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Nickdawgy Visits Another Car Dealer... But This Time, His Brother-In-Law Is Buying

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Nickdawgy Visits Another Car Dealer... But This Time, His Brother-In-Law Is Buying

Old 10-15-13, 08:07 PM
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Re: Nickdawgy Visits Another Car Dealer... But This Time, His Brother-In-Law Is Buyin

Originally Posted by Deftones View Post
Elantra is the smaller/cheaper car here, comparable to a Civic. The Sonata is comparable to an Accord. I think you are confusing the two cars. While I think it's absurd to pay $32k for a Sonata, I can see how that can be done if you get all the options. There's no way you could get an Elantra to $32k. Just looking at their site, the most I can get the MSRP on one is about $25k.
It is the Hybrid version of the car. He could have gotten the normal version with all the options for 5-7k less. He's not going to save that in gas over the lifetime of the car. He might get a tax credit though if the model hasn't reached its sales rebate limit.
Old 10-15-13, 10:41 PM
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Re: Nickdawgy Visits Another Car Dealer... But This Time, His Brother-In-Law Is Buyin

I think his reasoning was he could have gotten a Genesis or even a lower end Lexus maybe. But it wouldn't come close to the options the Sonata has. That and he wanted Hybrid.

I mean realistically it's not like if he had great credit he'd be able to talk them down five grand on the price. At least I'm assuming.

Oh and no I didn't co-sign. I'm still building my credit. I wouldn't co-sign if my credit was 800+.
Old 10-15-13, 11:08 PM
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Re: Nickdawgy Visits Another Car Dealer... But This Time, His Brother-In-Law Is Buyin

Originally Posted by nickdawgy View Post
That and he wanted Hybrid.
Because he cares about such things, or because he thinks he's saving gas money?
Old 10-16-13, 12:10 AM
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Re: Nickdawgy Visits Another Car Dealer... But This Time, His Brother-In-Law Is Buyin

Something different he said. He always wanted one. He's not an environmentalist or anything, or under the impression he will save thousands of dollars in gas.

We looked at an Accord (they have a Hybrid coming out next month I guess, but he didn't want to wait, and said it'd be more than the Sonata, which is probably true), a Camry Hybrid (pretty expensive, I think it was $35k), and a Ford Fusion Hybrid (I've heard great things, but also more expensive), and he chose the Sonata.

The 2014 Sonata Hybrid is supposed to be out soon, too, but he was fine with the 2013. It's a nice looking car.
Old 10-16-13, 12:13 AM
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Re: Nickdawgy Visits Another Car Dealer... But This Time, His Brother-In-Law Is Buyin

Did you tell him he'll be paying thousands of dollars per year on interest?

He might as well be driving a Jeep Cherokee SRT V8 (5 MPG).

---

I hope he has a secure job (cough) which can guarantee him 3 years, because these days, that's very hard to find. If he can pay out $1K per month, then he'll be fine, but I'd be financing a car for half that amount (which you could easily find these days) so I could pay it off even sooner.
Old 10-16-13, 03:25 AM
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Re: Nickdawgy Visits Another Car Dealer... But This Time, His Brother-In-Law Is Buyin

Originally Posted by nickdawgy View Post
Yeah, I guess he thought the dealer would be able to approve him more than the credit union or anywhere else would.
That's how your brother in law gives the dealer all the power, by letting the dealer declare what rate he can get rather than checking for himself. He just leaves himself at the dealer's mercy.


Originally Posted by nickdawgy View Post
The car definitely won't end up back at the dealer, at least not anytime soon. Maybe if he trades it in in 4-5 years. He told me his plan is to pay it off within three years, and he now has the income to do so. He said he is going to pay at least $1k a month on it.
You should update us in six months or a year to let us know how that $1k per month plan is going.


Originally Posted by nickdawgy View Post
The thing that made me mad about the warranty is the finance manager gave him the whole peace of mind speech, you know the "you have a lot of electronics in the car, if they break it'll be pricey, and this will help..."
It's really bad when somebody sells a product by telling you how it's going to break. I would be less concerned with the electronics and more concerned with the rest of the car.

Originally Posted by nickdawgy View Post
He also told him he'd knock off $500 if he bought it now. Then added it back on the next day when he told him he lowered his payments, along with the security thing.
That's why you always separate out price of the car and interest rate, otherwise they will play these games. You never want to talk monthly payments.
Old 10-16-13, 03:42 AM
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Re: Nickdawgy Visits Another Car Dealer... But This Time, His Brother-In-Law Is Buyin

Originally Posted by DVD Polizei View Post
Did you tell him he'll be paying thousands of dollars per year on interest?

He might as well be driving a Jeep Cherokee SRT V8 (5 MPG).

---

I hope he has a secure job (cough) which can guarantee him 3 years, because these days, that's very hard to find. If he can pay out $1K per month, then he'll be fine, but I'd be financing a car for half that amount (which you could easily find these days) so I could pay it off even sooner.
Yeah, like I said he got a big check from the Army, and is on disability for the rest of his life. He did two tours in Iraq, and has PTSD, a bad back, bad knees, and a few other things. He gets more than enough a month to pay the 1k and rent/utilities in his own place.

I remember when he had his first car, a 2001 Nissan Frontier, he paid it off in 2 years. That was only a $15k loan but still, he had a bonus from re-upping, and he had hazard pay later from Iraq. He was pretty good about making the payments, never late, always more than the minimum. His credit problems came later with credit cards.
Old 10-16-13, 07:16 AM
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Re: Nickdawgy Visits Another Car Dealer... But This Time, His Brother-In-Law Is Buyin

Originally Posted by nickdawgy View Post
We went down to the Hyundai (we previously checked Toyota, Ford, Nissan, and Kia) dealer and he found a car he liked, which was a 2013 Sonata Hybrid. A nice looking car. I believe the sticker price was $31k for fully loaded.
I stopped reading here. After this point, regardless of what happened, it is your brother-in-law's fault. He has no business buying a $31K car.
Old 10-16-13, 02:30 PM
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Re: Nickdawgy Visits Another Car Dealer... But This Time, His Brother-In-Law Is Buyin

Better than buying a $17k car and having it marked up $2k and even more with options. That was me when I bought the first Honda.
Old 10-16-13, 03:14 PM
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Re: Nickdawgy Visits Another Car Dealer... But This Time, His Brother-In-Law Is Buyin

Originally Posted by nickdawgy View Post
Better than buying a $17k car and having it marked up $2k and even more with options. That was me when I bought the first Honda.
I'm not sure that it is, $17k is cheaper and it sounds like his car was also marked up quite a bit and even more with options.
Old 10-16-13, 06:48 PM
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Re: Nickdawgy Visits Another Car Dealer... But This Time, His Brother-In-Law Is Buyin

Well until the options are removed. But what I was saying is I remember people saying they couldn't believe I paid 33k for a Civic.
Old 10-16-13, 07:17 PM
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Re: Nickdawgy Visits Another Car Dealer... But This Time, His Brother-In-Law Is Buyin

Originally Posted by nickdawgy View Post
Better than buying a $17k car and having it marked up $2k and even more with options.
Given the choice, would he rather have a $31k car, or a $17k car with options and $12,000 cash in the trunk?
Old 10-16-13, 07:25 PM
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Re: Nickdawgy Visits Another Car Dealer... But This Time, His Brother-In-Law Is Buyin

Originally Posted by nickdawgy View Post
Well until the options are removed. But what I was saying is I remember people saying they couldn't believe I paid 33k for a Civic.
Civics are great (I drive one), but I the only options I'm missing is the moonroof and alloy wheels. I only paid $13k, and although used, it's certified until 100k miles and since Hondas are built like tanks I'm sure it won't matter much. I've had the car two years and have only had routine maintenance.

In regards to your BIL, when you have that amount of money you're putting down you have a lot more leverage. Not only that, but regardless of how poor his credit is (mine was shoddy when I financed my vehicle), the fact that he's investing in a purchase like that could parlay in to a potential lower interest rate with an outside lender.

Regardless of the the dealership adding on more things they don't need, he could've still gotten a better deal and her certaintly should've gotten more than a few grand off for plunking down over $10,000. It's like he went in to the dealership waving a stack of cash and thought the dealership had the leverage.

The more money you go in there with, the more power you have. It took me nearly 12 hours of back and forth bickering to negotiate my price down, and I even got the dealer to buyback my piece of shit car without even seeing it for more than it was worth.

Honestly it seems like you've learned from the 20% fiasco but given your stories of your BIL I'm not surprised by the outcome. It's just surprising that someone would let people get away from gouging them like this when they don't have to.
Old 10-16-13, 09:50 PM
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Re: Nickdawgy Visits Another Car Dealer... But This Time, His Brother-In-Law Is Buyin

Originally Posted by nickdawgy View Post
Yeah, like I said he got a big check from the Army, and is on disability for the rest of his life. He did two tours in Iraq, and has PTSD, a bad back, bad knees, and a few other things. He gets more than enough a month to pay the 1k and rent/utilities in his own place.

I remember when he had his first car, a 2001 Nissan Frontier, he paid it off in 2 years. That was only a $15k loan but still, he had a bonus from re-upping, and he had hazard pay later from Iraq. He was pretty good about making the payments, never late, always more than the minimum. His credit problems came later with credit cards.
Ah ok. Well, hope he does ok with everything. Guaranteed income is a good thing, and very rare.

You might try to talk to him about buying a house or something.
Old 10-17-13, 04:13 AM
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Re: Nickdawgy Visits Another Car Dealer... But This Time, His Brother-In-Law Is Buyin

Originally Posted by My Other Self View Post
Civics are great (I drive one), but I the only options I'm missing is the moonroof and alloy wheels. I only paid $13k, and although used, it's certified until 100k miles and since Hondas are built like tanks I'm sure it won't matter much. I've had the car two years and have only had routine maintenance.

In regards to your BIL, when you have that amount of money you're putting down you have a lot more leverage. Not only that, but regardless of how poor his credit is (mine was shoddy when I financed my vehicle), the fact that he's investing in a purchase like that could parlay in to a potential lower interest rate with an outside lender.

Regardless of the the dealership adding on more things they don't need, he could've still gotten a better deal and her certaintly should've gotten more than a few grand off for plunking down over $10,000. It's like he went in to the dealership waving a stack of cash and thought the dealership had the leverage.

The more money you go in there with, the more power you have. It took me nearly 12 hours of back and forth bickering to negotiate my price down, and I even got the dealer to buyback my piece of shit car without even seeing it for more than it was worth.

Honestly it seems like you've learned from the 20% fiasco but given your stories of your BIL I'm not surprised by the outcome. It's just surprising that someone would let people get away from gouging them like this when they don't have to.
I think mine was 17k, and fully loaded with leather and nav. Maybe came to 24? But they added the warranty and GAP which I later removed, but the price ended up being 28 and then closer to 30-31 after tax and license I believe. It's still going strong, only 24k miles in nearly three years.

Originally Posted by DVD Polizei View Post
Ah ok. Well, hope he does ok with everything. Guaranteed income is a good thing, and very rare.

You might try to talk to him about buying a house or something.
Yeah, I was thinking of that. Like a VA loan or something.

Here's what happened at the dealer yesterday. We went to talk to him about the warranty and the lo-jack thing. He immediately says if you take off the warranty and lo-jack, he will raise the rate again. I told him I don't think he can do that without rewriting the contract.

So he asks if he wants me to rewrite the contract and I said of course not, but I don't want to pay $2800 for a warranty and $1000 for lo-jack. So he tells me how good the warranty is and how it's normally 3000-3500 bucks and my BIL got a deal at 2800. He said the lo-jack would save me on insurance and it's a good thing to have.

I told him if he was going to keep the stuff on the car, he'd have to lower the price or give us something more to sweeten the deal. He comes back and says they all went to bat for my BIL and got him a deal he couldn't have gotten elsewhere.

I said we could have just canceled through the warranty company and not even went to the dealer, and he says ok, I have an idea, and you'll love me after this. I'll talk to my manager and see about giving you a few hundred dollars on a gift card for the parts shop. I told him that's a start and he said to come back tomorrow and see what he managed to get.

I know he was pretty much full of shit about everything, and I think my BIL is still going to cancel even if he gives him a gift card. He kept on claiming he only makes a few hundred dollars total off the deal.

This was the sales manager by the way. The funny thing is I saw the sales guy that helped my BIL was there and the guy didn't say a word to him the whole time, didn't even make eye contact. No hello or nothing. But he was his best friend during the sales process

I can't wait til I'm ready to buy again. I might even go to the same dealer and pretend like I'm interested and attempt to walk out just to see what happens.
Old 10-17-13, 01:21 PM
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Re: Nickdawgy Visits Another Car Dealer... But This Time, His Brother-In-Law Is Buyin

Originally Posted by nickdawgy View Post
Better than buying a $17k car and having it marked up $2k and even more with options. That was me when I bought the first Honda.
Originally Posted by DarthVong View Post
Actually it's the best idea for people with bad credit. You have a better chance of getting approved at a lower rate than you would for a preowned.

Banks are looking at it as getting their money back if you default on the loan. It's more difficult with preowned because of that and book value of the preowned. Book value is the amount a lender will approve on a particular preowned car.

The absolute BEST way to get approved and improve your credit is a short term lease. Ford Credit will approve almost anyone in a lease with little to no money down and within 24 months you'll increase your credit score to be able to finance after at the 0% rate.
It's not easier to buy new than used with bad credit. I've certainly never heard that. A car depreciates the fastest in the first 2 years - that's exactly the time in which a bank doesn't want to loan you money on it.


Buying a ~2-yr old car is always the best decision (fiscally) unless you want to drive around an old beater. Half the depreciation has occurred at this point. It's very well cited as one of the best bang/buck times to buy a car, short of getting it at like 7-10 years when it has gone down to a couple of thousand.

Got loan approval from my credit union at like 11 or 12% (I forget). Guarantee my credit rating is probably not any better than Nickdawgy's BIL with our fun foreclosure/Ch7 history/medical bills history.

At a CU typically they do only want to finance blue-book trade-in value on a car. That's part of making sure you're not getting a terrible deal. You can totally get a car at this price too if you pick well, negotiate well (with no loan/payment bullshit mixed in). My CU would do blue-book retail for a certified used vehicle.

Looked all over the state for the right car. With no loan shenanigans to figure in the mix, you can then focus on getting the deal you want.

Got my car, 2 yrs old/36k for blue-book retail out the door (tax, title and license for $18.5k) - so about $1200 under book value. First time they told me no negotiating on the price, a couple of weeks later, they said "sure". It's part of that whole bargaining thing.

I never even saw the salesperson or the dealership -talked with their internet sales manager, they even offered to me and had two guys drive up 100+ miles to drop it off to me. This was a little crazy, but with kids' school/job/work and only one car, it was hard to find time to drive 2 hours south to go to the dealership. And we gave it a very good test drive. I should have done an inspection too, but I wasn't too worried on a certified used car with such low miles.


The biggest way to get screwed is being focused on payments, and getting the loan at the dealership.

The warranty and lojack is stupid. Especially the extra warranty on a NEW car? And on a Hyundai? They already have a 5yr/60k warranty!

Last edited by GreenMonkey; 10-17-13 at 01:28 PM.
Old 10-17-13, 05:51 PM
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Re: Nickdawgy Visits Another Car Dealer... But This Time, His Brother-In-Law Is Buyin

Yeah, I agree, the warranty thing is really stupid. We are going to the dealer today to see what kind of excuse they try and throw his way this time.

I think buying a 2013 car was his way of buying cheaper. Maybe. The 2014's are out now, and I imagine a few thousand more?
Old 10-24-13, 06:56 PM
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Re: Nickdawgy Visits Another Car Dealer... But This Time, His Brother-In-Law Is Buyin

So I hit up the dealer with my BIL again. The Sales Manager tried to offer him a $250 gift card for parts/services if he didn't cancel the warranty. I told my BIL to decline the offer.

The Sales Manager then came back with an offer of $550 cash to keep the warranty and the lo-jack type device. I asked him where he came up with that total, and he said it's about half of what the device cost. My BIL countered with $750. He said he wouldn't be making any money on the deal (remember it's a $2,800 warranty and $1,000 lo-jack device) so he offered $634, and two oil changes.

Should he take it or just cancel them both as planned? Correct me if I am wrong, but the almost $4,000 it costs for the items in question would be taken off the end of the loan, and this is just like saying "here's $634 so I can keep your $4,000" right?

I mean the lo-jack thing isn't necessary and the warranty won't take effect til the original warranty runs out, I believe. They like to claim the worst case scenario (what if your AC, or navigation goes out, it's expensive you need this warranty) but is the car not covered already?

He didn't agree to anything or sign anything, so this new deal isn't bound in stone. We will be going back on Monday, so if anyone has questions or can help with what to say/ask the sales manager/finance guy, just post here. We appreciate the help.
Old 10-24-13, 07:10 PM
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Re: Nickdawgy Visits Another Car Dealer... But This Time, His Brother-In-Law Is Buyin

I'd go over the car dealership's head and cancel with the company if you have to. But I'm not sure how it works in your state. Typically you have 30 days to cancel it and you have to pay a minor admin fee or something.

Best advice I found was here

http://www.bankrate.com/finance/auto...-warranty.aspx

I honestly can't believe it could be legal to jack your interest rate on the car loan after it's been signed and done. If you read the loan contract carefully I would think it would have to say that in there somewhere.
Old 10-25-13, 01:46 AM
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Re: Nickdawgy Visits Another Car Dealer... But This Time, His Brother-In-Law Is Buyin

Apparently the dealer had backed off the raise the rate claims. How much interest is this costing him over 72 months? $2875 for the warranty and $995 for the security.

I can't cancel through the company and nobody will tell me how much the warranty costs the dealer. The company that sold the warranty fed me a line about how the dealer probably sold it to my BIL cheaper.
Old 10-25-13, 06:21 PM
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Re: Nickdawgy Visits Another Car Dealer... But This Time, His Brother-In-Law Is Buyin

Finance guy called today. Wants him to go down and resign the papers. They are claiming it's good news as they want to lower his payments. I'm wondering if they are trying to add something on to recoup the $634 they offered him.
Old 10-25-13, 11:13 PM
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Re: Nickdawgy Visits Another Car Dealer... But This Time, His Brother-In-Law Is Buyin

Walk away. Seriously.
Old 10-25-13, 11:23 PM
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Re: Nickdawgy Visits Another Car Dealer... But This Time, His Brother-In-Law Is Buyin

I've never heard of it nearly taking a month to buy a new car. What's with all this back and forth with the dealer still? Anytime I've financed a vehicle it was done in the same day and I never had to go back to the dealership.
Old 10-26-13, 02:06 AM
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Re: Nickdawgy Visits Another Car Dealer... But This Time, His Brother-In-Law Is Buyin

Well I went with him today and talked to another finance manager. The new contract was through a different bank and actually lower. They lowered the price of the car by $1,500 and everything else went down. The amount financed, the interest rate, and the finance charges. Also the payment went down another $35 a month.

I was pleasantly surprised. For once.
Old 10-26-13, 09:28 PM
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Re: Nickdawgy Visits Another Car Dealer... But This Time, His Brother-In-Law Is Buyin

This is going to end badly.

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