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Alec Baldwin accidentally kills DP with prop gun, director shot as well

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Alec Baldwin accidentally kills DP with prop gun, director shot as well

Old 01-23-23, 08:27 AM
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Re: Alec Baldwin accidentally kills DP with prop gun, director shot as well

Originally Posted by GoldenJCJ
^ ...


I’m also fairly certain that those DA’s trying to make a name for themselves have pretty much guaranteed nobody will want to film a movie in NM ever again.
That's my takeaway too. I worked as an extra on an Alec Baldwin commercial and he was a complete jerk but he doesn't deserve this. I worked on a lot of shows with guns and it was a giant pain. Everyone got earplugs which takes you out of the moment. Maybe they should just use fake guns and make the sound in post-production.
Old 01-23-23, 02:44 PM
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Re: Alec Baldwin accidentally kills DP with prop gun, director shot as well

Originally Posted by Cellar Door
Or just don't use real guns on movie/tv sets. There really shouldn't be any need to.
exactly, there are prop guns that can only fire blanks so you still get muzzle flash and the actors can properly react to the sound, but can't load real ammo.
Old 01-23-23, 03:08 PM
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Re: Alec Baldwin accidentally kills DP with prop gun, director shot as well

Originally Posted by Decker
Well if the hammer was cocked, then he wouldn’t have to “pull” the trigger to fire the gun. A little jostle is all it would take.
I’ve yet to hear if the hammer was already pulled back, but that should be obvious one way or another on the raw film footage.
I thought they weren't even actually filming a scene, so the hammer shouldn't have been pulled back either
Old 01-23-23, 03:09 PM
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Re: Alec Baldwin accidentally kills DP with prop gun, director shot as well

Originally Posted by mikehunt
exactly, there are prop guns that can only fire blanks so you still get muzzle flash and the actors can properly react to the sound, but can't load real ammo.
what is the cost difference?
Old 01-23-23, 03:49 PM
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Re: Alec Baldwin accidentally kills DP with prop gun, director shot as well

this was just my first google result, and some of these definitely don't look as good as a real one, but they're a lot cheaper than a real gun
I'm sure there are better ones out there, or if not if hollywood generated demand better quality would be quickly made
https://replicaweaponry.com/
Old 01-23-23, 04:09 PM
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Re: Alec Baldwin accidentally kills DP with prop gun, director shot as well

Originally Posted by mikehunt
this was just my first google result, and some of these definitely don't look as good as a real one, but they're a lot cheaper than a real gun
I'm sure there are better ones out there, or if not if hollywood generated demand better quality would be quickly made
https://replicaweaponry.com/
So if there is a completely safe option that does not impact the economic bottom line or the verisimilitude of the firearm's appearance, then why has film production not embraced this option?

Answer: Because using real guns is not considered unsafe.

I'll just keep posting it over and over to everyone suggesting that the system needs to change. It ain't broke. They don't need to fix it.
Old 01-23-23, 05:04 PM
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Re: Alec Baldwin accidentally kills DP with prop gun, director shot as well

As long as an incredibly unlikely and unfortunate accident could potentially result in an on-set death, and with an actor/co-producer facing Involuntary Manslaughter charges, despite the presence of an armorer on the set at the time, something is still wrong with the system.
Old 01-23-23, 05:23 PM
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Re: Alec Baldwin accidentally kills DP with prop gun, director shot as well

Watch the kid in the background.

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Old 01-23-23, 05:31 PM
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Re: Alec Baldwin accidentally kills DP with prop gun, director shot as well

Originally Posted by DeFan
Watch the kid in the background.

https://youtu.be/sAhKLfzDHcI

Not sure what the relevancy is there to this.
Old 01-23-23, 07:12 PM
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Re: Alec Baldwin accidentally kills DP with prop gun, director shot as well

Originally Posted by Count Dooku
That is reasonable --for that extraordinary situation. The heightened risk to your life affords you the right to be extraordinarily cautious.
And in any situation where an actor wants to double check that the gun is "cold," it should happen.
However, it would also be reasonable for an actor to trust that the people tasked with firearm safety have done their job, and presume that the "cold" gun is so.

We're talking about industry-wide policy. Every firearm on every set on every movie.
It is unreasonable to construct a policy for all firearm usage based on the potential danger present in an extreme situation like the one you describe (accident = certain death).

Again, there are already safety protocols in place and, statistically speaking, accidental shootings on movie sets don't occur, so it is reasonable to conclude that no new industry wide safety mandates are necessary.
I’m not talking about an industry wide change in policy. I think some minor modifications are appropriate though. Whether that’s to ensure all armorers are properly certified or efficiently experienced before they can be a lead armorer on set or whether a simple thing like checking a final time in front of the actor to ensure the gun is empty or has blanks, or while you’re rehearsing a scene or blocking out a shot you don’t use a real gun, etc.

We seem to live in an all-or-nothing world. The choices don’t have to be either: no changes at all or a complete overhaul of the system. Some small changes can be made to movie sets without calling it a sweeping policy change.
Old 01-23-23, 08:06 PM
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Re: Alec Baldwin accidentally kills DP with prop gun, director shot as well

Originally Posted by Decker
As long as an incredibly unlikely and unfortunate accident could potentially result in an on-set death, and with an actor/co-producer facing Involuntary Manslaughter charges, despite the presence of an armorer on the set at the time, something is still wrong with the system.
It depends on human beings, and humans are fallible.

Lots and lots and lots of obvious precautions in the name of safety that could be implemented and forced upon us in our everyday lives, but we don't do it. We accept that there will always be a human element in the equation that can result in unnecessarily dangerous situations, but we accept that risk as a part of life.
Old 01-23-23, 08:09 PM
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Re: Alec Baldwin accidentally kills DP with prop gun, director shot as well

Originally Posted by GoldenJCJ
I’m not talking about an industry wide change in policy. I think some minor modifications are appropriate though. Whether that’s to ensure all armorers are properly certified or efficiently experienced before they can be a lead armorer on set or whether a simple thing like checking a final time in front of the actor to ensure the gun is empty or has blanks, or while you’re rehearsing a scene or blocking out a shot you don’t use a real gun, etc.

We seem to live in an all-or-nothing world. The choices don’t have to be either: no changes at all or a complete overhaul of the system. Some small changes can be made to movie sets without calling it a sweeping policy change.
Any change that is mandated for every movie set is by definition a sweeping, industry-wide policy change.
Old 01-23-23, 09:26 PM
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Re: Alec Baldwin accidentally kills DP with prop gun, director shot as well

Originally Posted by Decker
As long as an incredibly unlikely and unfortunate accident could potentially result in an on-set death, and with an actor/co-producer facing Involuntary Manslaughter charges, despite the presence of an armorer on the set at the time, something is still wrong with the system.
There is no such thing as a fail safe system. It is impossible to account for all possible things that could go wrong because human beings are not capable of foreseeing every and all possible things that could go wrong.
Old 01-23-23, 09:36 PM
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Re: Alec Baldwin accidentally kills DP with prop gun, director shot as well

Originally Posted by whotony
Not sure what the relevancy is there to this.
As this story goes from tragedy to farce I'm on the side of farce.Aside from an attention wanting DA who wants to kill the New Mexico film industry there is not much to see. I've been on dozens of sets where a PA could just yell Gunshot and we extras would scatter the same as a gunshot.

Completely off topic but since I'm on a North by Northwest bender I'm amused how Hitchcock got this past the censors

Old 01-24-23, 10:01 AM
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Re: Alec Baldwin accidentally kills DP with prop gun, director shot as well

Are system changes really needed? Seems to me the system works as there hasn't been a major accident since The Crow. The Rust production failed to follow basic rules and protocols. . End of story. If anything, it should serve as an example of why protocols need to be followed.
Old 01-24-23, 10:10 AM
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Re: Alec Baldwin accidentally kills DP with prop gun, director shot as well

Originally Posted by Kny
Are system changes really needed? Seems to me the system works as there hasn't been a major accident since The Crow. The Rust production failed to follow basic rules and protocols. . End of story. If anything, it should serve as an example of why protocols need to be followed.
There definitely should be a rule, that life rounds aren't allowed on set. If the actors have to learn how to shoot, they should do so on a professional shooting range and not right beside the set, but that's about it. An expert still has to check every gun, since an accident like in the Crow could happen even without life ammunation. It's not the actor's job to check the gun or any other safety gear.
Old 01-24-23, 09:42 PM
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Re: Alec Baldwin accidentally kills DP with prop gun, director shot as well

Originally Posted by Runaway
There definitely should be a rule, that life rounds aren't allowed on set. If the actors have to learn how to shoot, they should do so on a professional shooting range and not right beside the set, but that's about it. An expert still has to check every gun, since an accident like in the Crow could happen even without life ammunation. It's not the actor's job to check the gun or any other safety gear.
There already are rules prohibiting "live" rounds on a movie set. Again, this production failed to follow established protocals at every stage, hence a tragedy occurred.
Old 02-08-23, 06:04 PM
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Re: Alec Baldwin accidentally kills DP with prop gun, director shot as well

And here I was saying the prosecution in this case were idiots...

Alec Baldwin Charged Under Gun Law That Didn’t Exist at Time of ‘Rust’ Shooting

By Gene MaddausProsecutors in New Mexico charged Alec Baldwin last week with a gun allegation that was not on the books at the time of the “Rust” shooting.

Baldwin is facing a charge of involuntary manslaughter as well as a “firearm enhancement” in connection with the death of cinematographer Halyna Hutchins. The enhancement carries an additional five-year penalty for discharge of a firearm in the course of a felony.

But that enhancement did not become law until May 2022, seven months after Hutchins was killed. That raises a question about whether a judge would allow prosecutors to pursue that additional five-year term.

First Judicial District Attorney Mary Carmack-Altwies and her appointed special prosecutor, Andrea Reeb, are reviewing the issue, said a spokeswoman for the office.

“The District Attorney and special prosecutor are actively reviewing all applicable laws to ensure they have the strongest case to secure justice for Halyna Hutchins,” said the spokeswoman, Heather Brewer.

Baldwin’s attorney did not respond to a request for comment.

Prosecutors filed the same charge and the same enhancement against Hannah Gutierrez Reed, the film’s armorer. Her attorney, Jason Bowles, said the D.A. is seeking to apply the enhancement retroactively, in violation of her constitutional rights.

“We will be addressing this with motions,” Bowles wrote in an email. “They have clearly charged an enhancement that is barred by the constitution and ex post facto law.”

A criminal attorney in New Mexico, Caitlin Smith, first flagged the issue to the legal affairs podcast “Serious Trouble,” which covered the Baldwin case last week.

“They probably shouldn’t have charged it,” Smith told Variety, adding that the defense could file a pre-trial motion to have the enhancement thrown out.

At the time of the “Rust” shooting, New Mexico law did allow for a three-year enhancement for “brandishing” a firearm in the course of a felony. But the term “brandished” was given a specific definition requiring “intent to intimidate or injure a person.”

Involuntary manslaughter applies only to unintentional killings. In interviews, Carmack-Altwies has characterized the “Rust” shooting as an accident, though one that can be prosecuted because of the negligence involved.

The version of the firearm enhancement that applied at the time of the shooting went into effect in July 2020. At that time, lawmakers were looking to toughen the penalties for gun crime. So they increased the sentence enhancement for use of a firearm during a felony from one year to three years.

But at the same time, they limited the circumstances in which that enhancement would apply by dropping the word “use,” which had a broader application, and replacing it with the narrower term “brandishing.”

That term was defined to mean “displaying or making a firearm known to another person while the firearm is present on the person of the offending party with intent to intimidate or injure a person.”

By 2022, the Legislature had concluded that the definition was too narrow. So it added a one-year sentence enhancement for “use” of a firearm during a “drug transaction, aggravated battery, or serious violent offense” — with no requirement that the gun be “brandished.” The Legislature also added the five-year enhancement for discharge of a firearm in the course of any non-capital felony — the enhancement that has been applied to Baldwin and Gutierrez Reed.

With the enhancement in place, each defendant faces up to six and a half years in prison. If it were dropped, they would face only 18 months.

Baldwin and Gutierrez Reed are due to make their initial appearances in court on Feb. 24, in a hearing that will be conducted over Google Meet.

David Halls, the first assistant director, is expected to appear in-person at the Santa Fe courthouse on March 8 to plead no contest to a misdemeanor, negligent use of a deadly weapon. Halls is expected to get six months of probation.

On Tuesday, Baldwin’s attorneys filed a motion to disqualify Reeb, who was brought in last year to assist the First Judicial District Attorney’s office. Reeb, a Republican, was elected in November to the state House of Representatives, and Baldwin’s lawyers argue her appointment as a special prosecutor violates the separation of powers provision in the state constitution.
Old 02-09-23, 11:11 AM
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Re: Alec Baldwin accidentally kills DP with prop gun, director shot as well

This case gets more and more messed up. They are about two steps away from simply rounding up a posse to kill him in the street, Old West-style.
Old 02-20-23, 03:19 PM
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Re: Alec Baldwin accidentally kills DP with prop gun, director shot as well

Prosecutors drop the “Firearm enhancement” charge against Baldwin. Maximum sentence went from 5 years, now down to 18 months. Not that I expect he’ll be found guilty at all.

New Mexico prosecutors downgrade charges against Alec Baldwin in the 'Rust' shooting


https://www.npr.org/2023/02/20/11583...rge-downgraded
Old 02-20-23, 03:25 PM
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Re: Alec Baldwin accidentally kills DP with prop gun, director shot as well

Really? Somebody came to the conclusion that it's not smart to charge a celebrity with a crime for something that wasn't actually a crime at the time of the incident? That seems like a pretty solid legal call there.
Old 02-22-23, 07:36 AM
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Re: Alec Baldwin accidentally kills DP with prop gun, director shot as well

Nicolas Cage had trouble with the same armorer on her previous job, his western, THE OLD WAY:
After firing a gun near the cast and crew for a second time in three days without warning, Brumbaugh said that Cage yelled at her, “Make an announcement, you just blew my f—ing eardrums out!” before walking off set in a rage..
https://www.thewrap.com/rust-armorer...z6zpLyaZUkL3tk
Old 04-20-23, 02:34 PM
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Re: Alec Baldwin accidentally kills DP with prop gun, director shot as well

Prosecutors plan to dismiss charges against Alec Baldwin without prejudice.
This is after the special prosecutor stepped down.
Old 04-20-23, 02:54 PM
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Re: Alec Baldwin accidentally kills DP with prop gun, director shot as well

Originally Posted by Decker
Prosecutors plan to dismiss charges against Alec Baldwin without prejudice.
This is after the special prosecutor stepped down.
https://twitter.com/ABC/status/1649133026113122323?s=19
This was always and completely expected, IMO.
Old 04-20-23, 04:13 PM
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Re: Alec Baldwin accidentally kills DP with prop gun, director shot as well

somebody paid off somebody

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