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Dutch filmmaker who criticized Islam gunned down in Amsterdam

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Dutch filmmaker who criticized Islam gunned down in Amsterdam

Old 11-02-04, 09:06 AM
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Dutch filmmaker who criticized Islam gunned down in Amsterdam

http://canadaeast.com/apps/pbcs.dll/.../CPW/135536046
AMSTERDAM, Netherlands (AP) - A Dutch filmmaker who had received death threats after releasing a movie criticizing the treatment of women under Islam was slain in Amsterdam on Tuesday, police said.

A suspect was arrested after a shootout with officers that left him wounded, police said. Filmmaker Theo van Gogh had been threatened after the August airing of the movie Submission, which he made with a right-wing Dutch politician who had renounced the Islamic faith of her birth.

Van Gogh had received police protection after its release. Dutch national broadcaster NOS and other media reported van Gogh's killer shot and stabbed his victim and left a note on his body. NOS said witnesses described the attacker as having an "Arab appearance."

A witness who lives in the neighbourhood heard six shots and saw the man concealing a gun. She said he walked away slowly, spoke with someone at the edge of the park and then ran.

"He was walking slowly, like he was trying to be cool," she said, describing him as wearing a long beard and Islamic garb.

"He was either an Arabic man or someone disguised as a Muslim," she said.

The slain filmmaker was the great grandson of the brother of famous Dutch painter Vincent van Gogh, who was also named Theo.

Dutch Prime Minister Jan Peter Balkenende called on the Dutch people to remain calm.

"Nothing is known about the motive," he said in a written statement.

"I want to call on everyone not to jump to far-reaching conclusions. The facts must first be carefully weighed so let's allow the investigators to do their jobs."

Balkenende praised van Gogh as a proponent of free speech who had "outspoken opinions."

"It would be unacceptable if a difference of opinion led to this brutal murder," he said.

Police spokesman Eric Vermeulen said the attacker fled to the nearby East Park and was arrested after exchanging gunfire with police. Both the suspect and a policeman suffered minor injuries.

"They were conscious" when taken to hospital, Vermeulen said.

Van Gogh's killing immediately rekindled memories of the 2002 assassination of Dutch politician Pim Fortuyn who polarized the country with his anti-immigration views and was shot dead days before national elections.

In addition to his film, van Gogh also wrote columns about Islam that were published on his website, www.theovangogh.nl, and in the Dutch newspaper Metro.

The short television film Submission aired on Dutch television in August, enraged the Muslim community in the Netherlands.

It told the fictional story of a Muslim woman forced into a violent marriage, raped by a relative and brutally punished for adultery.

The English-language film was scripted by a right-wing politician who years ago renounced the Islamic faith of her birth and now refers to herself as an "ex-Muslim."

Somali-born Ayaan Hirsi Ali, a member of the Dutch parliament, has repeatedly outraged fellow Muslims by criticizing Islamic customs and the failure of Muslim families to adopt Dutch ways.

The place of Muslim immigrants in Dutch society has long been a contentious issue in the Netherlands, where many right-wing politicians have pushed for tougher immigration laws and say Muslims already settled in the country must make a greater effort to assimilate.

Van Gogh, 47, had often come under criticism for his controversial movies. In December, his next movie 06-05, about the May 6, 2002 assassination of Fortuyn, is scheduled to debut on the Internet.
This is wrong on many levels but:

"Islam Bam-Bam in Amsterdam"

Last edited by bhk; 11-02-04 at 09:09 AM.
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Old 11-02-04, 09:15 AM
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Theo Van Gogh?
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Old 11-02-04, 09:17 AM
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Old 11-02-04, 09:33 AM
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Originally posted by Groucho
Theo Van Gogh?
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Old 11-02-04, 09:58 AM
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How sad. At least the murderer is in custody.
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Old 11-02-04, 10:18 AM
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"It would be unacceptable if a difference of opinion led to this brutal murder," he said.
What circumstances would make it acceptable?
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Old 11-02-04, 10:42 AM
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Originally posted by Groucho
Theo Van Gogh?
Was he hit in the ear?

I'll save you all the trouble:
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Old 11-02-04, 11:34 AM
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Re: Dutch filmmaker who criticized Islam gunned down in Amsterdam

"Nothing is known about the motive," he said in a written statement.
Yep, it's a big question mark.
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Old 11-02-04, 03:55 PM
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Nice one.

On my recent visit to Orlando I had the pleasure of speaking with alot of immigrants, and they all differ very much from the "Dutch" immigrants.

For instance, I spoke with a Marrocan cab driver who told me his sister lives in Holland. Even he stated that all Marrocan's in the netherlands are lazy, what else would you want with our social welfare system?
I spoke with a Tunesian cab driver whilst having a tour around Chicago, and these were long and interesting conversations. Many people find it hard that foreign people wish to speak their own language to their relatives, I do not, and can respect the fact that they do. Imagine yourself and your family moving to Japan all of a sudden, you learn to speak their language as time goes by, but are you going to start speaking Japanese to eachother? Most probably not. He also spoke out about his muslim beleifs, and that Americans did not have faith. They beleive it's wrong to not respect someone who created you, once again it's one's beleif, and prooves that religious beleifs are not innate, but must be taught on.
The word of God is spread, but if it wouldn't have been, nobody would know of any kind of existence.
People do not start praying to God out of nowhere, they have to have seen someone else do it.
They also have strong family beleif, which I find respectable, he thought it was insane relatives sometimes didn't see eachother for years on end. And I somewhat agree with that fact. It's all the more respectable to care that much for your loved ones, and not to destroy a bond.

I feel like I've lost the point to my message a bit, but you get it.
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Old 11-02-04, 07:21 PM
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Originally posted by The Black
He also spoke out about his muslim beleifs, and that Americans did not have faith.
the same Muslim beliefs that make them blow up buses in Israel, crush hijacked planes into our buildings and gun down the infidels who disagree with the said beliefs? Nice one
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Old 11-03-04, 03:21 AM
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The frontpage of morningpaper De Telegraaf here in Holland:

http://telegraaf-i.telegraaf.nl/dail...3_1/pagina.php

On top it says 'slaughtered'.

He was shot off his bike, after he had brought his kid to school. Theo tried to get away, but was gunned a couple times more, then stabbed and he had his throat slit... After that a note was stabbed into his chest. On the photo you see the knive is still in his body.

I cried a lot yesterday, and i'm sick and tired of my own country...

-RIP Theo-

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Old 11-03-04, 03:37 AM
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Boy, if Christians started killing every critic it has here in America...a lot of you heathen would be kil'd.
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Old 11-03-04, 08:00 AM
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Originally posted by Giorgio
He was shot off his bike, after he had brought his kid to school. Theo tried to get away, but was gunned a couple times more, then stabbed and he had his throat slit... After that a note was stabbed into his chest. On the photo you see the knive is still in his body.
very God-loving way to kill someone, don't you agree, The Black?
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Old 11-03-04, 11:30 AM
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This story is obviously false. European countries have strict gun control laws so crimes like this are impossible.
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Old 11-03-04, 01:56 PM
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I am not agreeing these actions are right! I strongly oppose them!

I only stated I find some of their beleifs quite respectable, and it probably is a shame we don't do the same. And in NO WAY am I stating that killing for religion is respectable, such people do not deserve to live.
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Old 11-03-04, 02:00 PM
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Originally posted by aintnosin
This story is obviously false. European countries have strict gun control laws so crimes like this are impossible.
Jesus Christ you're a *****ing ignorant dumbass!
Though you do rank #3 in my book.

#2 would be: I'm never going to the Netherlands, everybody is a drug addict, and all the women are hookers (some random conversation with an American woman in Orlando).

and #1: Holland, isn't that about a two hours drive from here? (some random conversation with an American man in Denver).
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Old 11-03-04, 02:02 PM
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If you're going to hang around here, you'll have to do a better job at recognizing sarcasm.
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Old 11-03-04, 04:05 PM
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http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=stor...maker_slain_25
Arrested in Slaying of Dutch Filmmaker

Wed Nov 3, 1:41 PM ET

By TOBY STERLING, Associated Press Writer

AMSTERDAM, Netherlands - Dutch police have arrested eight suspected Islamic radicals as part of the investigation into the brutal slaying of outspoken filmmaker Theo van Gogh, prosecutors said Wednesday.
The suspects were detained in the 24 hours following Van Gogh's killing while he bicycled on an Amsterdam street, prosecution spokeswoman Dop Kruimel told The Associated Press.


Six detainees are of Moroccan origin, one is Algerian and the other has dual Spanish-Moroccan nationality, she said.


The suspect in the killing a 26-year-old suspected Muslim extremist with dual Moroccan-Dutch citizenship was arrested Tuesday after a shootout with police. The unidentified suspect was wounded in the leg.


Kruimel said the suspects, whose identities were not released, were detained and released during an October 2003 investigation into a potential terrorist threat.


"The suspects were detained at a number of residences searched in connection with the Van Gogh investigation," Kruimel said. "They were previously known to us. As of now only one suspect is being held for Van Gogh's murder, but the investigation will determine if others may have been connected."


Van Gogh, 47, who received death threats after his recent movie sharply criticized how women are treated under Islam, was repeatedly shot and stabbed to death on an Amsterdam street Tuesday.


"Don't do it. Don't do it. Have mercy. Have mercy!" the Algemeen Dagblad newspaper quoted Van Gogh as begging his killer.


Another Dutch newspaper, the Telegraaf daily, carried a large color photograph of Van Gogh's body with a knife protruding from his chest under the headline "Butchered."


"We're not going to take this," the Dagblad said.


The paper said the killer shot Van Gogh eight or nine times, then calmly slipped his weapon in the pocket of a beige raincoat before bending over his victim and slitting his throat.


Dutch Justice Minister Piet Hein Donner said the suspect "acted out of radical Islamic fundamentalist convictions" and added that he had contacts with a group that was under surveillance by the Dutch secret service.


The suspect allegedly is friends with Samir Azzouz, an 18-year-old Muslim of Moroccan origin awaiting trial on charges of planning a terrorist attack targeting a nuclear reactor and Amsterdam's Schiphol Airport, NOS Dutch television reported.


Azzouz was among those arrested in October 2003 but released for lack of evidence. He was re-arrested in June.


On Wednesday, well-wishers brought hundreds of flowers to the spot where Van Gogh was slain. Others brought beer, cigarettes and cactus plants a reference to Van Gogh's prickly artistic nature and his habit of giving guests on his television talk show a cactus as a gift.


"This is an attack on my country," said Masite Halici, a young Dutch woman who came with a rose. "I didn't enjoy his art at all, but we need people who stand up for what they think."


Van Gogh an award-winning filmmaker, television producer and newspaper columnist once mocked a prominent Dutch Jew, referred to Jesus as "the rotten fish" of Nazareth and called a radical Muslim politician "Allah's pimp."





The great-grandson of painter Vincent Van Gogh's brother released the fictional film "Submission" in August about a Muslim woman who was beaten and sexually abused, drawing the ire of some Muslims and generating death threats against him.

In the fictional story, a veiled Muslim woman spoke about her violent marriage, being raped by a relative and later brutally punished for adultery. In some scenes, the actress' naked body is shown through a transparent gown. One scene shows her body with Quranic verses written on it.

Some Muslims and women's groups said the movie's depiction of the abuse of women was insensitive.

In a recent radio interview, Van Gogh, a chain-smoking social critic and satirist, dismissed the threats and called the movie "the best protection I could have. It's not something I worry about."

Police kept watch on Van Gogh's house immediately after the film's airing but dropped that precaution because there was no concrete evidence of a threat.

The English-language film was written by Somali-born Ayaan Hirsi Ali, a lawmaker who has outraged Muslims by criticizing Islamic customs and the failure of Muslim families to adopt Dutch ways.

Her spokeswoman, Ingrid Pouw, said Hirsi Ali was "deeply shocked" by the slaying.

About 20,000 people poured into Amsterdam's central square to protest the attack. Many blew horns and whistles and banged pots and pans.

The government held late-night crisis meetings and the Immigration Minister met with Muslim groups to discuss how to avoid violent confrontations with the Muslim community.

Dutch Muslim groups condemned the killing and called for reconciliation, expressing fears of possible reprisals against Muslims. Several Muslim groups planned rallies in the Dutch capital to protest the attack.

Van Gogh's killing came at a time of increased tensions in the Netherlands, where many blame violent crime on the Muslim minority, mainly made up of immigrants.

The killing instantly recalled the assassination of anti-immigration politician Pim Fortuyn, who was killed in 2002 by an animal-rights activist.

In the aftermath of Fortuyn's assassination, 10 percent of the Dutch electorate voted for his anti-immigration party, and during the last two years the Netherlands has taken the toughest measures in the European Union (news - web sites) to clamp down on immigration.
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Old 11-03-04, 04:19 PM
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Originally posted by The Black
Jesus Christ you're a *****ing ignorant dumbass!
Though you do rank #3 in my book.

#2 would be: I'm never going to the Netherlands, everybody is a drug addict, and all the women are hookers (some random conversation with an American woman in Orlando).

and #1: Holland, isn't that about a two hours drive from here? (some random conversation with an American man in Denver).
You should change #1 to read "Holland, where citizens couldn't catch sarcasm with an obvious net"
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Old 11-03-04, 04:52 PM
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Originally posted by aintnosin
This story is obviously false. European countries have strict gun control laws so crimes like this are impossible.
A very sad story, but I have to admit I needed the laugh this post gave me.
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Old 11-03-04, 09:16 PM
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Originally posted by The Black
Jesus Christ you're a *****ing ignorant dumbass!
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Old 11-03-04, 09:47 PM
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Originally posted by The Black
#2 would be: I'm never going to the Netherlands, everybody is a drug addict
dude, i want to go for that very reason
I'd love to try some spacecakes.
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Old 11-04-04, 07:58 AM
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Originally posted by Cool Kitten
dude, i want to go for that very reason
I'd love to try some spacecakes.
Oh come on, you're a pharmicist. We're not going to believe for one minute that you need to go to the Netherlands to get your fix!
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Old 11-05-04, 11:46 AM
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Originally posted by The Black
#2 would be: I'm never going to the Netherlands, everybody is a drug addict, and all the women are hookers (some random conversation with an American woman in Orlando).


So that would make my mother a hooker, my brother and myself a drug addict?

Tsss.. Back to your cave troll.
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Old 11-05-04, 12:08 PM
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Originally posted by exm
So that would make my mother a hooker, my brother and myself a drug addict?

Tsss.. Back to your cave troll.


Read it again... The whole post this time. Also take note of what his location is.
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