milo bloom

See, some years ago I started buying them all on DVD and watching with my kid so we had a pretty recent impression of them being kinda dodgy story-wise, and we had a good time with latest release. I wonder how many people had the same experience you did, where they weren't actively watching the old films. The Facebook Godzilla groups I follow is full of people who watch the old ones pretty frequently, and their response to this one was also pretty positive, so I think that's it.

Hokeyboy

I will never buy the "Well what do you want? It's a GODZILLA movie! The characters are supposed to suck!"

That's exactly the same as what their defenders/apologists were saying about the Schumacher Batman flicks, or the crappy Fox/Sony Marvel movies of the 00s. "What do you want, great characters and strong plots? They're COMIC BOOK MOVIES!"

And then Marvel and Nolan came around and changed the rulebook entirely. That you can make great genre movies that work on all levels, which don't have to overcompensate for their anemic storytelling and piss-poor characterization with big spectacle and 'splosions.

So yeah, did I want more from Godzilla: King of the Monsters? Assuredly. This is 2019, not 1998. The game has been elevated for genre movies.

The human characters in this movie were even worse than they were in 2014's Godzilla (which I also didn't like much, but it's Lawrence of Arabia compared with this shitstorm), and the monster battles, while thrilling and satisfying at first, just became empty, tiresome and tedious.

Why So Blu?

DaveyJoe

I totally get that, but for people who are all ready fans of the many Godzilla films that feature underdeveloped characters, paper-thin plots, and dumb monster fights, it makes total sense why they'd enjoy King of the Monsters so much.

Giantrobo

Hey, we're all for the "Elevated Game" but we simply don't hold our breath that the film industry(Toho or Hollywood) will follow the trend. This film "bombed" and likely G vs Kong will not do great so we'll likely not see anything new from Hollywood for years.

Toho may shoot their shot to try to make a point, but their last G-outing "Shin Godzilla" was "OK" but not great, and all the human story line/bureaucracy shit was a real drag.

Why So Blu?

Shit, that's what elevated the material. It was the best part.

Giantrobo

No it didn't.

milo bloom

Yeah, it really drove home the point that the original film had made. The idiocy of humanity.

dsa_shea

The idiocy of humanity is now reflected in the piss poor writing and character development.

"God.........zilla"

Why So Blu?

I think Dougherty should have stuck to directing the next Trick R Treat or Krampus 2 films. He was way out of his depth on this one.

Hokeyboy

It also makes total sense why King of the Monsters failed, both critically and commercially. If they wanted the franchise to thrive and grow, they won't do it with crappy movies.

Giantrobo

It tried. But it didn't do it the way G54 did it. In G54 the bureaucracy was not as drawn out as it was in Shin Godzilla.

Giantrobo

Sounds like a TOHO G-Film

DaveyJoe

Crappy movies make bank all the time in America. There are many franchises that get five, six sequels even though the films are terrible, including: Transformers, Fast and Furious, Resident Evil, Saw. In fact I'd say a tentpole film is more likely to succeed in the US if it's big and dumb.

​​​​​The problem is that the goals for movie studios have shifted so that movies that don't make a billion dollars are considered a failure. The expectations for Box Office are so high that I wouldn't be surprised to see films that rely on expensive special effects to start to dwindle. I'm guessing the only reason they even took a risk on Godzilla was because it's a household name.

islandclaws

No, it doesn't. I don't get why "fans" keep making this argument. Go back and watch the Showa films and almost all have fun, breezy plots with decent characterization and solid monster action. The films themselves may be campy, and the acting isn't always the best, but no plot or characters from any era have been nearly as stupid as KotM - and I say that as maybe the most-hyped person on this forum for that film.

I LOVE Godzilla, and I think there are definite moments of greatness in the new movie, but as a narrative feature it has garbage writing and garbage characters.

Giantrobo

Nope. I'm going to guess we've been watching different TOHO films because while the franchise has had "ok" stories and humans here and there over the years...most TOHO humans and story lines have been everything from Corny as fuck to rehashes of previous films. Hell, the whole franchise took a deep dive in terms of humans and story after G54 starting with "Godzilla Raids Again" . Shit, the 90's Gamera films pissed all over the gfilms that came out at the same time.

KOTM was on par with the better TOHO films. Great Monsters, humans you would hope got smashed, and a so so storyline that's just a MacGuffin to see Monsters fight. I mean come on, the whole Eco Terrorism angle isn't even new to G-films.

Hokeyboy

Except G:KotM didn't succeed, in the US or elsewhere. It couldn't even crack the $400 million mark, let alone a billion. Domestically it's sitting somewhere been The Upside and Glass, and if you combined the total budgets for both of those films, they wouldn't add up to half of what G:KoTM cost to produce. If Godzilla had a $100 million budget, it would be viewed as a success (albeit a modest one). As it stands, it's a money-losing disaster. It needed to clear $600m and will end up losing hundreds of millions.

Transformers, Fast and Furious, Resident Evil, Saw, etc. don't crash anywhere near as hard... if they crash at all.

DaveyJoe

I didn't say it did, none of the American Godzilla movies succeeded, dude clearly doesn't have that big of an audience in America. My original point was all about how a lot of die-hard G fans really enjoyed KOTM. Perhaps there's not that many of us.

Why So Blu?

This is true. I hate Transformers and F&F and those tend to be mega blockbusters. As far as RE and Saw go - those are made on the low-end in terms of budget, so they always make a profit, even the latter sequels make money.

milo bloom

I'm starting to think that. We're a vocal minority on the internet and we buy enough DVDs to make it worth the studio's time to make them (even Criterion) but there's just not a big box office draw for it.

I think if US studios dialed down the budget (stop stuffing them A-list celebrities) and lowered their expectations, they could do a theatrical release every few years that would turn a profit.

Giantrobo

It's like Americans don't have a real taste for giant monster films and they certainly don't have one for back to back films like G2014 and KOTM even if us Lifelong Kaiju fans do.

B5Erik

I think you're right.

The problem is Hollywood producers don't seem to remember how to produce small to mid budget movies with big scenes of destruction. They think they have to throw $200+ Million at the script to get it done.

tanman

There's just no pleasing some people.



Transformers Last Knight really crashed and burned a lot more than this movie. But they were able to turn it around, very quickly too, by releasing Bumblebee on a budget. Which is what I think more studios should do.

Franchot

I'll add my vote to the vocal minority or vocal majority--whichever group thought this movie sucked.

I thought the 2014 Godzilla film was quite enjoyable and something I like rewatching occasionally. This film, however, was one of the worst films I've seen in a long time. The overacting and fake emotional outbursts by these supposed "good" actors made me want to avoid any future films that they are in. Crying on cue and shouting your lines does not equal to good acting in my book.

The monster action was on par with Saturday morning wrestling shows. Sure, the old Godzilla movies were filled with that stuff, but I had thought Godzilla movies had moved on from being just a Power Rangers rip-off. Stupid me. And I bought the stupid movie to add to my 3D collection.

Pizza

On the running commentary the director admitted he didn't see any Godzilla movies until he signed on to this project. Hollywood needs to find artists that have some sort of passion for a project like this that has a history and a legacy. Certainly fans will come to a movie like this but there are not enough Godzilla fans to make an expensive movie a hit. So I understand tney need to elevate and re-invent the material to bring in new fans. They clearly failed here. At least it had some nice monster battles but that's not enough to get the franchise going. And I'm curious to see what they do with the next one as they seem clear to declare Godzilla the new King. What does that make Kong, who really is the King? Are they going to make Kong the bad guy?