Coyote vs Acme [vs the tax write off]
11-13-23, 10:22 PM
#51
DVD Talk Hero
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Re: Coyote vs Acme [vs the tax write off]
Ha! That's exactly what I was thinking. I'm sure 90% of the people online who were "outraged" by this will never actually see the movie.* They don't really care. It's just something to get mad about.
*This isn't directed at anyone specifically in this thread, so don't come at me about how you're a passionate patron of animation (and the works of John Cena) and that you're going to see this 17 times.
*This isn't directed at anyone specifically in this thread, so don't come at me about how you're a passionate patron of animation (and the works of John Cena) and that you're going to see this 17 times.
11-13-23, 10:27 PM
#52
DVD Talk Hero
Re: Coyote vs Acme [vs the tax write off]
Then again, the cynic in me wonders if the claims of shelving this film, despite its high test scores, is nothing but an absurd publicity stunt.
11-13-23, 10:30 PM
#53
DVD Talk Godfather & 2020 TOTY Winner
Re: Coyote vs Acme [vs the tax write off]
Counterpoint: WB thought that The Flash was a really good superhero movie that starred Michael Keaton as Batman. They thought Batgirl was a lot worse than that.
11-14-23, 11:01 AM
#54
Moderator
Thread Starter
Re: Coyote vs Acme [vs the tax write off]
11-14-23, 12:14 PM
#55
DVD Talk Hero
Re: Coyote vs Acme [vs the tax write off]
“Burning down a building for the insurance money” is exactly what it is.
But in today’s world, I guess that makes WB smart.
But in today’s world, I guess that makes WB smart.
11-14-23, 12:23 PM
#56
Political Exile
Re: Coyote vs Acme [vs the tax write off]
Where do they get the valuation of the cost of the movie though? It seems like it could be rife for money laundering since there are literally thousands of people listed in the credits including the caterer or person that holds coat or whatever. How much of the reported budget can be accounted for?
11-14-23, 01:06 PM
#57
DVD Talk Ultimate Edition
Re: Coyote vs Acme [vs the tax write off]
Where do they get the valuation of the cost of the movie though? It seems like it could be rife for money laundering since there are literally thousands of people listed in the credits including the caterer or person that holds coat or whatever. How much of the reported budget can be accounted for?
11-14-23, 01:34 PM
#58
Re: Coyote vs Acme [vs the tax write off]
Ha! That's exactly what I was thinking. I'm sure 90% of the people online who were "outraged" by this will never actually see the movie.* They don't really care. It's just something to get mad about.
*This isn't directed at anyone specifically in this thread, so don't come at me about how you're a passionate patron of animation (and the works of John Cena) and that you're going to see this 17 times.
*This isn't directed at anyone specifically in this thread, so don't come at me about how you're a passionate patron of animation (and the works of John Cena) and that you're going to see this 17 times.
No interest before or after.
When it bombs who is justified?
11-14-23, 01:45 PM
#60
DVD Talk Godfather & 2020 TOTY Winner
11-14-23, 01:52 PM
#61
DVD Talk Ultimate Edition
Re: Coyote vs Acme [vs the tax write off]
I'm not familiar with film industry accounting standards, but from what I've read, there's certain amortization of expenses related to production costs that gets dragged out for 10-15 years as the company recognizes revenue from the film. So they've already spent $70MM to make the film. That's a sunk cost, that money has been spent and is gone. If they release it as was originally planned, they have to amortize that $70MM over the next 10-15 years. So if they released the film in late 2023, they would start expensing that $70MM against revenues in year one, and then finish expensing the last dollar somewhere between 2033 or 2038. I would expect this is accelerated and not straight line, so an example scenario might have expenses of $35MM in 2023-2024 when they receive the bulk of revenues from the theatrical release, $5MM each of the next five years as they rely on physical sales and streaming, and then $1.1MM over the next nine years as the movie's popularity has waned. By shelving the movie completely, they get to expense the entire $70MM in 2023. This creates a scenario where they rely on Time Value of Money calculations involving projected inflation rates and projected future federal and state corporate tax rates and determined that it's favorable to expense the full $70MM in 2023 using their marginal tax rate to reduce their tax liability by $30MM than to drag it out over 15 years.
11-14-23, 03:01 PM
#62
DVD Talk Hero
Re: Coyote vs Acme [vs the tax write off]
They thought Flash was a more marketable movie and they were right. I'm sure there were a lot of other calculations done that made it so that they had to release that Flash movie and not write it off like Batgirl besides quality.
11-14-23, 03:43 PM
#63
Re: Coyote vs Acme [vs the tax write off]
Why isn't Asylum doing rip-off versions of the WB tax write-offs? The biggest budget item they'd require is a good legal team to make sure they're not violating any of Warner's copyrights. Oh, and a good marketing team to make members of the public think they're the actual WB versions. Sounds like a ripe opportunity for them. (Is Asylum actually still in business?)
11-14-23, 03:52 PM
#64
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11-16-23, 05:58 AM
#65
DVD Talk Limited Edition
Re: Coyote vs Acme [vs the tax write off]
Hey come see this movie that another studio thought was so awful that they tried to erase it from history.
I wish there was a way that all the creatives involved could sue for defamation.
I wish there was a way that all the creatives involved could sue for defamation.
11-16-23, 01:19 PM
#66
DVD Talk Legend
Re: Coyote vs Acme [vs the tax write off]
Rumor has it that several creative groups that had meetings scheduled with WB for future projects have been canceling those meetings. If WB starts losing talent, they'll have to reconsider this whole thing.
11-16-23, 01:30 PM
#67
DVD Talk Godfather & 2020 TOTY Winner
Re: Coyote vs Acme [vs the tax write off]
WB never stated it was an issue with the film's quality in this case. That was Batgirl. They just saw it as a potential commercial failure, I guess.
11-16-23, 03:58 PM
#68
DVD Talk Hero
Re: Coyote vs Acme [vs the tax write off]
11-16-23, 10:12 PM
#69
DVD Talk Godfather
Re: Coyote vs Acme [vs the tax write off]
Didn't they have one "last" showing of Batgirl for a select few before its burial? Did any real feedback come from that or are we still simply going off WB's word?
11-16-23, 11:11 PM
#70
DVD Talk Godfather & 2020 TOTY Winner
Re: Coyote vs Acme [vs the tax write off]
Seasoned director–writer friendo: “I’ve heard from [a post-production guy] that the low Batgirl test scores are accurate and that it’s basically not releasable. Quote: ’It makes Catwoman with Halle Berry seem like Abel Gance’s Napoleon.’
“Kevin Smith and others are castigating David Zaslav for this, but a stinker is a stinker.”
Follow–up: “The info is from a transfer house that uploaded a digital internal workprint for online viewing. It was the same version that was test-screened…[he] had heard it hadn’t gone well and knew why.
“There were a copious amount of ‘scene missings’ and incomplete or vacant opticals, but [he] said it plays like a long unsold pilot for the CW.”
“Kevin Smith and others are castigating David Zaslav for this, but a stinker is a stinker.”
Follow–up: “The info is from a transfer house that uploaded a digital internal workprint for online viewing. It was the same version that was test-screened…[he] had heard it hadn’t gone well and knew why.
“There were a copious amount of ‘scene missings’ and incomplete or vacant opticals, but [he] said it plays like a long unsold pilot for the CW.”
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Michael Corvin (11-17-23)
11-16-23, 11:26 PM
#71
DVD Talk Hero
Re: Coyote vs Acme [vs the tax write off]
Like anyone was clamoring for this to begin with. No wonder it got canceled. It should have just gone DTV from the start instead of potentially taking the gamble of a theatrical release. Also, 70 million for a Wile E. Coyote animated film? These guys are out of their ever loving minds.
You can use 70 million and make 70 more DTV Batman animated films that will actually rock.
You can use 70 million and make 70 more DTV Batman animated films that will actually rock.
11-17-23, 01:40 AM
#72
DVD Talk Limited Edition
11-17-23, 12:03 PM
#73
DVD Talk Legend
Re: Coyote vs Acme [vs the tax write off]
I still hate the thought of the Batgirl footage never being used, maybe they could incorporate some of it into another film like a dream sequence or something.
And 70 mil for a Looney Tunes film does seem high, how much does Cena get for showing up these days?
And 70 mil for a Looney Tunes film does seem high, how much does Cena get for showing up these days?
