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What has Bush done right?

Old 11-15-04, 04:37 AM
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What has Bush done right?

I would like to know what the Bush supporters think that he has done right in the last 4 years that makes him worthy of re-election.

Because down here in the south I have heard very few reasons why.
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Old 11-15-04, 06:05 AM
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well..... i think its best to ask everyone in your state because he easily won texas
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Old 11-15-04, 07:33 AM
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I'm definitely not a Bush supporter, but the only things I think he's done right are the tax cut and invading Afghanistan, the latter being a no-brainer that even a trained monkey could have gotten right.
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Old 11-15-04, 07:46 AM
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Listen to, and be led by Carl Rove.
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Old 11-15-04, 07:55 AM
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Re: What has Bush done right?

Originally posted by anakindurden
Because down here in the south I have heard very few reasons why.
Apparently you haven't been listening too well.

You are aware that he carried all of the south, aren't you?

I believe he handled the response to 9/11 very well - until he got sidetracked by Iraq.

I disagree with Duran about invading Afghanistan. I'm not at all certain that many would have proceeded as Bush did.

I also disagree with Duran concerning the tax cuts. I believe this ranks among the biggest mistakes of his first term.
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Old 11-15-04, 08:47 AM
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Re: What has Bush done right?

Originally posted by anakindurden
I would like to know what the Bush supporters think that he has done right in the last 4 years that makes him worthy of re-election.

Because down here in the south I have heard very few reasons why.

51% of the US thinks he is doing something right. Maybe it isn't his supporters that should be trying to prove something.
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Old 11-15-04, 09:03 AM
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I agree with Duran about the tax cut, and classicman about invading Afghanistan. I'm not happy with NCLB or the way it has been managed.

IMO, the thing primary thing Bush has done right is his demonstration that the United States will not bow to worldwide public opinion in fighting a war that was delivered to our shores. His unwavering dedication to this in the face of anger and hatred is definitely what he will be remembered for best and most.
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Old 11-15-04, 09:47 AM
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Originally posted by Mammal
Listen to, and be led by Carl Rove.
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Old 11-15-04, 10:01 AM
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Originally posted by Duran
I'm definitely not a Bush supporter, but the only things I think he's done right are the tax cut and invading Afghanistan, the latter being a no-brainer that even a trained monkey could have gotten right.

That and the people he has nominated to the federal bench.
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Old 11-15-04, 10:53 AM
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Good:

Tax cuts, leadership and "feel good" stuff after 9/11, homeland security, judicial nominations, education reform (not perfect, but it's a step in the right direction), prescription drug program (ditto), partial birth abortion ban, made the terrorists fear us/respect our power and resolve, invaded Afghanistan, destroyed the Taliban, captured Saddam Hussein and ousted him from power, captured or killed numerous terrorist leaders, made some progress to lead Palestine/Isreal to peace, took the fight to the terrorists, made possible the democratic elections for Afghanistan and eventually Iraq, disarmed Libya of nuclear weapons, stood up to France/Germany/etc. in the face of tremendous criticism, showed great resolve and dedication to his convictions, supports agressive space program, wants to consider new oil exploration/drilling, wants to reform social security, provides a great moral role model for our children as opposed to Clinton who taught a generation of kids that oral sex is not sex

Bad:

Not enough spending cuts, border security/illegal immigration (I'm sure I'm leaving some things out here. The man is definitely not perfect.)

I am on the fence about the Iraq invasion. I'm not sure if we are truly safer now than before. We may well be. Maybe not. I am glad Saddam is gone though.
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Old 11-15-04, 11:06 AM
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Not enough spending cuts, border security/illegal immigration (I'm sure I'm leaving some things out here. The man is definitely not perfect.)
His proposed immigration 'amnesty' was/is a good thing, because it's realistic. The 'let's kick 'em all out and build a fence' crowd are unrealistic.
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Old 11-15-04, 11:13 AM
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Lowered my taxes!
Booted Saddam from power!
Kicked Taliban arse!
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Finished reading "My pet goat"
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Old 11-15-04, 11:16 AM
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Originally posted by classicman2
His proposed immigration 'amnesty' was/is a good thing, because it's realistic. The 'let's kick 'em all out and build a fence' crowd are unrealistic.
I agree with you. The worker pass thing is a great idea. But first I think we have to get control of the border, then start letting people in slowly, orderly, and legally. The chaos is not conducive to our security or our economy.
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Old 11-15-04, 12:53 PM
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Originally posted by darkessenz
um...gotta say its pretty obvious we aren´t safer then before
How is it obvious? We have nothing to compare it to because we have no idea what the current situation in Iraq would be right now if we had not invaded. Maybe Saddam could have developed a nuke in the past 3 years and sold it to a terrorist group. Point being--we don't know. To assume that Saddam would have done nothing but mind his own business is wishful thinking at best and being terribly naive at worst.
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Old 11-15-04, 12:58 PM
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Old 11-15-04, 01:01 PM
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Iraq.
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Old 11-15-04, 01:42 PM
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Originally posted by taa455
How is it obvious? We have nothing to compare it to because we have no idea what the current situation in Iraq would be right now if we had not invaded. Maybe Saddam could have developed a nuke in the past 3 years and sold it to a terrorist group. Point being--we don't know. To assume that Saddam would have done nothing but mind his own business is wishful thinking at best and being terribly naive at worst.
In my mind, it's only "obvious" that we are safer or not safer to those people who make their decision based on how they feel about the President and his actions, and not any legitimate evidence. I feel that, in the long run, <strike>we are all dead</strike> we are safer having deposed Hussein, but in the short run I don't know. It's certainly obvious that, as of this moment, we've not been the victims of any more terrorist attacks on U.S. soil. That could change at any moment, but my guess is that it won't.
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Old 11-15-04, 04:11 PM
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Originally posted by wendersfan
That could change at any moment, but my guess is that it won't.
Why? Wasn't it longer than three years between 9/11 and previous attacks?

We haven't destroyed everyone who wants to hurt us (and Iraq wasn't really in that group.) I'm not sure why anyone thinks we are any safer.
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Old 11-15-04, 04:29 PM
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The USS Cole was in Oct '00

The African Embassy bombings were in '98
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Old 11-15-04, 04:39 PM
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Originally posted by taa455
How is it obvious? We have nothing to compare it to because we have no idea what the current situation in Iraq would be right now if we had not invaded. Maybe Saddam could have developed a nuke in the past 3 years and sold it to a terrorist group. Point being--we don't know. To assume that Saddam would have done nothing but mind his own business is wishful thinking at best and being terribly naive at worst.
And dreaming up the worst possible apocalyptic scenario about what Saddam might have done isn't very rational. If international terrorists really wanted nukes there are much better/easier options (ex Soviet republics) than patiently waiting for Saddam to develop one. And that's not even mentionning the more than tenuous supposed links between Saddam and Al Quaeda.
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Old 11-15-04, 04:43 PM
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If international terrorists really wanted nukes there are much better/easier options (ex Soviet republics) than patiently waiting for Saddam to develop one.
Agreed on the nuke, although I suspect it would be easier for these groups to get a nuke from SH than it would be from the Soviets, given the past history of Soviet/Arab relations in that region. Additionally this doesn't address the list of outstanding biochem material SH was thought to have had (the list in question being derived from the UN inspectors themselves).

You'ld think after almost 3 years we wouldn't be having the same debate over and over again Is anyone really going to change their mind at this point...
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Old 11-15-04, 04:43 PM
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Started.
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Old 11-15-04, 04:50 PM
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Originally posted by nemein
Agreed on the nuke, although I suspect it would be easier for these groups to get a nuke from SH than it would be from the Soviets, given the past history of Soviet/Arab relations in that region. Additionally this doesn't address the list of outstanding biochem material SH was thought to have had (the list in question being derived from the UN inspectors themselves).

You'ld think after almost 3 years we wouldn't be having the same debate over and over again Is anyone really going to change their mind at this point...
Nope. I'm tired of it so I'm either a masochist or I have too much time on my hands.

Not mentionning that I believe all that WMD, Al Quaeda, terrorist crap had nothing to do with invading Iraq. Which makes my arguing these points even more silly.
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Old 11-15-04, 06:38 PM
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Originally posted by taa455
Good:

Tax cuts, leadership and "feel good" stuff after 9/11, homeland security, judicial nominations, education reform (not perfect, but it's a step in the right direction), prescription drug program (ditto), partial birth abortion ban, made the terrorists fear us/respect our power and resolve, invaded Afghanistan, destroyed the Taliban, captured Saddam Hussein and ousted him from power, captured or killed numerous terrorist leaders, made some progress to lead Palestine/Isreal to peace, took the fight to the terrorists, made possible the democratic elections for Afghanistan and eventually Iraq, disarmed Libya of nuclear weapons, stood up to France/Germany/etc. in the face of tremendous criticism, showed great resolve and dedication to his convictions, supports agressive space program, wants to consider new oil exploration/drilling, wants to reform social security, provides a great moral role model for our children as opposed to Clinton who taught a generation of kids that oral sex is not sex.
-Money has to come from somewhere, the money spent on tax cuts most likely was going to somewhere else. Now money has to be shifted to whatever it was meant for in the first place. In the long term that doesn't help but for short term I guess everyone can appreciate that tingly feeling.

-Feel good stuff was always apart of America (he isn't even solely responsible for it all Americans had some hand in it, especially New Yorkers), its called patriotism and if it costs American lives to truly feel it I'll pass thank you.

-Uh, how hard is it for you to walk into any school with a package (I'm not saying this is a bad thing because I personally believe you can't stop terrorism, it's a tatic just like guerilla warfare or propaganda, and most things we do to "solve" this will just lead us down a path we truly don't want to go down.), government building, stadium, convention, etc. Or even park close enough to the entrance with a large vehicle. The only area that has truly changed has been the airlines and that's only because people pay the most attention to it.

-Which Judicial nominations have been a progression of freedom or even a support of what America has been founded on?

-Oooh Healthcare Plan, not good area. I personally don't like debt but money means nothing to this administration. We are America!

-Terrorist fear Isreal more than they'd ever fear us and that doesn't stop them from attacking Isreal. Not that I don't think the terrorist didn't think we'd just sit on our hands.

-Yeah it's nice and all that went in and got rid of an oppressive regime with under the power of a dictator that was slowly degrading mentally. But in the end you can look at South America, Africa, Asia, etc. and see nations in the same situation that interestingly the U.S. shows no "resolve" towards democratizing. This isn't even getting into the costs monetary wise or of American lives, Iraqi civilian lives (Sympathizers to us and innocent bystanders), American Civillian lives, Coalition lives, Iraq Army's lives (not Saddam's close personal militia but the ones who pretty much had no choice but to fight and most tried to surrender immediately when engaged), etc. At the least most MILITARY standpoints say that we will be in Iraq for atleast ten years for it to become truly stable.

-Except for Osama. But he's not really that important. Or the fact that for every negatively perceived action we continue to take in the Middle East we breed more terrorists.

-What progress has he made with the Palestine/Isreal situation? Both sides are not screwing each other over, if this is closer to peace then we're screwed if they have a full out war. The only thing in this last four years which brought a solution closer about is Arafat's death.

-Literally took the fight to the terrorist. Went to a nation that had weak, at best, connections to terrorist and decided they should have to deal with the terrorist problem on their soil instead of ours or where the terrorist are being funded and/or coming from (Iran, Saudi Arabia, Syria, etc.). You can't attack terrorism like it's a country, you attack it like its an outbreak of the flu, eliminating the source and providing information and resources to prevent people from picking it up.

-It's nice they have a democracy and all but the fact that women vote according to the leaders of their family kinda takes away the whole "democracy" day but I do give credit for not just abandoning it.

-Standing up to someone over invading another country is a good thing only if it's for a good reason. In the end we come off as the immature, brash country that some particularly anti-American Europeans perceive us as when are reasons for invading that country are unfounded.

-foolhardy

\Fool"har`dy\, a. [OF. folhardi. See Fool idiot, and Hardy.] Daring without judgment; foolishly adventurous and bold.

That's also a definition for showing his sort of resolve. I'd rather he changed his mind if later evidence appeared to contradict his actions than trying to prove he is a badass. If he thinks Americans don't believe he's human and can make mistakes than he is not really in touch with us. Look at Clinton his approval is still high and he got the "oh so controversial oral sex".

-I'd honestly rather him concentrate on alternative sources than trying to drill in America some more. We already know oil we will run out, why prolong it for the short term?

[offtopic]Do you honestly think that there are children out there who are damaged by him receiving oral sex or more for the fact of how much it was blown up, parent's reactions, and the repeated discussion of it?[/offtopic]

The ones I didn't mention we're things he actually did that were good. (Social Security, Partial Abortion Ban, Libya, Support for NASA, etc.)

So I guess he did do some commendable things. Vote worthy? No, but then again I'm not a Bush supporter so who am I to disagree.

Edit: Posting this much hurt me more than it hurt you.
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Old 11-15-04, 07:10 PM
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Nothing. Everything he has done is wrong, and lead by religious motives. He is stupid. He looks like a monkey. He can't even speak english. And yet eveything proposed by liberals was exactly correct, and Bush didn't do them. And he still won.

Hope that made someone feel happy.
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