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Some parents are deliberately infecting their children with Measles

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Some parents are deliberately infecting their children with Measles

Old 04-10-19, 05:38 PM
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Some parents are deliberately infecting their children with Measles

This is just plain dumb.

Every medical and scientific study shows that the Measles vaccine is far, far safer than actually getting Measles.


https://newyork.cbslocal.com/2019/04...a-for-parents/

Why ‘Measles Parties’ Are A Bad Idea For Parents

April 9, 2019

Health officials made a specific point to condemn the resurgence of “measles parties,” get-togethers where parents gather unvaccinated children with kids already suffering with measles in order to intentionally infect the group at a young age.

The practice has its own faulty logic based on how humans fight off the disease. Once people have become infected by measles, their bodies build up their immune systems to prevent new inflections. They are immune for the rest of their lives.

“As a parent, I have no doubt that each and every parent is making decisions based out of what they believe is best for their children,” said Deputy Mayor for Health and Human Services Dr. Herminia Palacio. “But as a doctor, a public health practitioner, and a mom, I must warn you that exposing your unvaccinated child to measles is very dangerous, and it could even be deadly.”

That’s the point of vaccines – safe ways of making people immune to infections with limited side effects. But “measles parties” carry a number of serious drawbacks.

“I know that parents may be afraid of getting their child vaccinated, but as a pediatrician, I know that getting vaccinated is far safer than getting measles,” said NYC Department of Health Commissioner Dr. Oxiris Barbot. “The vaccine has been proven safe and effective in preventing the spread of measles for decades and we have evidence.”

So why are “measles parties” a bad idea?

Because vaccines have been so effective at preventing previously widespread diseases, we tend to forget that measles and other childhood diseases can be very serious,” said CBS2’s Dr. Max Gomez. “Why would you purposely expose your child to measles, causing them to feel awful, run a high fever (which can lead to seizures), risk expensive hospitalization and other potentially serious complications when a simple vaccine can prevent all that?

Plus, there’s the chance that an infected person could transmit measles to an immuno-compromised person (cancer, HIV, other chronic diseases) who could get very sick and even die,” he said. “That’s not being a responsible member of the community.”

So, to recap…

1.) Your child will get sick, possibly dangerously sick. In addition to measles’ miserable symptoms of dry cough, runny nose, sore throat, white spots inside the lining of the cheeks and skin rashes, there’s also fever – up to 105 degrees.

In the modern era, measles is rarely fatal, but Center for Disease Control numbers showed 1 in 10,000 cases resulted in death before 1963. Even now, 1 in 4 people who get measles end up hospitalized.

Complications from measles include bronchitis, pneumonia, encephalitis and serious pregnancy problems. Extreme cases show 1 in 1,000 people suffering brain swelling, which could lead to brain damage.

2.) Your child will get other people sick. Measles is highly contagious from four days before to four days after symptoms appear. The CDC says 9 out of 10 people who are exposed to someone with measles will become infected, though they might not know for up to six days.

3.) Your child will make the “herd immunity” to measles weaker for everyone. Part of the math behind widespread vaccination is to lower the occurrence of the disease everywhere, limiting the chance of exposure to anyone.

In a “measles party,” every child becomes a carrier out in the world, allowing the disease to find new carriers and continue to spread to vulnerable people – babies too young to get vaccinations and people with compromised immune systems.
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Old 04-10-19, 05:43 PM
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Re: Some parents are deliberately infecting their children with Measles

Japan tends to wait until the child has a more mature immune system. There is a reason why. I think both sides are using extremes to prove a point that is based on myth.
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Old 04-10-19, 06:32 PM
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Re: Some parents are deliberately infecting their children with Measles

There’s only one side. The right side. Get vaccinated. Everyone else is just a fucking dolt.
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Old 04-10-19, 06:48 PM
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Re: Some parents are deliberately infecting their children with Measles

Originally Posted by Mabuse View Post
There’s only one side. The right side. Get vaccinated. Everyone else is just a fucking dolt.
This.
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Old 04-10-19, 07:06 PM
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Re: Some parents are deliberately infecting their children with Measles

Obviously, we need dolt vaccination!
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Old 04-10-19, 08:01 PM
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Re: Some parents are deliberately infecting their children with Measles

As a Good Libertarian(tm), I believe these parents should be allowed to choose not to allow the government from dictating what needles their children do and do not need to take in order to participate in a capital-F FREE SOCIETY, and that includes the FREEDOM to infect their children with measles if they want to.
Leave it up to the parents, I say!

/s
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Old 04-10-19, 08:18 PM
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Re: Some parents are deliberately infecting their children with Measles

The only thing I can think of when I hear about these pinheads is that they think vaccination is some kind of "artificial" shield against disease, vs. "building up a natural immunity" by contracting the disease itself. Sort of like putting on sunscreen vs. having a "base tan" (also a very unhealthy plan) as a guard against sunburn. These mental midgets do not realize that the vaccines CAUSE you to build up a natural immunity, and are in reality more effective.
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Old 04-11-19, 03:38 PM
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Re: Some parents are deliberately infecting their children with Measles

Bah, get out of here with your silly science and facts!
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Old 04-11-19, 03:42 PM
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Re: Some parents are deliberately infecting their children with Measles

Originally Posted by DVD Polizei View Post
Japan tends to wait until the child has a more mature immune system. There is a reason why. I think both sides are using extremes to prove a point that is based on myth.
Yeah, that's not correct. Their immunization schedule looks almost identical to ours. The immune system is perfectly adequate at 2 mo of age, that's why the series is started then. Babies are at the highest risk of serious complications from vaccine preventable disease, that's why we start the series as early as we safely and effectively can. Stick to things you know something about.

What I actually came here to post was that I question the veracity of the story of "Measles parties". That might be more of an urban myth than anything (much like razor blades in apples or gang members killing people who flash their lights at cars that don't have their headlights on at night -- things that never actually happened but people generally believe do). A parent who doesn't vaccinate might have difficulty enrolling their child in school. A parent who took their kid to a "Measles party" would absolutely be reported to CPS. That is child endangerment and abuse, plain and simple.
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Old 04-11-19, 04:33 PM
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Re: Some parents are deliberately infecting their children with Measles

There are very few things in which the government does indeed know better. The CDC is one of the "safest" bets in trusting of a govenmental agency. Yes, they've screwed up before, but vaccines are a safe bet.

Before the vaccine was available, some parents chose to take their kids to chcken-pox parties. Now that a vaccine is available, how many parents do that?!! Only the fools and the anti-vaccination idiots. There is far, far less pain and suffering involved in vaccinating your kid against chicken-pox or the Measles, rather than intentionally exposing the children to these diseases.

I don't trust govenment with much, but vaccinations are one thing which I *wish* the govenment would force amongst all the populace, especially the vulnerable children.

The anti-vaxxers are doing great harm to society by existing. Damn it, it's not about making a political statement or "being hip," it's about improving health for *all* citizens and using Medical Science appropriately and reasonably to the lasting benefit of the entire sphere of mankind!
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Old 04-11-19, 04:39 PM
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Re: Some parents are deliberately infecting their children with Measles

Originally Posted by zyzzle View Post
There are very few things in which the government does indeed know better. The CDC is one of the "safest" bets in trusting of a govenmental agency. Yes, they've screwed up before, but vaccines are a safe bet.

Before the vaccine was available, some parents chose to take their kids to chcken-pox parties. Now that a vaccine is available, how many parents do that?!!
Measles is much more serious than Chicken Pox. But even if you wanted to do a Chicken Pox party, you'd have a hard time. That vaccine has been remarkably effective. 18-20 years ago, I had a case of Chicken Pox in my office every few weeks. We'd have to close the room down for the rest of the day due to infection risk. In the past 11 years that I have been in my own office, I have had exactly 3 cases of Chicken Pox -- and one of those was a 9 mo old (too young to get the live vaccine yet) who caught the virus from mother's shingles.
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Old 04-11-19, 04:49 PM
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Re: Some parents are deliberately infecting their children with Measles

Originally Posted by Decker View Post
Yeah, that's not correct. Their immunization schedule looks almost identical to ours. The immune system is perfectly adequate at 2 mo of age, that's why the series is started then. Babies are at the highest risk of serious complications from vaccine preventable disease, that's why we start the series as early as we safely and effectively can. Stick to things you know something about.
He's full of shit as usual, spouting off nonsense as fact (dangerous "fact" in this case). I asked my wife about this (she is from Japan) and you are correct, their immunization schedule is very similar to ours.
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Old 04-11-19, 06:04 PM
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Re: Some parents are deliberately infecting their children with Measles

Well look on the bright side, these parties build up immunity without causing autism. Of course the child may die... But hey... It was successful with regards to preventing autism
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Old 04-11-19, 08:11 PM
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Re: Some parents are deliberately infecting their children with Measles

A great reminder for Antivaxxers.
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Old 04-11-19, 10:07 PM
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Re: Some parents are deliberately infecting their children with Measles

Thanks for your responses everyone. I enjoyed reading them.

Yes, the Chicken Pox parties were indeed common before the vaccine was available. Chicken Pox is far more dangerous to adults than to children, so there was actually a lot of logic behind the parents' decision to do that. But now that there is a Chicken Pox vaccine, any parent who would choose the Chicken Pox party over the vaccine for their child is an idiot, just as with the Measles parties.
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Old 04-11-19, 10:14 PM
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Re: Some parents are deliberately infecting their children with Measles

I do wonder, in raw numbers, just how many anti-vaxxers there are. As in, when push comes to shove, they intentionally would expose their kids to measles rather than do the right thing and preventively give their kids the vaccine innoculation.

I truly hope there aren't too many. But, I'd be very curious to know if this is just a "media frenzy" fearmonger thing, or if thousands and thousands of these dangerous parents actually exist out there in the real world.

Decker, what is your appeasement of the situation based on 20 years of being a pediatrician? Is it 1 out of 100, 1 out of 10, or hopefully far fewer, of your patients who've mentioned the issue, either in passing or practice?
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Old 04-11-19, 10:29 PM
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Re: Some parents are deliberately infecting their children with Measles

Originally Posted by zyzzle View Post
I do wonder, in raw numbers, just how many anti-vaxxers there are. As in, when push comes to shove, they intentionally would expose their kids to measles rather than do the right thing and preventively give their kids the vaccine innoculation.

I truly hope there aren't too many. But, I'd be very curious to know if this is just a "media frenzy" fearmonger thing, or if thousands and thousands of these dangerous parents actually exist out there in the real world.

Decker, what is your appeasement of the situation based on 20 years of being a pediatrician? Is it 1 out of 100, 1 out of 10, or hopefully far fewer, of your patients who've mentioned the issue, either in passing or practice?
There’s plenty and it seems to be growing. I look at several fringe subreddits and see new threads about it every day. Until Assange’s arrest today most of the conspiracy theorists out there have been ranting all week about New York mandating the vaccine.
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Old 04-12-19, 08:40 AM
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Re: Some parents are deliberately infecting their children with Measles

Originally Posted by Decker View Post
Yeah, that's not correct. Their immunization schedule looks almost identical to ours. The immune system is perfectly adequate at 2 mo of age, that's why the series is started then. Babies are at the highest risk of serious complications from vaccine preventable disease, that's why we start the series as early as we safely and effectively can. Stick to things you know something about.
I'm 100% for vaccinations, but I think due to their importance to society, it's taboo to talk about any risks. Would vaccines makers removed mercury from vaccines without the anti-vaxxers complaining?

Regarding the two month schedule, I have seen where they don't account for premature births. If the baby is born two months early , they still give the baby vaccines on the standard scheduled.
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Old 04-12-19, 11:31 AM
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Re: Some parents are deliberately infecting their children with Measles

Originally Posted by PerryD View Post
I'm 100% for vaccinations, but I think due to their importance to society, it's taboo to talk about any risks. Would vaccines makers removed mercury from vaccines without the anti-vaxxers complaining?
I do think it is important to actually discuss risks of vaccination, but they're mostly mild risks like local redness, swelling, low-grade fever. But when I started out, we had the old DTP vaccine that was very, very antigenic and caused high fever, severe pain and seizures sometimes. It's what really birthed the antivax movement and thankfully was replaced with the less antigenic (though less effective) DTaP vaccine. The "mercury" in vaccine was thimerisol. Never really shown to be harmful, though I am happy it's out of vaccines. For years the antivax folks harped on it. Now there is none in any shots except multi-dose flu, which I never buy just so I can honestly say "It's in none of my vaccines". Now they complain about the "aluminum" in vaccines -- easy enough to counter since there's aluminum in breast milk and way more in formula than in the vaccines. I often refer parents to this web page from Children's Hospital of Philadelphia

Regarding the two month schedule, I have seen where they don't account for premature births. If the baby is born two months early , they still give the baby vaccines on the standard scheduled.
Yes, the vaccine schedule is based on chronological age, not gestational age. That said, there is a minimum weight requirement for Hep B so it's not given at birth to tiny premies and most super-premies don't get their shots until they are about to go home from the NICU rather than right when they turn 2 mo old (which makes sense because they are unlikely to be exposed to any vaccine preventable illness while in an isolet in the NICU with their strict visitation standards).
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Old 04-14-19, 11:31 PM
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Re: Some parents are deliberately infecting their children with Measles

Mark my words: Soon there will be vigilantes going around like the Punisher tranqing the kids of anti-vaxxers.
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Old 04-15-19, 10:02 AM
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Re: Some parents are deliberately infecting their children with Measles

Anybody mind if I change the thread title to "Some parents are deliberately idiots"? I'm very tempted.
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Old 04-15-19, 10:05 AM
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Re: Some parents are deliberately infecting their children with Measles

We should take all these parents and make them go to "HIV Parties".
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Old 04-15-19, 10:13 AM
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Re: Some parents are deliberately infecting their children with Measles

Originally Posted by Decker View Post
What I actually came here to post was that I question the veracity of the story of "Measles parties". That might be more of an urban myth than anything (much like razor blades in apples or gang members killing people who flash their lights at cars that don't have their headlights on at night -- things that never actually happened but people generally believe do). A parent who doesn't vaccinate might have difficulty enrolling their child in school. A parent who took their kid to a "Measles party" would absolutely be reported to CPS. That is child endangerment and abuse, plain and simple.
Yeah, I haven't seen a single report regarding these parties actually happening, but rather just the typical "IF they're happening, THIS is why they're a bad idea..." kind of thing. But to be fair, I haven't really dug into it that much. But even the "article" in the OP doesn't have an author's name in the byline. That's just one red flag.

Can anyone provide evidence that the parties actually happen; and in a frequency that anyone should even care about?

Originally Posted by Story
Anybody mind if I change the thread title to "Some parents are deliberately idiots"? I'm very tempted.
Maybe just "Some people are deliberately idiots" but then... that could be the topic of practically every thread, really.
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Old 04-15-19, 10:26 AM
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Re: Some parents are deliberately infecting their children with Measles

Maybe all Otter threads should start that way:

Some people are deliberately idiots: Man gives inheritance to goat.

Some people are deliberately idiots: Customer service agent "accidentally" cuts off my service!

Some people are deliberately idiots: If the meal isn't free, I'm not paying! Anybody else?

BTW Dan, you had me going with the Libertarian post. I thought, oh no, not Dan! Then I figured out the meaning behind /s.
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Old 04-15-19, 10:34 AM
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Re: Some parents are deliberately infecting their children with Measles

Originally Posted by story View Post
BTW Dan, you had me going with the Libertarian post. I thought, oh no, not Dan! Then I figured out the meaning behind /s.
I aim to please!

And yeah, I use /s because I'm not really a fan of the emoji, which is kind of indistinguishable from an eye roll. I think sarcasm is hard to convey in an emoji, so /s is my go-to.
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