Religion, Politics and World Events They make great dinner conversation, don't you think? plus Political Film

McCain and his favorite pet, censorship...

Old 03-24-06, 07:44 AM
  #1  
DVD Talk Limited Edition
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Pleasantville - in black & white ;P
Posts: 5,970
McCain and his favorite pet, censorship...

Grass-Roots Activists and Bloggers Brace for New Regulation

McCain's proposal defines grass-roots lobbying broadly. He wants to regulate "any attempt to influence the general public ... to engage in lobbying contacts, whether or not those contacts were made on behalf of a client." In a rare bit of leniency, he exempts attempts to influence fewer than 500 people.

Opponents put it more bluntly. "Basically, it tells groups that if they want to petition Congress in any significant way, they have to tell Congress about it first," explained Jason Wright, executive director of LobbySense, an ad-hoc coalition formed to oppose the McCain proposal.

All this uncertainty has bloggers right and left in full activist mode and has made for some strange bedfellows. Markos Zuniga, founder of the ultra-liberal Daily Kos blog, has teamed with Krempasky to organize bi-partisan support for the bill. In an open letter to Congress, the unlikely duo explained why there is no need for campaign-finance reform on the Internet.

"While wealth allows a campaign or large donor to dominate the available space on TV or in print," they wrote, "there is no mechanism on the Internet by which entities can use wealth or organizational strength to crowd out or silence other speakers." They argue that the Internet is an equal playing field where anyone can start a Web site and "content is king."

Last edited by mosquitobite; 03-24-06 at 07:49 AM.
mosquitobite is offline  
Old 03-24-06, 07:50 AM
  #2  
DVD Talk Limited Edition
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Pleasantville - in black & white ;P
Posts: 5,970
Wright believes at least one of the would-be regulators is animated by revenge. "John McCain has real issues with the grassroots," he explained. "This spans back to 2000 and I think he still holds a grudge against grass-roots America. "I've heard rumors saying Senators are for this because they say they're tired of hearing from these grass-roots groups," he said.

"We have the right to annoy the hell out of them, as does every single citizen in the United States. They serve us - we don't serve them!" he added.

Richard Vigurie, a pioneer in grass-roots lobbying, finds still other motives. "Washington is about power," he wrote in an op-ed piece for the Washington Times. "Those who have power fear losing it ... Independent grass-roots causes inherently threaten incumbents' power by empowering citizens." As a result, he argues that grass-roots reform is an attempt to "pre-empt critics," making grass-roots lobbying more difficult and protecting vested power.
What a sorry state Washington is today! The framers WOULD be rolling over in their graves at the site of these power hungry assholes in Washington!
mosquitobite is offline  
Old 03-24-06, 07:57 AM
  #3  
DVD Talk God
 
Join Date: Jun 1999
Posts: 68,522
Well - they might indeed be rolling over in their graves, but it would not be over 'power hunger,' since they wanted a powerful national government to replace the weak Articles of Confederation.
classicman2 is offline  
Old 03-24-06, 08:09 AM
  #4  
DVD Talk Limited Edition
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Pleasantville - in black & white ;P
Posts: 5,970
mosquitobite is offline  
Old 03-24-06, 08:17 AM
  #5  
Admin-Thanos
 
VinVega's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Caught between the moon and NYC
Posts: 31,523
Originally Posted by mosquitobite
Look who's grumpy this morning.
VinVega is offline  
Old 03-24-06, 08:19 AM
  #6  
DVD Talk God
 
Join Date: Jun 1999
Posts: 68,522
'She can't handle the truth.'
classicman2 is offline  
Old 03-24-06, 08:19 AM
  #7  
DVD Talk Limited Edition
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Pleasantville - in black & white ;P
Posts: 5,970
No, I was just annoyed that somehow he took out of a post about censorship a debate about federalism vs states.
mosquitobite is offline  
Old 03-24-06, 08:22 AM
  #8  
DVD Talk God
 
Join Date: Jun 1999
Posts: 68,522
Originally Posted by mosquitobite
No, I was just annoyed that somehow he took out of a post about censorship a debate about federalism vs states.
You're the one that mentioned 'power hunger,' and the framers rolling over in their graves because of it.
classicman2 is offline  
Old 03-24-06, 08:24 AM
  #9  
Admin-Thanos
 
VinVega's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Caught between the moon and NYC
Posts: 31,523
Ok seriously....I don't think I like this one from McCain.
VinVega is offline  
Old 03-24-06, 08:24 AM
  #10  
DVD Talk Limited Edition
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Pleasantville - in black & white ;P
Posts: 5,970
I meant power hungry in their quest for reelection and the silencing of their critics.
mosquitobite is offline  
Old 03-24-06, 08:24 AM
  #11  
Moderator
 
wendersfan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Nuova Repubblica di SalÚ
Posts: 32,796
DailyKos isn't "ultraliberal" except to someone who is themself, "ultraconservative".
wendersfan is offline  
Old 03-24-06, 08:25 AM
  #12  
DVD Talk Limited Edition
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Pleasantville - in black & white ;P
Posts: 5,970
It *is* a Newsmax article wender

But the topic is a serious - BIpartisan issue - so I'm hoping the usual "I'm not reading that" is not done here.

If you don't like the newsmax article, find one more fitting. But what Washington is up to should be riling every last feather on this board.
mosquitobite is offline  
Old 03-24-06, 08:27 AM
  #13  
DVD Talk God
 
Join Date: Jun 1999
Posts: 68,522
Originally Posted by mosquitobite
I meant power hungry in their quest for reelection and the silencing of their critics.
O.K., I'll accept that.

I don't like McCain either. I have problems with anyone who is an enemy of free political speech.

DailyKos isn't "ultraliberal" except to someone who is themself, "ultraconservative.
Would trending somewhat to the left be a reasonable description?
classicman2 is offline  
Old 03-24-06, 08:28 AM
  #14  
Admin-Thanos
 
VinVega's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Caught between the moon and NYC
Posts: 31,523
Originally Posted by mosquitobite
It *is* a Newsmax article wender

But the topic is a serious - BIpartisan issue - so I'm hoping the usual "I'm not reading that" is not done here.

If you don't like the newsmax article, find one more fitting. But what Washington is up to should be riling every last feather on this board.
This is not a <s>dating</s> political action forum. We're here to argue about stuff!

VinVega is offline  
Old 03-24-06, 08:34 AM
  #15  
Moderator
 
wendersfan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Nuova Repubblica di SalÚ
Posts: 32,796
Originally Posted by classicman2
Would trending somewhat to the left be a reasonable description?
Well, now that's just silly.

I'd put DailyKos in the mainstream of American liberalism - to the right of Eschaton, but to the left of <i>The New Republic</i>.
wendersfan is offline  
Old 03-24-06, 09:03 AM
  #16  
Political Exile
 
grundle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 16,294
I guess banning certain kinds of political ads 60 days before an election wasn't enough for McCain, so now he wants more censorship.
grundle is offline  
Old 03-24-06, 11:24 AM
  #17  
DVD Talk God
 
kvrdave's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 1999
Location: Pacific NW
Posts: 86,201
Originally Posted by wendersfan
DailyKos isn't "ultraliberal" except to someone who is themself, "ultraconservative".
DailyKos is also not "ultraliberal" to those who are "ultraliberal." But then, they don't even consider themselves such. To them it is just more mainstream press
kvrdave is offline  
Old 03-24-06, 02:09 PM
  #18  
DVD Talk God
 
Join Date: Jun 1999
Posts: 68,522
Originally Posted by kvrdave
DailyKos is also not "ultraliberal" to those who are "ultraliberal." But then, they don't even consider themselves such. To them it is just more mainstream press
Do you consider yourself a neanderthal conservative?
classicman2 is offline  
Old 03-24-06, 06:43 PM
  #19  
DVD Talk God
 
Join Date: Jun 1999
Posts: 68,522
Originally Posted by Vandelay_Inds
McCain is exactly right on this one. If you want a cleaner and more objective government, you must place strong restrictions on those who seek, at presently with much success, to improperly influence it.
Yeah, McCain-Feingold has worked so well, hasn't it?

Lobbyists are the tools by which the citizen petitions his government.

They perform a valuable service to the legislative process. Are there abuses -you bet there are; but, you don't throw the baby out with the bath water.
classicman2 is offline  
Old 03-24-06, 08:51 PM
  #20  
Admin-Thanos
 
VinVega's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Caught between the moon and NYC
Posts: 31,523
Originally Posted by Vandelay_Inds
McCain is exactly right on this one. If you want a cleaner and more objective government, you must place strong restrictions on those who seek, at presently with much success, to improperly influence it.
I liked McCain-Feingold because it went after rich individuals who on their own could have more "speech" than many people combined. Your political voice should not be louder than mine just because you have more money. This bill goes after organizations of people who have pooled their resources together to work as a collective group of voices. There is a difference. McCain is dead wrong on this one.
VinVega is offline  
Old 03-24-06, 10:07 PM
  #21  
Moderator
 
Join Date: May 2000
Location: In mourning
Posts: 26,284
Originally Posted by VinVega
I liked McCain-Feingold because it went after rich individuals who on their own could have more "speech" than many people combined. Your political voice should not be louder than mine just because you have more money. This bill goes after organizations of people who have pooled their resources together to work as a collective group of voices. There is a difference. McCain is dead wrong on this one.

Oh, so that is why folks like the wonderful Peter Lewis and the esteemed George Soros didn't spend more money than me, or have more 'speech' than I did. I was wondering what happened.
Pharoh is offline  
Old 03-25-06, 12:10 AM
  #22  
Admin-Thanos
 
VinVega's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Caught between the moon and NYC
Posts: 31,523
Originally Posted by Pharoh
Oh, so that is why folks like the wonderful Peter Lewis and the esteemed George Soros didn't spend more money than me, or have more 'speech' than I did. I was wondering what happened.
I didn't say it worked. I just liked the concept.
VinVega is offline  
Old 03-25-06, 07:03 AM
  #23  
DVD Talk God
 
Join Date: Jun 1999
Posts: 68,522
Then why don't you like the idea that you should limit the number of political speeches a person can give in support of the candidate of his choice?

Both giving speeches and donating money to political campaigns are expressions of free political speech? The Supreme Court of the United States have said so. However, like you, they're inconsistent on the issue.
classicman2 is offline  
Old 03-25-06, 07:28 AM
  #24  
DVD Talk Legend
 
Join Date: Aug 1999
Location: Lower Gum Curve
Posts: 19,038
Originally Posted by classicman2
Lobbyists are the tools by which the citizen petitions his government.
Name one that helped an actual citizen, as opposed to some corporate interest.
Jason is offline  
Old 03-25-06, 07:35 AM
  #25  
Moderator
 
wendersfan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Nuova Repubblica di SalÚ
Posts: 32,796
Originally Posted by Jason
Name one that helped an actual citizen, as opposed to some corporate interest.
What about Public Citizen, founded by Nader? Are you going to try to tell me they support the interests of corporations?
wendersfan is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Archive Advertising Cookie Policy Privacy Statement Terms of Service

Copyright © 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.