International team to monitor presidential election
08-09-04, 01:35 PM
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International team to monitor presidential election
http://edition.cnn.com/2004/ALLPOLIT...ers/index.html
WASHINGTON (CNN) -- A team of international observers will monitor the presidential election in November, according to the U.S. State Department.
The Organization for Security and Cooperation in Europe was invited to monitor the election by the State Department. The observers will come from the OSCE's Office for Democratic Institutions and Human Rights.
It will be the first time such a team has been present for a U.S. presidential election.
"The U.S. is obliged to invite us, as all OSCE countries should," spokeswoman Urdur Gunnarsdottir said. "It's not legally binding, but it's a political commitment. They signed a document 10 years ago to ask OSCE to observe elections."
Thirteen Democratic members of the House of Representatives, raising the specter of possible civil rights violations that they said took place in Florida and elsewhere in the 2000 election, wrote to U.N. Secretary-General Kofi Annan in July, asking him to send observers.
After Annan rejected their request, saying the administration must make the application, the Democrats asked Secretary of State Colin Powell to do so.
The issue was hotly debated in the House, and Republicans got an amendment to a foreign aid bill that barred federal funds from being used for the United Nations to monitor U.S. elections, The Associated Press reported.
In a letter dated July 30 and released last week, Assistant Secretary of State Paul Kelly told the Democrats about the invitation to OSCE, without mentioning the U.N. issue.
"I am pleased that Secretary Powell is as committed as I am to a fair and democratic process," said Democratic Rep. Eddie Bernice Johnson of Texas, who spearheaded the effort to get U.N. observers.
"The presence of monitors will assure Americans that America cares about their votes and it cares about its standing in the world," she said in a news release.
Democratic Rep. Barbara Lee of California agreed.
"This represents a step in the right direction toward ensuring that this year's elections are fair and transparent," she said.
"I am pleased that the State Department responded by acting on this need for international monitors. We sincerely hope that the presence of the monitors will make certain that every person's voice is heard, every person's vote is counted."
OSCE, the world's largest regional security organization, will send a preliminary mission to Washington in September to assess the size, scope, logistics and cost of the mission, Gunnarsdottir said.
The organization, which counts among its missions conflict prevention and postconflict rehabilitation, will then determine how many observers are required and where in the United States they will be sent.
"OSCE-participating [nations] agreed in 1990 to observe elections in one another's countries. The OSCE routinely monitors elections within its 55-state membership, including Europe, Eurasia, Canada and the United States," a State Department spokesman said.
The spokesman said the United States does not have any details on the size and composition of the observers or what countries will provide them.
OSCE, based in Vienna, Austria, has sent more than 10,000 personnel to monitor more than 150 elections and referenda in more than 30 countries during the past decade, Gunnarsdottir said.
In November 2002, OSCE sent 10 observers on a weeklong mission to monitor the U.S. midterm elections. OSCE also sent observers to monitor the California gubernatorial recall election last year.
More recently, OSCE monitored the elections in Northern Ireland in November and in Spain in March.
WASHINGTON (CNN) -- A team of international observers will monitor the presidential election in November, according to the U.S. State Department.
The Organization for Security and Cooperation in Europe was invited to monitor the election by the State Department. The observers will come from the OSCE's Office for Democratic Institutions and Human Rights.
It will be the first time such a team has been present for a U.S. presidential election.
"The U.S. is obliged to invite us, as all OSCE countries should," spokeswoman Urdur Gunnarsdottir said. "It's not legally binding, but it's a political commitment. They signed a document 10 years ago to ask OSCE to observe elections."
Thirteen Democratic members of the House of Representatives, raising the specter of possible civil rights violations that they said took place in Florida and elsewhere in the 2000 election, wrote to U.N. Secretary-General Kofi Annan in July, asking him to send observers.
After Annan rejected their request, saying the administration must make the application, the Democrats asked Secretary of State Colin Powell to do so.
The issue was hotly debated in the House, and Republicans got an amendment to a foreign aid bill that barred federal funds from being used for the United Nations to monitor U.S. elections, The Associated Press reported.
In a letter dated July 30 and released last week, Assistant Secretary of State Paul Kelly told the Democrats about the invitation to OSCE, without mentioning the U.N. issue.
"I am pleased that Secretary Powell is as committed as I am to a fair and democratic process," said Democratic Rep. Eddie Bernice Johnson of Texas, who spearheaded the effort to get U.N. observers.
"The presence of monitors will assure Americans that America cares about their votes and it cares about its standing in the world," she said in a news release.
Democratic Rep. Barbara Lee of California agreed.
"This represents a step in the right direction toward ensuring that this year's elections are fair and transparent," she said.
"I am pleased that the State Department responded by acting on this need for international monitors. We sincerely hope that the presence of the monitors will make certain that every person's voice is heard, every person's vote is counted."
OSCE, the world's largest regional security organization, will send a preliminary mission to Washington in September to assess the size, scope, logistics and cost of the mission, Gunnarsdottir said.
The organization, which counts among its missions conflict prevention and postconflict rehabilitation, will then determine how many observers are required and where in the United States they will be sent.
"OSCE-participating [nations] agreed in 1990 to observe elections in one another's countries. The OSCE routinely monitors elections within its 55-state membership, including Europe, Eurasia, Canada and the United States," a State Department spokesman said.
The spokesman said the United States does not have any details on the size and composition of the observers or what countries will provide them.
OSCE, based in Vienna, Austria, has sent more than 10,000 personnel to monitor more than 150 elections and referenda in more than 30 countries during the past decade, Gunnarsdottir said.
In November 2002, OSCE sent 10 observers on a weeklong mission to monitor the U.S. midterm elections. OSCE also sent observers to monitor the California gubernatorial recall election last year.
More recently, OSCE monitored the elections in Northern Ireland in November and in Spain in March.
08-09-04, 01:42 PM
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Why is this a bad thing? We made an agreement with the other members of OSCE that they could monitor elections. Geez, I guess our word is worth nothing.
08-09-04, 01:59 PM
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Originally posted by Brain Stew
Why is this a bad thing? We made an agreement with the other members of OSCE that they could monitor elections. Geez, I guess our word is worth nothing.
Why is this a bad thing? We made an agreement with the other members of OSCE that they could monitor elections. Geez, I guess our word is worth nothing.
"The Organization for Security and Cooperation in Europe was <b>invited</b> to monitor the election by the State Department."
In other words, please hold our hand through the process that took root in the West primarily because of us.
08-09-04, 02:02 PM
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Originally posted by Breakfast with Girls
Here's why it's a bad thing:
"The Organization for Security and Cooperation in Europe was <b>invited</b> to monitor the election by the State Department."
In other words, please hold our hand through the process that took root in the West primarily because of us.
Here's why it's a bad thing:
"The Organization for Security and Cooperation in Europe was <b>invited</b> to monitor the election by the State Department."
In other words, please hold our hand through the process that took root in the West primarily because of us.
08-09-04, 02:03 PM
#10
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I don't have a problem with anyone monitoring our elections. They may learn a thing or two.
The problem I have is that they do have the ability to make a bunch of accusations, rumors, etc. that will only fuel the fire of the losing party.
The problem I have is that they do have the ability to make a bunch of accusations, rumors, etc. that will only fuel the fire of the losing party.
08-09-04, 02:06 PM
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There were no civil rights violations in Florida. Multiple investigations have found nothing. The only group that was remotely discriminated against was rich black REPUBLICANS!!
Now, will this group find Democratic ballot stuffing?? Judges forcing polls to stay open two hours later than allowed by law?? Democrats bribing citizens with cigarettes and sex to vote Democrat?
Didn't think so. The only thing I trust the UN to do is to ensure that millions of people around the world stay under brutal dictatorships and tyranny. I would love nothing more than to level the UN building in NYC and kick every single one of those pompous diplomats onto the next freighter back to wherever they came from.
/end of rant
Now, will this group find Democratic ballot stuffing?? Judges forcing polls to stay open two hours later than allowed by law?? Democrats bribing citizens with cigarettes and sex to vote Democrat?
Didn't think so. The only thing I trust the UN to do is to ensure that millions of people around the world stay under brutal dictatorships and tyranny. I would love nothing more than to level the UN building in NYC and kick every single one of those pompous diplomats onto the next freighter back to wherever they came from.
/end of rant
08-09-04, 02:08 PM
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I don't have a problem with anyone <i>observing</i> our elections. They may learn a thing or two. Maybe we would as well.
But this is <i>our</i> election, and it's pretty damn disappointing that we can't handle it ourselves without Representatives asking for outsiders to help.
das
But this is <i>our</i> election, and it's pretty damn disappointing that we can't handle it ourselves without Representatives asking for outsiders to help.
das
08-09-04, 02:10 PM
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I can see how some might want some kind of oversight, but it's just wrong to get it from a foreign entity. And what happens if they declare shenanigans? Will that overule the electoral college? Will it overule the Supreme Court, if they have to step in again? Of course it won't officially, but they could certainly fan the flames of dissent. Let's say the SC does have to step in. If this group pisses and moans about it, we'll have a whole bunch of people making arguments for a recount based on an organization that has no credibility within our federal system whatsoever.
This, in my opinion, is plain and simply, bullshit.
This, in my opinion, is plain and simply, bullshit.
08-09-04, 02:11 PM
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Originally posted by darkflounder
There were no civil rights violations in Florida. Multiple investigations have found nothing. The only group that was remotely discriminated against was rich black REPUBLICANS!!
Now, will this group find Democratic ballot stuffing?? Judges forcing polls to stay open two hours later than allowed by law?? Democrats bribing citizens with cigarettes and sex to vote Democrat?
Didn't think so. The only thing I trust the UN to do is to ensure that millions of people around the world stay under brutal dictatorships and tyranny. I would love nothing more than to level the UN building in NYC and kick every single one of those pompous diplomats onto the next freighter back to wherever they came from.
/end of rant
There were no civil rights violations in Florida. Multiple investigations have found nothing. The only group that was remotely discriminated against was rich black REPUBLICANS!!
Now, will this group find Democratic ballot stuffing?? Judges forcing polls to stay open two hours later than allowed by law?? Democrats bribing citizens with cigarettes and sex to vote Democrat?
Didn't think so. The only thing I trust the UN to do is to ensure that millions of people around the world stay under brutal dictatorships and tyranny. I would love nothing more than to level the UN building in NYC and kick every single one of those pompous diplomats onto the next freighter back to wherever they came from.
/end of rant
08-09-04, 02:15 PM
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Originally posted by Mutley Hyde
And what happens if they declare shenanigans? Will that overule the electoral college? Will it overule the Supreme Court, if they have to step in again? Of course it won't officially, but they could certainly fan the flames of dissent. Let's say the SC does have to step in. If this group pisses and moans about it, we'll have a whole bunch of people making arguments for a recount based on an organization that has no credibility within our federal system whatsoever.
This, in my opinion, is plain and simply, bullshit.
And what happens if they declare shenanigans? Will that overule the electoral college? Will it overule the Supreme Court, if they have to step in again? Of course it won't officially, but they could certainly fan the flames of dissent. Let's say the SC does have to step in. If this group pisses and moans about it, we'll have a whole bunch of people making arguments for a recount based on an organization that has no credibility within our federal system whatsoever.
This, in my opinion, is plain and simply, bullshit.
There is nothing to be gained by doing this.
08-09-04, 02:20 PM
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The french judge has already decided that Kerry wins the election, any other 'result' in november will be due to tampering. Kerry's vice president will be the canadian pairs ice skating team.
08-09-04, 02:21 PM
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Originally posted by Mutley Hyde
I have an honest curiosity about what happens. Everyone is crying that this group has no authority, but what if the shoe was on the other foot? Would you say that the US has the right to tell them otherwise?
I personally see the value in observing public elections. If there is nothing to hide, there is nothing to fear, right guys
?
08-09-04, 02:30 PM
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Originally posted by das Monkey
I don't have a problem with anyone <i>observing</i> our elections. They may learn a thing or two. Maybe we would as well.
I don't have a problem with anyone <i>observing</i> our elections. They may learn a thing or two. Maybe we would as well.
08-09-04, 02:36 PM
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Sounds like a waste of time to me. And by time - I mean money.
08-09-04, 02:38 PM
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Originally posted by Mutley Hyde
Um, we don't act like we have some kind of power over French electoral process, or have I missed something?
Um, we don't act like we have some kind of power over French electoral process, or have I missed something?
The OSCE is a two-way street. We monitor their elections, and they can monitor ours. It's not some secret socialist organization set up to overthrow George Bush. If it was, it would seem strange that Colin Powell would allow it.
08-09-04, 03:06 PM
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• kvrdave •
That is what I meant. To monitor, or observe.
That is what I meant. To monitor, or observe.
das
