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Star Wars: The Force Awakens (Abrams, 2015) — The Reviews Thread — SPOILERS

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Star Wars: The Force Awakens (Abrams, 2015) — The Reviews Thread — SPOILERS

Old 12-28-15, 06:10 PM
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Re: Star Wars: The Force Awakens (Abrams, 2015) — The Reviews Thread

Yeah, they showed it at the IMAX screening I went to. Kind of wish they didn't show it. But Cap'n 'Merica 3 looked good in 3D.
Old 12-28-15, 06:40 PM
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Re: Star Wars: The Force Awakens (Abrams, 2015) — The Reviews Thread

Originally Posted by Ranger
Independence Day 2 trailer was for 3D screens only? It didn't play at my 2D screen for TFA.
Depends on the theater. I saw TFA in 3D and didn't get it either. Absolutely nothing is running in front of every screening everywhere in America except Civil War.
Old 12-28-15, 07:05 PM
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Re: Star Wars: The Force Awakens (Abrams, 2015) — The Reviews Thread

Originally Posted by Ranger
Independence Day 2 trailer was for 3D screens only? It didn't play at my 2D screen for TFA.
Played in front of the 2D showing (looks HORRIBLE too) but not for my 3D showing, same with CA:CW (looks AWESOME)
Old 12-28-15, 09:00 PM
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Re: Star Wars: The Force Awakens (Abrams, 2015) — The Reviews Thread

Originally Posted by story
As for "aping" the OT / ANH, I'm not exactly sure what else it should be doing. Story has shape. I'm not surprised nor disappointed that it looks like this next round of stories is going to take similar shape. If Lucas can use basic myth structure, certainly the continuing adventures of Star Wars can use basic myth structure and/or the basic structure of the Star Wars mythos itself. Star Wars has always been a mixture of the small story surrounded by the big story.
4. ANH is about a boy leaving home surrounded by wounding the Empire.
5. ESB is about a young man learning the truth about his home surrounded by the Empire's merciless raising the stakes.
6. RotJ is about a man reclaiming home surrounded by ending the Empire.
7. TFA is about a girl leaving home surrounded by wounding the First Order.
I don't think I'm too far off base to predict that...
8. Episode VIII is about a young woman learning the truth about her home surrounded by the First Order's merciless raising the stakes.
9. Episode IX is about a woman's reclaiming home surrounded by ending the First Order.

I think it works.

I also think it's a big part of why the prequels don't work.
1. TPM is about... a young Jedi... and an older Jedi... and the boy they find... but there's this queen... and a handmaiden... and they all... want to reclaim the queen's home surrounded by wounding... some phantomy... menace.
2. AotC is about a young man who wants to a queen to be his girlfriend surrounded by the menacing... phantom guy... getting more powerful. Somehow.
3. RotS is about a man wrestling with an addiction to power surrounded by HOLY COW THAT GUY IS THE EMPEROR WE'RE SCREWED YODA GO TO DEGOBAH OBI-WAN GET THOSE KIDS OUT OF HERE ISN'T THIS WHERE--

Yeah. Not so much.
1. TPM is about a boy being told he must leave his home and be the focal point of a crumbling order, surrounded by the political shifts towards a new system of governance.
2. AOTC is about a young man and his friends learning the truth about what this shift in political leadership really means - a merciless raising of the stakes.
3. ROTS is about a young man wrestling with finding his place in an uncertain universe and making the wrong choices for what seem like the right reasons, against a backdrop of his friends and allies also taking wrong paths for what seem like the right reasons, surrounded by the beginning of the Empire.

Easy.
Old 12-28-15, 09:09 PM
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Re: Star Wars: The Force Awakens (Abrams, 2015) — The Reviews Thread

Originally Posted by Jackskeleton
Ugh, Mouth breathers and basement dwellers still complaining about a fridge surviving a nuclear blast when in the past films a man gets his still beating heart pulled out of his chest, also father survives a bullet wound by pouring religious water given by a man a few hundred years old.... but nah, dawg. MY DISBELIEF IS RUINED WHEN INDIANA JONES DOESN'T BECOME A SHADOW ON THE GROUND.

Stop hyping characters up in your mind. It's like saying that storm troopers with red shoulder pads shouldn't miss because they have red shoulder pads! Clearly they were underdeveloped as they looked different!


The original trilogy had better everything. Better writing and directing. Crystal Skull had none of that. Hey, that's your thing, so go for it.
Old 12-28-15, 09:24 PM
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Re: Star Wars: The Force Awakens (Abrams, 2015) — The Reviews Thread

Originally Posted by Artman
Some other general positives:
Human to alien ratio is back to the OT levels.
The scale of the film was not too big, also closer to the OT.
I'd never heard/read this complaint before, but assuming it IS a long-held one... does it not make considerable sense that a big universe has great diversity? But then a neoNazi group rising up that favours humans over aliens would systematically hack down the ratio - either literally, ir just in terms of who would be physically seen during the course of SW/ESB/RotJ - until the main non-humans are confined to seedy bars, animals and mafia cartels..?

The human:alien ratio may be wise and thought-through in all six/seven films..
Old 12-28-15, 09:24 PM
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Re: Star Wars: The Force Awakens (Abrams, 2015) — The Reviews Thread

I was on vacation in SoCA for the last two weeks, and ended up seeing this movie four times. Each time I found myself enjoying it more and more. Great film, can't wait to see where it goes from here.
Old 12-28-15, 09:49 PM
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Re: Star Wars: The Force Awakens (Abrams, 2015) — The Reviews Thread

Originally Posted by Mabuse
The number one thing this fantastic film had going for it that the prequels lacked was the real, genuine feelings of camaraderie and fond friendship between the rebel characters. The brief exchanges between Poe and Finn were priceless. That is something completely lacking in the prequels. NO one seems to like each other or have real feelings toward one another.
If that were entirely true (which I'd challenge slightly based on hazy memories), then it would make sense: there's an undercurrent of unease and fear in the world of the prequels. The government is changing rapidly and things are happening that seem off. Whereas, post-Empire, there should be an overwhelming sense of togetherness - even in the face of a new threat, the memories are not of uncertainty but of victory.

Perhaps... if the prequels are 1930s Germany, the new lot are post-Berlin Wall? Or Europe before WWI vs. after WWII. Even Britain as (ironically) the Empire crumbled vs. the 'stiff upper lip' of WWII.
Old 12-28-15, 10:30 PM
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Re: Star Wars: The Force Awakens (Abrams, 2015) — The Reviews Thread

Late to this, but had to chime in..

Originally Posted by Mike86
[Prequels too different; Force Awakens too similar] ..I guess I was generalizing but I just find it bothersome that some are acting as though the new film is too reliant on the Original Trilogy and don't give it credit for being it's own thing with elements of familiarity. Reading through the thread again it's really only a handful of people here. I've read similar complaints other places and was jumbling things together I guess.
How about:
"I just find it bothersome that some have acted as though the prequel films are too different to the Original Trilogy and don't give them credit for being their own thing with elements of familiarity."

?
Old 12-28-15, 10:58 PM
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Re: Star Wars: The Force Awakens (Abrams, 2015) — The Reviews Thread

I think the bigger problem is that they tried to follow the formula of the OT and failed. What with lil Anakin being the one who accidentally blows up the huge ship that controls the federation droids. So it never was trying to be its own thing and always was just a sort of Chinese knock off toy of the action figures you're used to.
Old 12-28-15, 11:01 PM
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Re: Star Wars: The Force Awakens (Abrams, 2015) — The Reviews Thread

Originally Posted by Why So Blu?
The original trilogy had better everything. Better writing and directing. Crystal Skull had none of that. Hey, that's your thing, so go for it.
You again missed the point. That the first4 three films had as equally absurd shit like the fridge nuke that he survived. Regardless of writing, folks were able to check their brains at the door in using a raft as a parachute in Temple, in a mysterious ark turning people into candles in Raiders and crashing a plane through a tunnel.

Or maybe you just ignored all that with the heavy mouth breathing?
Old 12-28-15, 11:03 PM
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Re: Star Wars: The Force Awakens (Abrams, 2015) — The Reviews Thread

Originally Posted by Jackskeleton
You again missed the point. That the first4 three films had as equally absurd shit like the fridge nuke that he survived. Regardless of writing, folks were able to check their brains at the door in using a raft as a parachute in Temple, in a mysterious ark turning people into candles in Raiders and crashing a plane through a tunnel.

Or maybe you just ignored all that with the heavy mouth breathing?
The first three presented the ridiculous in a more visually grounded manner, in Crystal Skull everything came off as painfully cartoony.

The nuking of the fridge never bothered me that much though, the rest of the movie just seemed really disjointed. It also doesn't help that most of the scenes look like they were shot on massive, empty sound stages.
Old 12-29-15, 02:04 AM
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Re: Star Wars: The Force Awakens (Abrams, 2015) — The Reviews Thread

It was basically taking Indiana Jones and putting him into a 50's Pulp comic, which is the biggest problem with the film. It's like putting a Cowboy into a 80's action film.

But to say that they underused a character simply because they didn't just go full tilt with them... Perhaps Episode 1 would have been a better film if they didn't go full tilt with Darth Maul just yet and saved him for the second one. Essentially since all of those Sith were supposed to be some sort of aspect of Vader. Dooku being the elegant gentlemen and Grievous was suppose to be the more machine than "man"

You don't have to go full showing off what you got and it's better this way, as others have said, showing less implies more.
Old 12-29-15, 07:12 AM
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Re: Star Wars: The Force Awakens (Abrams, 2015) — The Reviews Thread

Originally Posted by Jackskeleton
Ugh, Mouth breathers and basement dwellers still complaining about a fridge surviving a nuclear blast when in the past films a man gets his still beating heart pulled out of his chest, also father survives a bullet wound by pouring religious water given by a man a few hundred years old.... but nah, dawg. MY DISBELIEF IS RUINED WHEN INDIANA JONES DOESN'T BECOME A SHADOW ON THE GROUND.

Stop hyping characters up in your mind. It's like saying that storm troopers with red shoulder pads shouldn't miss because they have red shoulder pads! Clearly they were underdeveloped as they looked different!

Pardon my mouth breathing, but the things you're talking about in the earlier films had supernatural elements to them, while a fridge in New Mexico does not.

It's not like every moment in Indiana Jones is supernatural. When he opened the fridge, his face also wasn't melted off by ancient ghosts, despite the opening of a similar sized box doing exactly that in an earlier film.

Last edited by majorjoe23; 12-29-15 at 07:41 AM.
Old 12-29-15, 07:38 AM
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Re: Star Wars: The Force Awakens (Abrams, 2015) — The Reviews Thread

That was a supernatural raft in Temple of Doom?
Old 12-29-15, 07:41 AM
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Re: Star Wars: The Force Awakens (Abrams, 2015) — The Reviews Thread

Originally Posted by Brack
That was a supernatural raft in Temple of Doom?
Oops, I quoted the wrong ridiculous post.
Old 12-29-15, 07:45 AM
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Re: Star Wars: The Force Awakens (Abrams, 2015) — The Reviews Thread

Originally Posted by ntnon
1. TPM is about a boy being told he must leave his home.

Yippee!
Old 12-29-15, 07:51 AM
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Re: Star Wars: The Force Awakens (Abrams, 2015) — The Reviews Thread

I finally saw TFA yesterday. I was blown away. It was even better than I had hoped. STAR WARS is back! I don't care how "derivative" it was of the OT, it was terrific. It felt "real", whereas the prequels (which I actually like) felt surreal. Including Fisher and Ford (and, to a much lesser extent, Hamill) really made the film, IMO. It would not have been nearly as good without them. However, they did a great job introducing the new characters so that they can carry the story going forward.

Also - I was pleasantly surprised at the "internet people" here, on FaceBook and elsewhere for not posting spoilers. I normally don't mind spoilers, but I wanted to see this the way I saw the ANH back in 1977, with no idea what was going to happen. That's hard to do these days.

Finally - kudos to JJ Abrams and Disney for releasing great trailers that did not give away the story.

Last edited by Bandoman; 12-29-15 at 08:05 AM.
Old 12-29-15, 08:03 AM
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Re: Star Wars: The Force Awakens (Abrams, 2015) — The Reviews Thread

Originally Posted by zero
Great film, can't wait to see where it goes from here.
And this is why it's a success. We're all hooked again. Lots of speculation about where Rey really comes from, about what Luke was really up to. What will be Kylo Ren's next move? What new surprises await? After The Phantom Menace, the rest of the story was pretty much obvious. Sure, there were a few twists, but nothing worthwhile. This movie has people looking forward to the next two.
Old 12-29-15, 08:30 AM
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Re: Star Wars: The Force Awakens (Abrams, 2015) — The Reviews Thread

Originally Posted by Bandoman
I finally saw TFA yesterday. I was blown away. It was even better than I had hoped. STAR WARS is back! I don't care how "derivative" it was of the OT, it was terrific. It felt "real", whereas the prequels (which I actually like) felt surreal. Including Fisher and Ford (and, to a much lesser extent, Hamill) really made the film, IMO. It would not have been nearly as good without them. However, they did a great job introducing the new characters so that they can carry the story going forward.

Also - I was pleasantly surprised at the "internet people" here, on FaceBook and elsewhere for not posting spoilers. I normally don't mind spoilers, but I wanted to see this the way I saw the ANH back in 1977, with no idea what was going to happen. That's hard to do these days.

Finally - kudos to JJ Abrams and Disney for releasing great trailers that did not give away the story.
...I'm guessing you didn't enter the Reviews thread much before you saw it cuz by now we're not hiding anything. We're just discussing wtf was in the film.
Old 12-29-15, 09:14 AM
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Re: Star Wars: The Force Awakens (Abrams, 2015) — The Reviews Thread

I'm actually surprised at the lack of spoilers i've seen on my Facebook or other random articles online. Usually a headline or two would have spoiled something by now but even a week later it's been pretty good.
Old 12-29-15, 09:15 AM
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Re: Star Wars: The Force Awakens (Abrams, 2015) — The Reviews Thread

Originally Posted by ntnon
How about:
"I just find it bothersome that some have acted as though the prequel films are too different to the Original Trilogy and don't give them credit for being their own thing with elements of familiarity."

?
No. The prequels weren't just going for something different that some people subjectively didn't like. They were straight up bad films and that's a hugely important distinction. Whatever tone they were going for, it didn't work. It was completely uneven. There was no chemistry between the actors. The world they tried to create felt artificial and inconsistent. That's not "trying to be their own thing" - that's failing at whatever they were trying to do.
Old 12-29-15, 09:40 AM
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Re: Star Wars: The Force Awakens (Abrams, 2015) — The Reviews Thread

Originally Posted by Solid Snake
...I'm guessing you didn't enter the Reviews thread much before you saw it cuz by now we're not hiding anything. We're just discussing wtf was in the film.
I avoided this thread, since I knew it contained spoilers.
Old 12-29-15, 09:43 AM
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Re: Star Wars: The Force Awakens (Abrams, 2015) — The Reviews Thread

Originally Posted by Mabuse
Regarding Kylo Ren, I posted this earlier:
Kylo Renn is like a costumed comi-con fanboy. He idolizes Darth Vader (my 8 year old daughter aptly observed that he "prays" to Vader). He isn't wearing the mask for a reason, like Vader did. He's wearing it because he idolizes Vader . He wants to be Vader.
Here's a potential problem - where would he have HEARD about Vader..? Fair enough, history books would tell of the black suited villain who killed people and fought the rebels. But... his mother and teacher would surely tell of their father who redeemed himself at the end of his life and toppled the Emperor. Even history would surely record that Vader was seduced to the Dark Side and/or turned villain because of extreme hardship in his lofe, but a) WAS DEFEATED and b) SWITCHED SIDES BEFORE HE DIED.

Who idolizes a villain who failed AND changed sides?
Old 12-29-15, 09:44 AM
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Re: Star Wars: The Force Awakens (Abrams, 2015) — The Reviews Thread

Originally Posted by ntnon
Here's a potential problem - where would he have HEARD about Vader..? Fair enough, history books would tell of the black suited villain who killed people and fought the rebels. But... his mother and teacher would surely tell of their father who redeemed himself at the end of his life and toppled the Emperor. Even history would surely record that Vader was seduced to the Dark Side and/or turned villain because of extreme hardship in his lofe, but a) WAS DEFEATED and b) SWITCHED SIDES BEFORE HE DIED.

Who idolizes a villain who failed AND changed sides?
I'm guessing that's where Snoke comes in. We don't yet know anything about how or why Kylo Ren turned to the Dark Side.

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