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The Illinois Senate Race Thread

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The Illinois Senate Race Thread

Old 08-10-04, 02:19 PM
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The Illinois Senate Race Thread

This race promises to be a good one, and rather than start a new thread every time one of the candidates says something stupid, I thought I'd start a one-and-only type thread.

Keyes assails Obama’s abortion views
Ill. Senate candidate calls Democrat’s stance ‘slaveholder’s position’

CHICAGO - A day after jumping into the Illinois Senate race, two-time presidential hopeful Alan Keyes ripped into Democratic rival Barack Obama, saying his views on abortion are “the slaveholder’s position.”

The conservative former diplomat said Obama’s vote against a bill that would have outlawed a form of late-term abortion denied unborn children of their equal rights. Both candidates — one an outspoken conservative and the other a favorite of party liberals — are black.

“I would still be picking cotton if the country’s moral principles had not been shaped by the Declaration of Independence,” Keyes said. He said Obama “has broken and rejected those principles — he has taken the slaveholder’s position.”

Obama, who has been basking in national celebrity since delivering the keynote speech at the Democratic National Convention, suggested Keyes is outside the moderate mainstream of state Republicans.

Asked specifically about the phrase “slaveholder’s position,” Obama said Keyes “should look to members of his own party to see if that’s appropriate if he’s going to use that kind of language.”

Keyes, who is from Maryland and lost two Senate races in that state, on Sunday accepted the GOP nomination to replace primary winner Jack Ryan, who dropped out of the race in June over embarrassing sex allegations.

Has until Election Day to establish residency
Under federal law, Keyes has until Election Day to establish Illinois residency. Monday afternoon, the State Board of Elections officially listed Keyes as the GOP candidate, and his campaign said Calumet City, in Chicago’s southern suburbs, is his new Illinois home.

Obama said he voted against the late-term abortion ban as a state senator because it contained no exception to protect the life of the mother. He noted that Supreme Court Justice Sandra Day O’Connor and federal appeals Judge Richard Posner, both appointed by President Ronald Reagan, had voted to strike down laws banning late-term abortions.

Obama said he didn’t question the sincerity of those who are deeply concerned about abortion, but he said he believed there are many other issues on the minds of voters.

“As I travel around this state, I don’t get asked about gay marriage, I don’t get asked about abortion,” Obama said. “I get asked, ‘How can I find a job that allows me to support my family?’ I get asked, ‘How can I pay those medical bills without going into bankruptcy?”’

One issue of importance for Illinois right now is delays caused by congestion at O’Hare International Airport. Mayor Richard M. Daley has been pushing for expansion of O’Hare, backed by Sen. Dick Durbin, D-Ill., but opposed by Sen. Peter Fitzgerald, R-Ill., whose announced retirement launched the scramble for his seat.

Asked about O’Hare on WBEZ radio Monday, Keyes said he had not yet developed any position on the issue of expansion.

“The problem must be addressed,” Keyes said. He promised to “try to reach a conclusion that is in the best interests of the economic future of the state and the quality of life” of those who live in the area.

In the same interview, he defended his belief that gay marriage is wrong, brushing aside a suggestion from an interviewer that sexual preference might be biologically determined.

“We as human beings cannot assert that our sexual desires cannot be controlled,” Keyes said. He said such a claim would “consign us to the realm of instinctual animal nature — and we are not there.”

The race between Keyes and Obama sets up the first U.S. Senate election with two black candidates representing the major parties and all but assures Illinois will produce only the fifth black U.S. Senator in history.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/5654128/

Some of my fellow Otters promised me that the addition of Keyes to the race would bring cogent debate and intelligent explanations of conservative positions. I want my money back.
Old 08-10-04, 02:20 PM
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Just tell me when the debates are scheduled so I can be ready somehow.
Old 08-10-04, 02:25 PM
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Alan Keyes: far far too sweaty.
Old 08-10-04, 02:26 PM
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Originally posted by sundog
Alan Keyes: far far too sweaty.
Yeah, isn't he that guy from Roc?
Old 08-10-04, 02:28 PM
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Originally posted by sundog
Alan Keyes: far far too sweaty.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...sPageName=WDVW
Old 08-10-04, 02:31 PM
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[grabs chair and popcorn]
Old 08-10-04, 03:49 PM
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It'll be an interesting race.

The bottom line is that Obama will win of course, but with Keyes in the race Obama will have to spend time campaigning in Illinois rather than going around the country drumming up support for Kerry.
Old 08-10-04, 08:55 PM
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Keyes was on Chicago Tonight last night and he has a long way to go to even put a dent in Obama.

Keyes launched in to a diatribe accusing Obama of ignoring state tort reform legislation. To bad tort reform passed years ago, but was found unconstitutional by the IL Supreme Court, taking the issue off the table in this state.

Then he went into a rant on Obama's stance on abortion but they had a poll that showed 93% of the people in the state disagree with Keyes viewpoint of it.

He's lucky this was just on PBS in the Chicago area so nobody else was watching
Old 08-11-04, 02:23 PM
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Originally posted by MrX
Keyes was on Chicago Tonight last night and he has a long way to go to even put a dent in Obama.

Keyes launched in to a diatribe accusing Obama of ignoring state tort reform legislation. To bad tort reform passed years ago, but was found unconstitutional by the IL Supreme Court, taking the issue off the table in this state.

Then he went into a rant on Obama's stance on abortion but they had a poll that showed 93% of the people in the state disagree with Keyes viewpoint of it.

He's lucky this was just on PBS in the Chicago area so nobody else was watching
In fairness to Keyes, tort reform was overturned on technical grounds -- the court found that the tort reform bill violated the state's "single subject rule," which states that each bill has to address a single subject. This is designed to prevent log-rolling and pork. In theory, the legislature could pass a series of individual bills which, taken together, do what the old tort reform bill was designed to do. The chances of this happening are less than zero.

As for abortion, if Keyes makes this race a referrendum on social conservatism, he's going to lose. Big time. OK -- he's going to lose anyway, but he's going to do a lot better if he talks about lowering taxes instead of ranting about gay marriage and separation of church and state.

Here's today's news:

Keyes says he wants rumble with Obama
August 11, 2004

BY SCOTT FORNEK Political Reporter Advertisement

It was only two days into the Barack Obama-Alan Keyes Senate matchup Tuesday, but Keyes might already be starting to get under the Democratic frontrunner's skin.

Obama laughed, smiled and tried out a few quips with reporters who quizzed him about the Republican's virulent characterization of Obama as being afraid to stick to an earlier offer to participate in six debates.

But the Democrat quickly grew tired of explaining why he now only wants to do three debates.

"You know, come on," Obama told a reporter. "You've already had fun. You got one headline out of it today."

Keyes, 54, who officially kicked off his campaign Sunday, insists the debate over debates is serious business.

At a morning news conference, Keyes quoted Obama's letter to Jack Ryan in June, before the Republican dropped out of the race. The letter -- still on Obama's Web site Tuesday -- proposed six debates to be held around the state like those in 1858 between Abraham Lincoln and Stephen Douglas.

Keyes then quoted Obama saying during the Republicans' six-week search for a replacement candidate that he would debate whomever the GOP came up with. Keyes said it reminded him of Muhammad Ali, vowing to take on all comers.

"When he's facing Jack Ryan, he was Abraham Lincoln," Keyes said. "When he was facing an empty chair, possibly he was Muhammad Ali.

"Well here I am, chosen by the state party. I step into the ring and what happens? Well, all of a sudden he is running out of the ring, looking for the ropes, sizing up the number of exits."

Keyes also took Obama to task for a quip he made Monday that the offer the Democrat made to Ryan for six debates was "a special for in-state residents." Keyes was a Maryland resident up until Tuesday, when he found a place in south suburban Calumet City.

"OK," Keyes said. "So a guy from out of state steps into the ring, and Barack Obama wants to get out of the ring. I don't know, because you see when he goes into the Senate of the United States, if he should get there, he's not going to find one person from out of state standing there.

"He's going to find 98 people from out of state. . . . If he's not ready for me, he's not ready for the Senate of the United States."

Offering Obama "a polite suggestion," Keyes suggested the Democrat get out of the race and ridiculed Obama's argument that time is running out to squeeze in six debates. "I'm ready to go right this minute," Keyes said.

Responding at a separate news conference, Obama, 43, said he had committed to two debates and was working on a third. He said three is greater than or equal to the number held in the previous two U.S. Senate contests in Illinois.

"It doesn't make sense for us to simply respond to a guy who arrived two days ago and is now attempting to dictate the schedule on which the campaign is going to take place," Obama said.

"We have committed to debates. They're already on the schedule. We committed to these debates before we knew who was going to be there. You know they could have gotten Arnold Schwarzenegger and we still would have been committed to these two debates.

"So the notion that we are not willing to engage in a full, free-ranging conversation about the issues that face the voters of Illinois just doesn't make sense."

Obama refused to respond to Keyes' suggestion that he step out of the race. But he verbally swung at Keyes when a TV reporter mistakenly told him that Keyes was comparing himself to Muhammad Ali.

"You know, he's coming off of two failed Senate races in his own state as well as two failed presidential races," Obama said. "So my understanding is when Muhammad Ali was making some of his statements, he hadn't already lost four times."
http://www.suntimes.com/output/news/cst-nws-sen11.html
Old 08-11-04, 02:27 PM
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Originally posted by JasonF
the court found that the tort reform bill violated the state's "single subject rule," which states that each bill has to address a single subject. This is designed to prevent log-rolling and pork. [/url]

Man do we need this in Washington.
Old 08-11-04, 02:34 PM
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Cool! Finally both Dems and Reps are openly using their "House Niggahs" to do open battle! Both parties have just pulled their pants down and exposed their "True Colors".

I always knew both parties could find a good use for their black members.


IT'S "THE RACE RACE" in Illinois! ......
Old 08-11-04, 02:35 PM
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Say what, now?
Old 08-11-04, 02:36 PM
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OK, as an Illinoisian . . . Keyes is a freaking quack! I used to hear good things about this guy, but what is he on?! I've listened to him in several interviews now (including the equally dumb announcement of his candidacy), he doesn't have a clue. Oh, he sounds good giving generic answers like "The problem must be addressed . . . "

However, my biggest issue is this. How can Keyes or the Republican party claim that keeping jobs in the state is a major issue when they just turned around and said "Nobody here is good enough" and potentially (he won't win, so not really, but potentially) gave away another Illinois job!

Out of personal philosophy I typically won't vote for a Republican or a Democrat. Now I am voting for Obama just out of principle.
Old 08-11-04, 02:40 PM
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I heard that Obama wants a manditory union for corporations over a certain size. That would suck.
Old 08-11-04, 02:48 PM
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Originally posted by Abob Teff
OK, as an Illinoisian . . . Keyes is a freaking quack! I used to hear good things about this guy, but what is he on?! I've listened to him in several interviews now (including the equally dumb announcement of his candidacy), he doesn't have a clue. Oh, he sounds good giving generic answers like "The problem must be addressed . . . "

However, my biggest issue is this. How can Keyes or the Republican party claim that keeping jobs in the state is a major issue when they just turned around and said "Nobody here is good enough" and potentially (he won't win, so not really, but potentially) gave away another Illinois job!

Out of personal philosophy I typically won't vote for a Republican or a Democrat. Now I am voting for Obama just out of principle.

I used to work with a company that ran his radio show so I got to hear him like 4 or 5 times a week. Keyes is out of touch with the "average joe" and he's ULTRA CONSERVATIVE. To me being ULTRA CONSERVATIVE is fine. Just don't expect to get elected. I also think he's "too smart". What I mean is he's so brilliant and he's so in love with his voice he doesn't listen to others. I've heard this over and over again on his radio show when i ran it. I also saw it on his short lived TV show.

He's doesn't understand that not everyone can, or wants to live the way -he thinks- we should and this is what may kick his ass.
Old 08-11-04, 02:51 PM
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Originally posted by Numanoid
Say what, now?

Now what I say is the Reps were happy to sweep Keyes under the "He doesn't help our party rug" until this Obama(or whatever his name is) reared his head.


Suddenly Keyes is the "Black Jesus" and the Reps are falling all over themselves kissing his ass to run.

The bullshit couldn't be any stinkier.
Old 08-11-04, 02:54 PM
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Save Ferris, do you have a link?
Old 08-11-04, 02:57 PM
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Keyes also took Obama to task for a quip he made Monday that the offer the Democrat made to Ryan for six debates was "a special for in-state residents." Keyes was a Maryland resident up until Tuesday, when he found a place in south suburban Calumet City.

"OK," Keyes said. "So a guy from out of state steps into the ring, and Barack Obama wants to get out of the ring. I don't know, because you see when he goes into the Senate of the United States, if he should get there, he's not going to find one person from out of state standing there.

"He's going to find 98 people from out of state. . . . If he's not ready for me, he's not ready for the Senate of the United States."
Old 08-11-04, 02:59 PM
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Originally posted by dork
You just don't get Keyes because Keyes is smart! Smart, smart, smart! He's the smartest man alive. I know he's so smart, because all of his fans keep telling me he's smart.
Old 08-11-04, 03:25 PM
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Originally posted by JasonF
Save Ferris, do you have a link?
I overheard it on the radio but ill look
Old 08-11-04, 03:26 PM
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Originally posted by Giantrobo
...and he's so in love with his voice...
That's pretty ironic considering it's horrible.
Old 08-11-04, 03:37 PM
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"When he's facing Jack Ryan, he was Abraham Lincoln," Keyes said. "When he was facing an empty chair, possibly he was Muhammad Ali.

"Well here I am, chosen by the state party. I step into the ring and what happens? Well, all of a sudden he is running out of the ring, looking for the ropes, sizing up the number of exits."
That's awesome. Really, it is.
Old 08-11-04, 03:42 PM
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At least Keyes will try to make Obama his bitch. That will at least be entertaining.
Old 08-11-04, 03:50 PM
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Originally posted by Heat
The bottom line is that Obama will win of course, but with Keyes in the race Obama will have to spend time campaigning in Illinois rather than going around the country drumming up support for Kerry.
That's the main reason they're running him, IMO. They also want someone to attack his character, and they don't want to sully themselves doing it. Plus, down the road, the GOP can say it ran an AfricanAmerican once upon a time.

BTW, I can't believe THIS is the best he could do to answer this question:

He acknowledged he had criticized others in the past for "cherry-picking the states as platforms for their ambitions," but said the issues at stake in the contest were more important than geography.

"We must continue to assert and stand tall to defend the great principles of God's authority and unalienable rights on which this nation is founded," Keyes said. "If, indeed, that land is still Illinois, then I have lived in the Land of Lincoln all my life . . . and I will be proud to call Illinois my home."


Translation - carpetbagging is wrong, unless I'm the one doing it.

Last edited by Meatpants; 08-11-04 at 03:53 PM.
Old 08-11-04, 08:13 PM
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OK, Giantrobo is right . . . Keyes is only here because he is black (ironically, the black community is dogging him the most!). Plain and simple. Republi-can'ts (my new phrase to go with Demi-crats) figured maybe they could "out black" Obama. Ironic that two of the "whitest" black guys on the planet are trying to "out black" eachother.

For those of you playing at home in the other 49 states, here is a brief recap of this mad mad mess known as corrupt Illinois politics. One of our senators is "retiring" leaving a vacant seat that is crucial to the eternal pork projects known as Illinois airports in Chicago and its suburbs.

Anyway, the Demi-crats have a golden boy that they are touting (even gave a keynote speech at the CONvention) named Barak Obama. We'll ignore the race issue for right now because it was a non-issue until now. And no, he isn't the guy from Mortal Kombat.

The Republi-can'ts also thought that they had found a golden boy: Jack Ryan. No, not the Jack Ryan portrayed by Alec Baldwin, Harrison Ford, and Ben Affleck. Rather, the Jack Ryan that was married to actress Geri Ryan (yes, THAT Geri Ryan, grrrrr!). However, it seems that Jack was a kinky (but faithful) little boy and tried to pressure Geri into going to sex clubs and "performing" in public. Jack tried to hide this in his divorce records, and thus the first "Sexless Sex Scandal" was born. Eventually Jack kind of faded away. He didn't exactly leave the race and just recently had his name removed from the ballot.

So then the search was on . . . it seems that NOBODY was willing to run. The Illinois Republi-can'ts scoured their party high and low and could not find anybody who was willing to run that hadn't been involved in some sort of scandal. So then the real fun began . . . Mike "Da' Coach" Ditka (yes, that Mike Ditka!) was the candidate for about three days (until his wife went on public TV and threatened to divorce him -- TWICE!). Then talk turned to Ted Nugent, yes "Cat Scratch Fever" Ted Nugent. So as you can see by the highlight reel, we have managed to surpass the incredulity of states electing wrestlers and actors to high public office. We are a joke. I apologize to the rest of the country now.

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