Alec Baldwin accidentally kills DP with prop gun, director shot as well
10-25-21, 12:34 PM
#101
DVD Talk Platinum Edition
Re: Alec Baldwin accidentally kills DP with prop gun, director shot as well
It sounds like such a weird situation. I think the two biggest to blame are the AD and the Armorer, Hannah Gutierrez. Obviously, it’s looking like Halls has disregarded safety protocols in the past and it looks like he disregarded safety protocols the day of the accident. I’m not even sure Gutierrez was present when the cinematographer was shot (although, she sure-as-shit should have been). Sounds like Halls was the one who called for a “cold gun” before handing it to Baldwin (sounds like protocol was supposed to be the Gutierrez inspects the gun first, then hands it to Halls to inspect it again before handing it to an actor).
Additinally, it sounds like the guns, and THAT gun in particular, were used for target shooting for fun. Just prior to the shooting, the cast and crew were bussed off site for lunch. I’m wondering if some stayed behind to shoot the guns for fun and then placed it back on the cart with a live round left in it.
Additinally, it sounds like the guns, and THAT gun in particular, were used for target shooting for fun. Just prior to the shooting, the cast and crew were bussed off site for lunch. I’m wondering if some stayed behind to shoot the guns for fun and then placed it back on the cart with a live round left in it.
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GoldenJCJ (10-25-21)
10-25-21, 12:46 PM
#102
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Re: Alec Baldwin accidentally kills DP with prop gun, director shot as well
My bet is you can make fake guns that look good to hold but aren't convincing if they need to be fired. I know the next solution people will have is CGI, but that doesn't always look good either. Plus, that's probably not going to be an option for most low-budget productions.
10-25-21, 03:47 PM
#104
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Re: Alec Baldwin accidentally kills DP with prop gun, director shot as well
One of the countless threads I've read about guns on camera is that, many times, more often than you'd think, muzzle flash is missed by the 24fps recording (or gets caught in a partial way where it looks dumb), so they have to add the flash in post anyway. And there are countless options available to add it in there with whatever else you may need since you're talking about something that appears on screen for a few frames at best. Sure, when it looks bad, it looks really bad, but that doesn't mean it can't look good and sufficient for the show.
Last edited by Dan; 10-25-21 at 03:53 PM.
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tanman (10-26-21)
10-25-21, 04:13 PM
#105
DVD Talk Hero
Re: Alec Baldwin accidentally kills DP with prop gun, director shot as well
It seemed like the armourer had no training because Production didn't want to pay an experienced professional. Prooducers share in the blame as well. All in all this film was a trainwreck due to the combo of overworked and inexperienced/incompetent crew because Production were cutting corners to save on cost.
10-26-21, 07:07 PM
#106
DVD Talk Hero
Re: Alec Baldwin accidentally kills DP with prop gun, director shot as well
This incident has made me appreciate action movies with a ton of gunfights. Everything from big budget Michael Bay and John Woo type movies to the low budget crap you see on Amazon Prime with generic titles like Seal Team: Strike Force and Shadow Soldiers.
Those movies have huge gunfights with dozens of guns all shooting at the same time with the cameraman dipping in and out of the action. By comparison, Baldwin was practicing drawing the gun from his holster with it seemingly being the only gun on set at the time.
Those movies have huge gunfights with dozens of guns all shooting at the same time with the cameraman dipping in and out of the action. By comparison, Baldwin was practicing drawing the gun from his holster with it seemingly being the only gun on set at the time.
10-27-21, 12:00 AM
#107
DVD Talk Legend
Re: Alec Baldwin accidentally kills DP with prop gun, director shot as well
Along the same lines, a movie that is all guns. The John Wick director uses a lot of safety protocols because of his work on the Crow
https://www.cinemablend.com/news/247...-the-franchise
https://www.cinemablend.com/news/247...-the-franchise
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GoldenJCJ (10-28-21)
10-30-21, 09:03 PM
#109
DVD Talk Limited Edition
Re: Alec Baldwin accidentally kills DP with prop gun, director shot as well
Just watched the brief Q/A with the media in VT. Wow, that wife of his is a real viper coming down on the media for doing their job. Was surprised she inserted herself so much into the questions addressed to Alec, not her. A true mother. I understand why she's upset, but the attention and bright spotlight is who she married and what she signed up for. I'm sure she's totally fine with the income his celebrity brings in. Just as I expected, that movie will never get finished, nor should it imo. Alec looks like he could use a few weeks of sleep. Serious suitcases under those bulbs.
Last edited by Jack Straw; 10-30-21 at 09:49 PM.
10-30-21, 09:29 PM
#110
DVD Talk Legend
Re: Alec Baldwin accidentally kills DP with prop gun, director shot as well
I actually thought they handled it fine (despite some obvious tension between them), but I'm sure his agents and lawyers wished he didn't do that. Would be pretty wild to be one of the cars passing by...."that guy looked like Alec Baldwin...."
10-30-21, 09:57 PM
#111
DVD Talk Hero
Re: Alec Baldwin accidentally kills DP with prop gun, director shot as well
Just watched the brief Q/A with the media in VT. Wow, that wife of his is a real viper coming down on the media for doing their job. Was surprised she inserted herself so much into the questions addressed to Alec, not her. A true mother. I understand why she's upset, but the attention and bright spotlight is who she married and what she signed up for. I'm sure she's totally fine with the income his celebrity brings in. Just as I expected, that movie will never get finished, nor should it imo. Alec looks like he could use a few weeks of sleep. Serious suitcases under those bulbs.
10-30-21, 10:16 PM
#112
DVD Talk Limited Edition
Re: Alec Baldwin accidentally kills DP with prop gun, director shot as well
He voluntarily held this impromptu press conference to respond to the media's questions to hopefully give them answers they wanted so they would hopefully leave them alone. No one was asking her anything. She should have allowed him to speak and kept her mouth shut, which from his remark to her was what he also wanted.
Last edited by Jack Straw; 10-31-21 at 12:22 AM.
11-12-21, 12:23 AM
#113
Re: Alec Baldwin accidentally kills DP with prop gun, director shot as well
Alec Baldwin wasn't supposed to pull the trigger in 'Rust' scene that led to fatal shooting, lawsuit claim
The suit added, "The scene did not call for Defendant Baldwin to shoot the Colt Revolver, which should not have contained any live ammunition."
11-12-21, 02:10 AM
#114
DVD Talk Ruler
Re: Alec Baldwin accidentally kills DP with prop gun, director shot as well
So now that we all know how dangerous these prop guns are I can't enjoy watching movies with gun scenes. Therefore I am filing a lawsuit against Alec Baldwin. If he hadn't pulled the trigger I wouldn't be in this situation.
11-12-21, 11:15 AM
#115
DVD Talk Legend
Re: Alec Baldwin accidentally kills DP with prop gun, director shot as well
11-12-21, 11:45 AM
#116
Re: Alec Baldwin accidentally kills DP with prop gun, director shot as well
11-12-21, 12:33 PM
#118
Re: Alec Baldwin accidentally kills DP with prop gun, director shot as well
11-12-21, 01:23 PM
#120
DVD Talk Hall of Fame
Re: Alec Baldwin accidentally kills DP with prop gun, director shot as well
11-12-21, 01:30 PM
#121
DVD Talk Hero
Re: Alec Baldwin accidentally kills DP with prop gun, director shot as well
You may be right and normally I’d agree with you wholeheartedly but this is an odd case. I don’t know what rules are in place for actors in the world of make-believe.
Are actors that handle guns in movies required to complete a firearms safety course before filming? I honestly don’t know but they probably should. I’ve seen people with zero training handle guns. It’s scary. Finger on the trigger. Pulling the trigger. Not inspecting the gun to see if it’s loaded. Pointing it at everything. etc.
Alec Baldwin has been in enough action movies over the years to know better than to pull the trigger but who knows what scene he was preparing for or what direction he was given off screen. I know initially I read that he was just practicing drawing the gun from the holster but I don’t know if he was told to aim the gun at the camera or told to keep his finger on the trigger for the shot, etc.
Are actors that handle guns in movies required to complete a firearms safety course before filming? I honestly don’t know but they probably should. I’ve seen people with zero training handle guns. It’s scary. Finger on the trigger. Pulling the trigger. Not inspecting the gun to see if it’s loaded. Pointing it at everything. etc.
Alec Baldwin has been in enough action movies over the years to know better than to pull the trigger but who knows what scene he was preparing for or what direction he was given off screen. I know initially I read that he was just practicing drawing the gun from the holster but I don’t know if he was told to aim the gun at the camera or told to keep his finger on the trigger for the shot, etc.
11-12-21, 01:42 PM
#122
DVD Talk Godfather & 2020 TOTY Winner
Re: Alec Baldwin accidentally kills DP with prop gun, director shot as well
Bullshit. If someone on set has a JOB to determine that a stage gun is unloaded and that person hands it to an actor, stating that gun is unloaded, it is IN NO WAY negligence to treat that gun as if it were an unloaded prop. Triggers can get accidentally pulled, some are pretty touchy. That's why we laymen don't point guns at anyone, even if we are pretty sure they are unloaded. That's why guns have a safety mechanism. That's why teaching gun safety is so important.
But again, this isn't a layman picking up a gun they think is unloaded. This is an actor, shooting (or rehearsing) a scene with a gun he has been told by a gun wrangler on set is "cold". Not the same thing, and the same precautions do not or should not apply.
But again, this isn't a layman picking up a gun they think is unloaded. This is an actor, shooting (or rehearsing) a scene with a gun he has been told by a gun wrangler on set is "cold". Not the same thing, and the same precautions do not or should not apply.
Last edited by Decker; 11-12-21 at 02:09 PM.
11-12-21, 01:45 PM
#123
Re: Alec Baldwin accidentally kills DP with prop gun, director shot as well
If you have the hand on the trigger, a little twitch may suffice, but that's not the point. Baldwin was under the impression he was holding a cold prop gun, so even an unscripted intentional pull of the trigger isn't negligant. Since loud noises is the worst that could have happened.
11-12-21, 08:01 PM
#124
DVD Talk Hero
Re: Alec Baldwin accidentally kills DP with prop gun, director shot as well
11-12-21, 08:34 PM
#125
DVD Talk Hero
Re: Alec Baldwin accidentally kills DP with prop gun, director shot as well
I’ve used a prop gun in musicals before loaded with blanks. I happened to be the only one handling the gun so I knew what was in it, but there are certainly situations where a person might be handed a gun onstage that someone else prepared. You aren’t going to stop the show to check that - it’s why other people have the “is this gun safe” job.
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