years of private all guys Catholic HS, I just always remember being taught that premarital sex was a sin. Of course growing up Catholic I don't remember what exactly wasn't a sin except for going to church and not eating meat on Fridays during lent.

I understand adultery because you have pledged yourself to one person, and to go and have sex with someone else was to betray that person's trust. From my upbringing I think we were kind of pushed towards all sex being bad until you find the person you're going to marry. Then sex is good because you're having kids.

I admit that is not a biblical interpretation. It's just what was drilled into my head from when I was young.

What is the biblical reasoning?
spainlinx0 is offline  
Old 11-13-08, 01:15 PM
  #22  
DVD Talk Hero
 
Th0r S1mpson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 36,438
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Originally Posted by Tracer Bullet View Post
Can someone explain to me how I'm supposed to have any respect for an intellectual position which at its basis calls one of the most fundamental parts of my nature to be a sin?
If you look more closely, the position at its basis calls one of the most fundamental parts of all of our natures sin.
Th0r S1mpson is offline  
Old 11-13-08, 01:16 PM
  #23  
DVD Talk Hero
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 25,058
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Originally Posted by Thor Simpson View Post
If you look more closely, the position at its basis calls one of the most fundamental parts of all of our natures sin.
Then let us get marri- OH WAIT
Tracer Bullet is offline  
Old 11-13-08, 01:16 PM
  #24  
DVD Talk God
 
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Directionally Challenged (for DirecTV)
Posts: 124,729
Received 88 Likes on 67 Posts
Originally Posted by Groucho View Post
I hit on this in the last thread, but it's an easy sin to condemn if you're heterosexual since there's no chance that you yourself will stray. Whereas adultery, divorce, cheating on taxes are the kinds of things that can and do happen to anybody.
I never thought of it that way. Excellent point.
Red Dog is offline  
Old 11-13-08, 01:22 PM
  #25  
DVD Talk Hero
 
Th0r S1mpson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 36,438
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Originally Posted by Tracer Bullet View Post
Then let us get marri- OH WAIT
Because we are all sinful, the definition of marriage must therefore include relationships within the same sex? I don't follow.
Th0r S1mpson is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell My Personal Information -

Copyright 2021 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.