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San Fran bans handguns

Old 11-09-05, 08:44 PM
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San Fran bans handguns

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?p...SH_a0&refer=us
San Francisco Voters Ban Sale, Possession of Handguns (Update1)

Nov. 8 (Bloomberg) -- San Francisco residents voted to ban the sale and possession of handguns and ammunition even after the police union opposed the idea, saying the law wouldn't help fight crime in the city.

Measure H won with 89,696 votes, or 58 percent, according to returns posted on the city's Web site. More than 65,000 voters, or 42 percent, opposed the measure.

Measure H bars the sale of handguns and ammunition and requires residents to hand over the guns they own by April 1. Proponents said the law would curb crime in a city that had 88 homicides last year, the most in a decade.

The National Rifle Association said it plans to sue to block the law, which would be the most restrictive measure of its kind in the U.S. The city Police Officers Association said the law would do little to rein in violence and may pose a nightmare for the cops who'd have to collect the more than 22,000 handguns bought in the city in the past 10 years alone.
I'll laugh when crime and murders go up not down
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Old 11-09-05, 08:50 PM
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I'll laugh when crime and murders go up not down
Yes because there is nothing funnier than rising crime and murder rates .
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Old 11-09-05, 09:22 PM
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not all laughs necesarily imply humor
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Old 11-09-05, 10:01 PM
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Crime is already rising in San Fran. In any case, I don't see why they are doing this. Why not ban kitchen knives too.

I also find it odd the police union is against this idea. Normally, they favor citizen disarming.
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Old 11-09-05, 10:16 PM
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Collecting handguns that were bought legally and registered w/ the local authorities.
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Old 11-09-05, 10:55 PM
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Handguns are completely useless IMO. I grew up around guns, and have done a fair amount of hunting. So I'm not totally anti gun But there's just no use for handguns, automatic weapons, etc.. Especially in cities. People say they get them for protection, but that usually backfires more often than not.
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Old 11-09-05, 11:25 PM
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They should just make murder illegal. That would stop the murders.
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Old 11-10-05, 12:00 AM
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I'm going to be with a friend who has a concealed handgun permit tomorrow and I'm going to ask him about getting one myself.

Unlike our esteemed ex-mayor and senator, only the "little people" won't be able to have guns and I wouldn't want to be one of them.
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Old 11-10-05, 12:44 AM
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It ain't gonna pass.
I'm betting the same people who voted for this ban are the same people who voted against disarming Saddam Hussein. Nice logic.
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Old 11-10-05, 09:33 AM
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Originally Posted by Myster X
It ain't gonna pass.
It already did, didn't it?

Requiring citizens to turn in their legally acquired guns does not seem American to me on any level. I hope this is challenged and overturned.
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Old 11-10-05, 09:44 AM
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I heard the ACLU is going to challenge the ban.
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Old 11-10-05, 09:44 AM
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Pretty stupid, and I would say uncontitutional. It'll be interesting to see what happens with this.
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Old 11-10-05, 09:55 AM
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does this ban apply to anyone or only to the little people?

what about celebrities that might be living in SF and who have guns but continually speak out against them.
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Old 11-10-05, 10:05 AM
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This keeps people from the suburbs and outside cities from carrying guns into SF too, right? If citizens can't have guns, I don't think robbers should be able to bring them in either.
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Old 11-10-05, 10:20 AM
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I'm not adamantly opposed to banning handgun sales within the city limits of large urban areas with crime problems. As for banning possession or requiring people to turn in handguns they already own, that's intrusive enough that I'd balk if I owned one.
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Old 11-10-05, 10:24 AM
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I bet every criminal is now turning their gun in for proper disposal.
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Old 11-10-05, 10:26 AM
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Originally Posted by X
I heard the ACLU is going to challenge the ban.


You have a dry wit.
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Old 11-10-05, 12:33 PM
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Originally Posted by adamblast
I'm not adamantly opposed to banning handgun sales within the city limits of large urban areas with crime problems.
You do realize that drug dealers and home invaders DO NOT buy thier guns at the local shop, right?

You also realize that homeowners and small business owners DO buy thier guns at the loacla shops, right?

When you put those two together, what do you get?
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Old 11-10-05, 12:48 PM
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Originally Posted by Tommy Ceez
You do realize that drug dealers and home invaders DO NOT buy thier guns at the local shop, right?

You also realize that homeowners and small business owners DO buy thier guns at the loacla shops, right?

When you put those two together, what do you get?
more robberies, but fewer shootings? i don't know, i'm guessing.
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Old 11-10-05, 02:14 PM
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Now, all we need to do is start another agency to enforce this ban if this prop. survives court ruling. Millions spend with no positive results.
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Old 11-10-05, 02:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Cygnet74
more robberies, but fewer shootings? i don't know, i'm guessing.
what percentage of unlawful shootings are from legally owned weapons?
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Old 11-10-05, 03:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Josh Hinkle


Handguns are completely useless IMO. I grew up around guns, and have done a fair amount of hunting. So I'm not totally anti gun But there's just no use for handguns, automatic weapons, etc.. Especially in cities. People say they get them for protection, but that usually backfires more often than not.
Then how do you explain this?

http://www.post-gazette.com/neigh_ci...rest1015p1.asp

A pistol-packing woman accomplished with two bullets what Pittsburgh police had been attempting to do for days: to stop the man suspected of a string of sexual assaults in the city's East End.

Police Chief Robert W. McNeilly Jr. announced yesterday that all six female assault victims had identified Daniel Wesley, 25, of Homewood, as the man who attacked them during a two-week rampage.
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Old 11-10-05, 03:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Duran
Requiring citizens to turn in their legally acquired guns does not seem American to me on any level.
You would have a point if San Francisco were part of America.
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Old 11-10-05, 03:27 PM
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Originally Posted by al_bundy
what percentage of unlawful shootings are from legally owned weapons?
Approximately 0.

http://www.guncite.com/gun_control_gcdgcon.html

First, what are "liberalized" concealed carry laws? They are a set of requirements, when met by an applicant, require the issuance of a concealed carry permit, which allows a permit holder to carry a gun (concealed) in public places. These requirements may consist of a license fee, a safety training program or exam, fingerprinting, a "clean" record, no history of mental illness, etc. In other words it is not left to the discretion of local authorities to decide whether or not to issue a permit. Liberalized concealed carry laws are more often referred to as "shall-issue concealed carry weapons" laws.

In 1987, when Florida enacted such legislation, critics warned that the "Sunshine State" would become the "Gunshine State." Contrary to their predictions, homicide rates dropped faster than the national average. Further, through 1997, only one permit holder out of the over 350,000 permits issued, was convicted of homicide. (Source: Kleck, Gary Targeting Guns: Firearms and Their Control, p 370. Walter de Gruyter, Inc., New York, 1997.) If the rest of the country behaved as Florida's permit holders did, the U.S. would have the lowest homicide rate in the world.

David Kopel, Research Director at the Independence Institute comments on Florida's concealed carry experience:

"What we can say with some confidence is that allowing more people to carry guns does not cause an increase in crime. In Florida, where 315,000 permits have been issued, there are only five known instances of violent gun crime by a person with a permit. <b>This makes a permit-holding Floridian the cream of the crop of law-abiding citizens, 840 times less likely to commit a violent firearm crime than a randomly selected Floridian without a permit.</b>" ("More Permits Mean Less Crime..." Los Angeles Times, Feb. 19, 1996, Monday, p. B-5)
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Old 11-10-05, 04:19 PM
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If people do turn in their guns will the city pay the people for them? I can't imagine buying a new gun for about $350-500 and then just giving it away.
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