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Old 09-07-17, 01:10 PM   #251
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re: Star Wars: Episode IX (12/20/19, W/D: J.J. Abrams)

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Originally Posted by Shannon Nutt View Post
Kennedy should hire Frank Marshall to direct one of these, so she can fire him too.
People shouldn't forget that connection. That is definitely one reason why Trevorrow got the job to begin with, having worked with Marshall on JW... and the sequel. Akward.
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Old 09-07-17, 02:50 PM   #252
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re: Star Wars: Episode IX (12/20/19, W/D: J.J. Abrams)

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Originally Posted by Jay G. View Post
I don't. They fast-tracked the development of these, and even if they had a rough outline of where they expected it to go, it was bound to change as they hired directors and hammered out scripts.
I think that is the point of this story, though.

The notion that there is no overall outline for the story is kind of laughable. There is an outline, and the likelihood is that Trevorrow wanted to take more "artistic license" with that outline than Kennedy felt was appropriate. Some changes are to be expected (as you mentioned) but others, such as changing the ending or major character arcs, would probably be deemed unacceptable.
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Old 09-07-17, 02:59 PM   #253
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re: Star Wars: Episode IX (12/20/19, W/D: J.J. Abrams)

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Originally Posted by milo bloom View Post
Rogue One has altered the feel of the saga for me in a major way. Spoilers obviously, but the fact that we see a Total Party Kill, when all through the rest of the saga our heroes were all protected by plot armor helped drive home the idea that the Rebellion was a much bigger movement than we saw in the OT.
I am 110% with you Milo. While Rogue One was not a perfect movie, it has changed the way I view the series. One could even forgo ESB and ROTJ and view Rogue One and Star Wars as one story. Please don't misinterpret me -- I love ESB and ROTJ. However the Lucas prequels and the continual notion that EVERYTHING must be Skywalker related really diminishes my overall view. Rogue One offered a reframing of the universe that I had long wanted.
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Old 09-07-17, 04:17 PM   #254
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re: Star Wars: Episode IX (12/20/19, W/D: J.J. Abrams)

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Originally Posted by milo bloom View Post
Rogue One has altered the feel of the saga for me in a major way. Spoilers obviously, but the fact that we see a Total Party Kill, when all through the rest of the saga our heroes were all protected by plot armor helped drive home the idea that the Rebellion was a much bigger movement than we saw in the OT.
Really? I saw the "total party kill" as also plot-dictated, since none of the characters are mentioned in the OT outside of Vader saying Rebel spies beamed a transmission to Leia's ship.

It failed to do what a good prequel should do: Recontextualize either the events or characters of the story we already know. I mean, Star Wars opens with Stormtroopers shooting the fuck out of some rebels, and Vader choking a dude, so the idea that the rebels don't suffer casualties isn't new to Rogue One.
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Old 09-07-17, 04:43 PM   #255
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re: Star Wars: Episode IX (12/20/19, W/D: J.J. Abrams)

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Originally Posted by Supermallet View Post
It failed to do what a good prequel should do: Recontextualize either the events or characters of the story we already know.
We did get an explanation of why the Death Star had such an easily preventable weakness.
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Old 09-07-17, 04:53 PM   #256
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re: Star Wars: Episode IX (12/20/19, W/D: J.J. Abrams)

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I am 110% with you Milo. While Rogue One was not a perfect movie, it has changed the way I view the series. One could even forgo ESB and ROTJ and view Rogue One and Star Wars as one story. Please don't misinterpret me -- I love ESB and ROTJ. However the Lucas prequels and the continual notion that EVERYTHING must be Skywalker related really diminishes my overall view. Rogue One offered a reframing of the universe that I had long wanted.
Great points, I really like the idea of R1 and ANH forming it's own "mini-saga". It was everything we wanted the prequels to be, a revisit to that amazing galaxy, showing how everything went to heck in a handbasket.

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Originally Posted by Supermallet View Post
Really? I saw the "total party kill" as also plot-dictated, since none of the characters are mentioned in the OT outside of Vader saying Rebel spies beamed a transmission to Leia's ship.

It failed to do what a good prequel should do: Recontextualize either the events or characters of the story we already know. I mean, Star Wars opens with Stormtroopers shooting the fuck out of some rebels, and Vader choking a dude, so the idea that the rebels don't suffer casualties isn't new to Rogue One.

I think it's important to realize the total party kill wasn't always part of the story, some of them were meant to live until Disney okayed the slaughter*. Having some of them live would have been fine too as they could have existed offscreen in the books and comics like many other characters.

And yes we see cannon fodder troops die, but to see our heroes die? All of them?


And as majorjoe said, the Death Star weakness was a nice addition to the story.


*wow, phrasing, boom
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Old 09-07-17, 08:48 PM   #257
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re: Star Wars: Episode IX (12/20/19, W/D: J.J. Abrams)

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Originally Posted by milo bloom View Post

And yes we see cannon fodder troops die, but to see our heroes die? All of them?
You say "our heroes" but is the film able to make us care about them, even a little bit, before they die? The one where I came the closest was the droid. I consider that a huge failure on the part of the filmmakers.
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Old 09-08-17, 08:31 AM   #258
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re: Star Wars: Episode IX (12/20/19, W/D: J.J. Abrams)

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You say "our heroes" but is the film able to make us care about them, even a little bit, before they die? The one where I came the closest was the droid. I consider that a huge failure on the part of the filmmakers.


I really, really dug R1. I did like the characters - more so after viewing for the 3rd time.... and K2S0 was hands down the best comedy relief we've had in this series since maybe Han in the first movie?


One thing is certain with Kennedy, she knows what she wants and she's clearly in charge -- pass or fail, it's on her shoulders. The series will always blow up the box office but that'll never be enough.
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Old 09-08-17, 09:57 AM   #259
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re: Star Wars: Episode IX (12/20/19, W/D: J.J. Abrams)

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One thing is certain with Kennedy, she knows what she wants and she's clearly in charge -- pass or fail, it's on her shoulders. The series will always blow up the box office but that'll never be enough.
And that's the key. She has the same level of control that Lucas had before the Disney sale, but I have more confidence in her judgment now (based on TFA and R1) than in Lucas's judgment later in his career.
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Old 09-08-17, 02:57 PM   #260
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re: Star Wars: Episode IX (12/20/19, W/D: J.J. Abrams)

Making a whole movie to explain why the Death Star had a preventable weakness is pretty lame, and I agree with Obi-Wan Jabroni that I never cared about any of the new characters, so it didn’t matter to they all died.
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Old 09-08-17, 03:56 PM   #261
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re: Star Wars: Episode IX (12/20/19, W/D: J.J. Abrams)

The article is long but I've posted the more interesting parts:

Quote:
But to hear speculation from a ranking Hollywood movie insider with direct knowledge of the productions on both The Book of Henry and Jurassic World (and who requested anonymity out of concern for sensitive ongoing business relationships), Trevorrow’s firing may have come more directly as a consequence of being “difficult.”

“During the making of Jurassic World, he focused a great deal of his creative energies on asserting his opinion,” the executive explains. “But because he had been personally hired by Spielberg, nobody could say, ‘You’re fired.’ Once that film went through the roof and he chose to do Henry, [Trevorrow] was unbearable. He had an egotistical point of view— and he was always asserting that.”

Then, during preproduction on Episode IX, Trevorrow’s relationship with Lucasfilm top brass became reportedly “unmanageable” over the course of “repeated stabs at multiple drafts” of the script.

“When the reviews for Book of Henry came out, there was immediately conjecture that Kathy was going to dump him because they weren’t thrilled with working with him anyway,” the executive continues. “He’s a difficult guy. He’s really, really, really confident. Let’s call it that.”
http://www.vulture.com/2017/09/star-...planation.html
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Old 09-08-17, 04:10 PM   #262
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re: Star Wars: Episode IX (12/20/19, W/D: J.J. Abrams)

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Originally Posted by Obi-Wan Jabroni View Post
You say "our heroes" but is the film able to make us care about them, even a little bit, before they die? The one where I came the closest was the droid. I consider that a huge failure on the part of the filmmakers.
I think Rogue One was about the story more than the characters in some ways. The characters are likable enough but ultimately the whole film was essentially them on a suicide mission. In my opinion it was still pretty ballsy of Disney to be okay with that and not water it down in some way.
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Old 09-08-17, 04:19 PM   #263
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re: Star Wars: Episode IX (12/20/19, W/D: J.J. Abrams)

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I'm kind of cynical. I think she opted for up and coming directors because she knows that most of them love Star Wars from when they were kids and would be easier to control. The fact that Han Solo went to Ron Howard tells me she really wants safe and predictable and was hoping she could get that more cheaply by going with lesser known names, but it hasn't worked out for her.
Cynical but also the truth. These up-and-coming directors are cheap and controllable and all of them are willing to direct these movies. Just dangling the "Star Wars" carrot to a guy who grew up idolizing the OT must be irresistable.

Picking someone like Ron Howard as an emergency replacement was a desperation move. Kennedy knew the project was fucked, as most of the filming was already done. She had to salvage it fast, so she picked the safest, most dependable director out there. Howard is well known as one of the nicest guys in Hollywood. He makes movies on time, on budget, and without controversy. Yes, he is criticized for being a safe director who stays between the lines, but that is exactly what she was looking for.

By all accounts, she's lucked out with Rian Johnson, a cheap-to-pay director who seems to be doing everything she wants.

Don't really feel too much sympathy for Colin Trevorrow. I'm tired of these white directors who make one semi-successful indie, then get vaulted into making blockbusters, while countless minority filmmakers toil in obscurity fighting tooth-and-nail to get crumbs.
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Old 09-08-17, 08:37 PM   #264
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re: Star Wars: Episode IX (12/20/19, W/D: J.J. Abrams)

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Originally Posted by TheMovieman View Post
The article is long but I've posted the more interesting parts:



http://www.vulture.com/2017/09/star-...planation.html
Interesting article. I watched a few interviews with him during TBoH press tour and he definitely came off as pretentious.
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Old 09-08-17, 08:41 PM   #265
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re: Star Wars: Episode IX (12/20/19, W/D: J.J. Abrams)

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I think Rogue One was about the story more than the characters in some ways. The characters are likable enough but ultimately the whole film was essentially them on a suicide mission. In my opinion it was still pretty ballsy of Disney to be okay with that and not water it down in some way.
Rogue One... the Dunkirk of the Star Wars universe. Let THAT one sink in.
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Old 09-08-17, 08:42 PM   #266
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re: Star Wars: Episode IX (12/20/19, W/D: J.J. Abrams)

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Originally Posted by Mike86 View Post
I think Rogue One was about the story more than the characters in some ways. The characters are likable enough but ultimately the whole film was essentially them on a suicide mission. In my opinion it was still pretty ballsy of Disney to be okay with that and not water it down in some way.
I'm not saying Rogue One should have had Seven Samurai level characterization, but writing compelling characters is essential to the success of a team-up movie. If anything, the suicide mission aspect of the movie makes the characterization even more important to the success of the movie. The template has been there since 1954 and the writers of Rogue One simply failed.
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Old 09-11-17, 12:51 PM   #267
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re: Star Wars: Episode IX (12/20/19, W/D: J.J. Abrams)

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I'm not saying Rogue One should have had Seven Samurai level characterization, but writing compelling characters is essential to the success of a team-up movie. If anything, the suicide mission aspect of the movie makes the characterization even more important to the success of the movie. The template has been there since 1954 and the writers of Rogue One simply failed.
Agreed!
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Old 09-11-17, 01:10 PM   #268
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re: Star Wars: Episode IX (12/20/19, W/D: J.J. Abrams)

Come on, now. How could you not like Jyn, K2SO, pilot dude, fake force chanter-dude, machine gun man, and robot Forest Whittaker?
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Old 09-11-17, 01:53 PM   #269
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re: Star Wars: Episode IX (12/20/19, W/D: J.J. Abrams)

Doesn't seem like Johnson will be doing it... at 2:25 in the video.

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Old 09-11-17, 01:55 PM   #270
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re: Star Wars: Episode IX (12/20/19, W/D: J.J. Abrams)

I liked Rogue One but Jyn and K2SO are the only two main good characters I could understand clearly without putting a lot of effort into hearing them. Everyone else's accent was too thick. I could understand friggin' Vader better than most of them.
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Old 09-11-17, 03:09 PM   #271
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re: Star Wars: Episode IX (12/20/19, W/D: J.J. Abrams)

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Don't really feel too much sympathy for Colin Trevorrow. I'm tired of these white directors who make one semi-successful indie, then get vaulted into making blockbusters, while countless minority filmmakers toil in obscurity fighting tooth-and-nail to get crumbs.
In Trevorrow's defense, he made Jurassic Park... not critically acclaimed but made a shit-ton of money... and that's what Lucas probably based their decision on. I highly doubt race played a role in his hiring.
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Old 09-11-17, 03:11 PM   #272
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re: Star Wars: Episode IX (12/20/19, W/D: J.J. Abrams)

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Originally Posted by Michael Corvin View Post
Come on, now. How could you not like Jyn, K2SO, pilot dude, fake force chanter-dude, machine gun man, and robot Forest Whittaker?
Dude, they all had names:

Jyn, K2S0, Frenchie or Spanish Guy, Donnie Yen, Machine Gun Man (ok, you got me there) and misplaced Forest Whittaker (got me there too).
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Old 09-11-17, 06:36 PM   #273
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re: Star Wars: Episode IX (12/20/19, W/D: J.J. Abrams)

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In Trevorrow's defense, he made Jurassic Park... not critically acclaimed but made a shit-ton of money... and that's what Lucas probably based their decision on. I highly doubt race played a role in his hiring.
No, I meant getting him getting chosen to direct Jurassic World in the first place, based off a paper-thin filmography.

It's not directly about race, but it's about the Old Boys Club that is so prevalent in Hollywood. Steven Spielberg watches some rando indie, likes what he sees, meets with the director, and realizes "Hey, this dude reminds me of me when I was that age!" and before you know it, the dude is quickly elevated up the ranks.
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Old 09-12-17, 10:37 AM   #274
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re: Star Wars: Episode IX (12/20/19, W/D: J.J. Abrams)

J.J. Abrams to Replace Colin Trevorrow as Director of ‘Star Wars: Episode IX’
http://variety.com/2017/film/news/j-...ow-1202548094/

Quote:
J.J. Abrams, who launched a new era of Star Wars with The Force Awakens in 2015, is returning to complete the sequel trilogy as writer and director of Star Wars: Episode IX. Abrams will co-write the film with Chris Terrio. Star Wars: Episode IX will be produced by Kathleen Kennedy, Michelle Rejwan, Abrams, Bad Robot, and Lucasfilm.

“With The Force Awakens, J.J. delivered everything we could have possibly hoped for, and I am so excited that he is coming back to close out this trilogy,” said Lucasfilm President Kathleen Kennedy.
http://www.starwars.com/news/j-j-abr...c%7C1069686789
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Old 09-12-17, 10:37 AM   #275
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re: Star Wars: Episode IX (12/20/19, W/D: J.J. Abrams)

He's Back!

J.J. Abrams to write and direct Star Wars: Episode IX.
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