Rate Tool
 

I've seen some mixed opinions in previous threads on this band. Some people love them, others can't stand them. I'd like to see what you guys think about them. In my opinion they are the best rock band in the world today, but hey that's just me. Now it's time for you to vote.

I'd give Tool a 7.5 out of 10. Some of their stuff is incredible, some is just ok, there are a few that just suck.

9.5 out of 10! Best american band right now. IMO.

Greatest band......ever. If you've never seen Tool perform live.....I feel sorry for you.

Just my $.02

(I'm actually listening to them as I type this)

I have to admit I know next to nothing about them. A friend of mine has told me their videos are quite good. I'll check out some stuff and let you know what I think.

Opiate - 6.8
Undertow - 8.7
Ænima - 6.6
Lateralus - 4.5

I don't think they suck, but I don't think they are great or anything either.


Of course, most of the songs I have heard of theirs are the radio songs, so I havent given them that much of a chance I suppose. But, out of all the things I have heard on the radio, I never really had much of a desire to check them out. Maybe one of these days.

BTW, on the radio here, the only song they seem to play is the "I know the pieces fit" song, and I think it is kinda boring so I change the station. I do like sober okay though, and I like the songs I have heard from A Perfect Circle.

I suggest that you listen to more songs than sober and schism to get a better feel for Tool. Their songs are quite long and complex, and if you don't usually listen to their music it takes awhile to get into it. Give it time and it will grow on you, trust me. Some of my favorite Tool songs which I suggest you should check out are: The Patient, The Grudge, Lateralus, Intolerance, Aenema, Parabol/Parabola, H, and 46 & 2. They also do a kick ass version of Led Zeppelin's "No Quarter".

I voted for "They're OK" which seems a tad harsh, but I didn't want to give them the Highest Rating of "Great Band!" A more accurate 1-sentence assessment would be "They're good - sometimes *great* - but often self-indulgent and overrated." Album by album....

Opiate: Owned it for years; recently unloaded it. No regrets. Yeah, the live stuff comes off rather well, but I don't find much on here that wasn't done better on the follow-up.

Undertow: Arguably their "least ambitious" full-length, but also the easiest to listen to without using the Skip Button. And that's *not* just because they hadn't yet brainstormed the brilliant concept of "segue" tracks. None of the songs here are quite revolutionary, but even if I had to pick a "least favorite," it would still be pretty decent. However, "Disgustipated" (Track 69) would hint at the pretentiousness to come (several minutes of nothing but crickets chirping?!).

AEnima: Reaches heights that Undertow didn't quite aim for with moody, disturbing songs like personal fave "Forty-Six & 2," but also introduces the inclusion of non-song tracks. Go ahead, convince me that the album would be significantly weaker without "Intermission." Also, "Jimmy" and especially "Hooker With a Penis" are duds. And I felt that way even when I was in my "Tool is the best band in the history of the universe and AEnima is the greatest piece of art ever created" phase. Which lasted a couple years, actually.

Lateralus: Even more bloated and self-important than you'd expect from a band that feels its ideas are so bold as to transcend mere English, demanding that new words be "created" to express them. A lot of what I didn't like about AEnima returns, and is at least as annoying here. "Schism" and "The Patient" are 2 of Tool's worst songs, taking 6-7 minutes to go nowhere. "Ticks & Leeches" is rather intriguing until you get to the part where they felt the need to pad the length of the song with two and a half minutes of near silence. My working theory is that they scheduled Henry Rollins to do some spoken-word vocals over this segment, but never got around to finishing it. Oops! Best tracks are the opener "The Grudge" and the title-track-that-kind-of-isn't-because-it's-actually-spelled-differently-than-the-album-title. Which are both longer than my 2 least favorite songs mentioned earlier, so don't even try with the "Your attention span is too short to understand Tool" angle.

Conclusion: There's a lot to like, and fair amount to dislike with this band. When they're good, they're REAL good; when they're bad........yikes. Still, even if their next album continues to "spiral out / keep going" in the Self-Appointed Saviours of Rock direction, I'll buy it anyway. There's bound to be at least one or two songs where it all falls into place. So I have something to look forward to when the sequel to Lateralus debuts in early 2009. :)

Ok....I admit I'm a little biased since the are my favorite band. But people really need to sit down and listen to their albums all the way through. Don't just judge them by their radio songs like "Sober" or "Schism".

Mordecai rated Ænima and Lateralus as the worst Tool albums?!? Wow! You just don't like Tool. Most fans would say those are the best two albums.

And again.....if you saw these guys live.....you'd have a whole new respect for them as musicians. They truly are some of the most talented guys in music right now. Hopefully the much rumored live DVD will come out within the next 6 months. If it does, do yourself a favor and pick it up.

Not everybody is going to like Tool. But at least respect them for what they do. And if it's not your thing.....I'm sure there's another Creed album on the way.

I totally agree with everything you just said T-Rex. I think Lateralus is Tool's best album by far, and I still love their older material. I saw them live last year here in Canada and they were just awesome. They are really great musicians. Maybe I just appreciate their music a little more because I used to play in a band, and I can see their talent as musicians a little better. But then again, that is my opinion and you guys are all entitled to yours.

Where is MJKTool at? :)

I don't just judge them by Sober and Schism, but to me these songs aren't good enough for me to give much more of it a chance. Maybe later down the road I will download a couple of songs to decide if I should buy their CD. In the meantime, I don't really care to spend the time or effort right now.

I just think that their songs can be a little too long, and the ones I have heard do not interest me enough to buy a CD. I am sure that they are good musicians, but so was Beethoven, and he isn't burning up my CD player or anything.

BTW, I can only speak for myself, but just because you don't like tool that much, doesn't mean that you like crappy rock bands like Creed either.

It's possible I'm reading too much into this, and assigning opinions to you that I've seen stated more explicitly elsewhere / by other Tool buffs.

But that comment is a perfect illustration of what infuriates me about the Tool Fanboy Scene. You seem to think your fondness for this one band is the "musical street cred" equivalent of a Harvard degree - something you're eager to tell the whole world about, since it testifies to your brilliance.

Especially questionable is the implication that Tool is so "underground" and "non-mainstream" (unlike Creed). Yeah, OK, so Tool doesn't sell quite as many records as Scott Stapp & Co., but they're still a multi-platinum band that gets decent radio play and packs arenas (right?). If you think Lateralus is THE defining moment in the Era of Recorded Music, fine. It's just that, if you wanna pick a band to hold up as an example of your "unconventional" tastes, Tool is hardly a good choice. It's almost as weak as saying, "Oh, I despise commercially-oriented movies like 'Pearl Harbor.' That's why I support projects like 'LOTR.'"

As for the sparkling "musicianship" of Tool: I know a guitarist who seemed to be a pretty big classic / prog rock lover, and his review of Lateralus was - and I quote - "It blows." He also assured me he could note-for-note replicate *anything* that Adam Jones played on the album. Again, if you wanna believe Tool is the culmination of thousands of years of human evolution, that's great. It's when you start implying that "Anyone who disagrees is wrong / doesn't understand it / fails to comprehend it / listens to Creed" that I get upset.

Yea I thought he would have posted by now :p

I gotta admit that G-Rex Creed comment may have been a little immature and uncalled for, since we can't assume that everyone who doesn't listen to Tool listens to Creed, but your comments dissing Tool's musicianship are pretty weak as well. You basically said your friend decided Lateralus blows based on Adam Jones' guitar work. Adam Jones certainly isn't a great guitarist, but he is pretty damn good in my opinion. Also what about the rest of the band? Danny Carey is considered by many people to be one of the best, if not the best drummer in rock today. If you don't think so, please go back and listen to lateralus one more time. Justin Chauncellor is an amazing bass player as well, and Maynard is a very gifted vocalist. I'm sure even if you don't like Tool, but you have at least listened to some of their music, you can at least see this.

I'd give my tool about an 8.

Ok. Don't read too much into what I said, people. You could insert any band for "Creed". I just meant that if you don't like Tool (and not all people will) there's plenty of other music out there for you. I'm not a Tool "fanboy" out here trying to act like I have some superior taste in music for liking them. This thread was started to ask people's opinion of Tool....and I gave mine. I think they're a great band and people should give them a listen. That's all.

Think for yourself......

I don't really like Tool. But then again if you played a Tool song and a Creed song back-to-back, I probably couldn't tell you which one is which. Not a big fan of that "heavy" rock sound. The thing that does annoy me is that a lot of Tool fans have a very superior attitude, but I guess most people have that with their favorite band.

Well....I think most Tool fans are very passionate about the band's music. Some may have an attitude......but I find most to be very cool. Don't let anyone's attitude (including mine) sway you one way or another. Let the music decide. Some people are surprised to find that Tool has a very positive message to their music.

Peace.

I was gonna vote "twikoff," but since it wasn't an option (for shame), I went with "Great band."

I absolutely love Tool. Always have, and probably always will. I don't expect everyone to love them, though. To each his own, or something. Some people love Zeppelin. Some people love Rush. Some people love Floyd. And some people love Tool. As far as I'm concerned, these bands all come from the same mold.

I do have to laugh any time I see Tool described as pretentious, self-indulgent, etc. They just have a different approach to making music. For anyone who doesn't realize, Maynard is a freak! He has surrounded himself with a group of guys who are willing to support his freakacity, freaktitude, or whatever you want to call it. I just feel that the end product is simply beautiful and merits my attention.

As for the debate on musicianship, there are more talented, more technical, faster, etc. musicians out there. The boys of Tool are pretty damn_good at what they do, though. What impresses me the most is their ability to put their individual efforts together to form songs and albums. It is in this area that I believe other bands of today cannot touch Tool.

For anyone who doesn't appreciate Tool's use of segueways on their albums, I completely understand. Not your "cup of tea." They don't bother me in the least, though, because I believe that Tool is no longer concerned with just writing songs. They are trying to produce albums. Lateralus is not meant to be listened to a song at a time. It is one piece of work, not a collection of songs. If you listen to each of their albums in chronological order, you can definitely hear the progression toward such an end. Once again, not everyone will or should enjoy such efforts, but I most certainly do.

Correct. I don't wanna make a federal case out of it, but his remark reminded me of the vibe I got from a thread about 2 years ago (pre-Lateralus) in which some people seemed to imply that "not liking Tool = not understanding Tool." I sought to caution against that style of posting. And for the record, I've never owned a Creed album. :)
My communication skills must be even weaker than I'd previously thought, because that's not at all what I meant. The discussion took place shortly after Lateralus dropped, so it's hard to recall exactly what all of my bud's reasons were. But "sub-hyper-technical guitar wizardry" was NOT the only flaw he found on the album. Indeed, the axe playing was something *I* brought up. Anyway, this friend likes the Beatles and of course acknowledges their musicianship isn't mindblowing. His anti-Tool stance had something to do with "time signatures," but my being a non-musician, I didn't understand a word of what he said. But whatever - time signatures, guitar pyrotechnics (or lack thereof) - this guy just doesn't feel Tool writes engaging songs.
Last time we did this, I overindulged in my name-dropping of bands / musicians I deemed equal to or better than Tool. I won't make that same mistake twice. All I'll say it that yes, Tool records certainly feature some tight, creative skinsmanship; but no, Danny Carey isn't the End-All-Be-All among the drummers I've heard. Beyond that, any comparisons are sketchy, because most of what I listen to now is so far removed stylistically from Tool that to call one drummer "more skilled" than the other is fairly subjective. It's simply that I've heard plenty that sounds (to my amateur ears) "about as hard to play" as what Tool features.
I always plead ignorance on the bass issue. Personally, I am wholly unable to listen to a record and judge if the 4-string-slapper is "exceptional" or merely "competent." As for Maynard, he's like the band in general. Sometimes I like his performance ("Flood," "H."), and other times I don't ("Hooker With a Penis," "Reflection").
As hinted in my album-by-album evaluation, I spent at least a couple years as a firm believer in the Tool Rulz! School. They went from being my absolute favorite band to just another band I dig, with benefits as well as drawbacks. But I still listen to the 3 LPs (having ditched the EP) and have all the songs more or less 100% memorized.

Finally, the other problem that keeps popping up in these discussions is that people sometimes assume that, because I don't (any longer) think of highly of Tool as they do, it means I "hate" the band. Not so! [I'll admit, I used poor choice of words when I announced my love of "bash"ing them.] My feeling is, and has been for a couple years now, that they are worth listening to but overpraised in some circles. And if I come across as too forceful in my opinions, part of that is because I'm naturally a jackass, but it's also due to the fact that I'm *very* familiar with all the band's major releases so I feel pretty well qualified going into detail and backing up my thoughts.

PS: Haven't heard Salival, since it came out *after* I decided that, while the band's major studio albums were must-owns, their "compilation"-type material was unnecessary. Also haven't seen them live.

[Edited to delete cheap shot at the concert experience, and to add that I'm not offended by charges (which have *also* seemingly been edited out) that my little rants here are migraine-inducing. No need to lock the thread IMO. :)]

Wow.....that Creed comment really struck a nerve with people. I forgort to turn the [sarcasm] tag on. :rolleyes:

inVectiVe,
I guess you like some of their stuff, but you're not a huge fan. But let's not get into an arguement about their talents as musicians. Everybody has an opinion, but critisizing the skills of any member of the band is quite silly. Anyways, it's about the music a whole.....not individuals.

And please don't comment on the live shows if you haven't been to one.

Remember.....music is art.....not a contest.

Sorry....Tool's music is just very important to me.....and the live shows I've been to were amazing experiences. So I'm a little defensive about them. I don't want this thread to be closed....everybody should feel free to post their opinions!

<small></small>And yet, more than two hours before your own post, he made it pretty clear.

Taking on board your own point concerning concerts, it's probably not a good idea to comment on his posts if you haven't properly read them (because of the headache?)

So far as I can see this is a "rate Tool" thread. If it gets bitter and destructively off-topic it <b>will</b> be closed - as would any clones that appeared shiortly thereafter.

Don't let the terrorists win: play nice!



Benedict
Moderator, Music Talk

Nooo don't close the thread! I just want people's opinion on this band that is all. Sorry if I got a little carried away earlier it's just that I love this band and tend to defend them from time to time. Anyways, carry on and keep voting people! :)

I just can't get into Tool. It doesn't work for me on any level. I tried listening to Undertow again before unloading it on half.com, and it didn't do a thing for me. They leave me totally cold.

Oddly enough, I'll say that Tool produced the single greatest music video ever created, Sober.

And best drummer? Ummm, ever hear of Neal Peart?

I have always liked Tool begining when I first heard Sober way back in 1995. It wasnt until I saw them in concert in mid 1998 that I became...you could say obsessed? I guess the fact that I have over 40 of their live shows on DVD would classify me as obsessed :D

Anyway everybody has that one music act that strikes a cord in their life...that is what Tool has done for me. They are definetly NOT for everyone. I guess some people say they "peaked" at Undertow because that album was an in your face hard rock album with songs that are basically "wham bamm thank you mam". Lots of people like that type of arangement. They like to turn to a particular song for 5 minutes and be done with it, and thats fine. Well Tool doesnt do that anymore. Its funny because Undertow & Opiate are my least favorite of their albums. I think gilbert hit it right on the head earlier. Tool makes albums now. They no longer make separate songs, they make songs that blend togther to form 1 complete album. So it takes effort now to sit down for a whole album and just take it in. Obvisouly some, if not most, are not going to care for that. But for someone to say "they suck" is just an insult, when in fact you should be saying "they just dont do it for me". Save the "You Suck" type of comments who do nothing to contribute to the music industry.

I do remember the old Tool thread (Quaid), and back then I was very defensive like many Tool fans are about their band. Why is that? Its because lots of Tool fans get emotionally involved into this band, almost like a marriage. And when someone insults Tool they take it personally. I've kinda learned there will always be those who hate Tool and just love to piss those of us off because they know they can so easily!, sort of like Laker haters! :D. So there really is no reason to feed that Troll like mentality anymore. If you hate Tool...good for you!, but I will continue to love my favorite band :)

edited to add: I wasnt implying that you hated or were a Troll inVectiVe, but rather trying to explain why alot of Tool fans get a little defensive about Tool, since you were here back during that old thread :)

Death to prog rock!

;)

Stop with the hitting! Gah! I'm sorry!

Actually, Tool were one of my favourite bands for close to 3 or so years, and I've had Undertow for 9 years at this point. I also thought Ænima was their best album for the majority of the time they were my favourite. I don't see what fans think decides who else is a fan, even if I no longer consider myself one in the most remote of ways.

Undertow is focused, it doesn't have many extremely weak points, and their song writing was at its apex at this point. Also, the production on this album is the best suited for the album it's on out of all of their catalogue.

Also, I've seen them in concert. They were one of the most disappointing live acts I've seen. I don't see anything about their live act that would make me think more of them as musicians. They play, for the most part, the songs verbatim to their recorded counterparts, and when they do extend them, it's so full of repetition that it's embarassing how long they'd rehearsed it.

Finally, I don't respect bands I don't like for what they are capable of. Well written music, and a good musician aren't consistantly correlated terms, and I'm not about to ignore bad music because it was written by someone with technical skill. The most remembered songs are by no means the most technically difficult, or challenging, but they are what's remembered, and looking back at Tool once they've disbanded, you'll find a sketchy band that could hit the mark if they wanted to, but were to preoccupied with agendas and misguided ideals of what warrents merit (overly long songs is not a guaranteed meal ticket, guys). Their singles will live on for those who do a little digging.

I've been playing guitar for 15 years and I have to agree. I'm not the greatest player or anything, but Tool's guitar/bass work is hardly complex, musical or difficult. I could also hammer out their music quite easily.

They're not a bad band at all, but they are pretty far from being "great musicians".

Just think these guys where doing sounds and FXs for movies like Terminater and Jurasic Park and decided to make a band for fun and look how they turned out,these guys make music for themselves and no one else,you dont like tuff $hit dont buy it or listen to it,IMO there the best rock band ATM,with all this weak $hit killing the radio waves its refreshing to play a good 10 minute Tool song to relax me,and live there just as good.

People who are saying they suck in concert because they play a 8 minute song and make it a extended 20 minutes dont know what there talking about,the last time I seen them in concert they only did this with 1 song and that was Reflections,you all act like they do this with every song they play.

So its obvious you prefer the "singles" mentality. What makes you think they havent "hit the mark"? What, just because you prefer the "singles" type of music & because this band doesnt conform to that? They have "hit the mark" above and beyond imo. I am so gratefull they DIDNT stick with that 1 type of sound like countless other bands do. :)

I'm fairly certain only one of them was doing mild art jobs for those films.

Also, bands don't make music for themselves. Once you get mass distro, you're making music for other people, and artists and fans that get frustrated that people don't like it should realize this. Art placed on a public spectrum, no matter what you think, is subject to all the opinions of those who are exposed to it. And by that same token, if you really believe your 'if you don't like it, avoid it' motto, I would suggest laying off complaining about the radio.

Also, the amount of time a Tool show is, from first song to last, divided by the number of songs played is sad.

Yeah, I really dont know where this is coming from either? The only songs I can think of where they have massivly extended them are...well none? If they are talking about Disposition, Reflection & Triad combination. That is true to the album. Those three songs were meant to be 1 long epic song. And the only others I can think of.... Jerk Off, Prison Sex, Stinkfist, Schism have only 1-3 minutes of bars added. Merkaba is an 8 minute piece they sometimes throw in there, but other than that they DONT extend their songs by 10 minutes as some say in here.

I don't see what "singles" mentality you're picking up on. Their best songs happen to be their singles, but that's not a mentality I'm subscribing to, it's what I have learned over the last 9 years. I've been through the phases of "Third Eye and Flood are their best!" but then again, I've grown up over that extended period of time.

I'd like to know what "'singles' type of music" is, or how they aren't conforming to it? Is it focus? Smaller lengthed songs?

I also never said they should stick with one type of song, at all, in any capacity, anywhere in my posts.

They played about 12-14 songs during their 2002 shows. Each show was 2hrs. How is that sad?

Well maybe "singles" is the wrong word. I'm thinking songs that are around the 5/6 min mark, which Undertow had the most of.

Ten minutes a song? That's not something to be happy about.

Also, I like the songs that are focused. Being long for the point of being long shows in a lot of their stuff. It has nothing to do with preferring a specific time for any song I listen to.

Who says they arent focused? What songs are you talking about? Can you give me some songs as examples?

The majority of Lateralus meanders. They demonstrated on both Undertow and Ænima (specifically "Stinkfist," their best song) that they can encapsulate the same twists and turns in smaller avenues, yet they choose to pad and pad for, seemingly, the ability to comment on how full the CD was with 'content'.